Israel in coordinated missile attacks on Gaza
- Thread starter Fez909
- Start date
frogwoman
No amount of cajolery...
you're relying on the idf to give you information about, erm, itself?
OK fair point but I was disappointed to see him in the paper the other week lining up with the usual 'hate Israel' crowd at some demo somewhere or other.
Bearing in mind the nature of the images I don't see how they could come from any source other than the IDF very few journalistic UAVs in existence. Personally putting up IDF info is no different from some of the pro hamas stuff that has been circulated without criticism on here and elsewhere.
Many of these 'mosques' and 'parliament buildings' are being used to store ordnance by Hamas. If you see the images on the IDF You Tube site of the 'mosque' attack you will see that there are considerable secondary explosions of a magnitude far greater than could be expected from say a gas bottle explosion for instance.
frogwoman
No amount of cajolery...
If it's no different then why do you put it up, given how much you dislike the pro hamas stuff?
Are you a military expert? Perhpas the dropped several bombs? Could you tell the difference?
We had similar images fed to us in the run up to the Iraq invasion. When the commentator has to tell you what you are seeing then the images are not really evidence are they.
I hope the Left, STWC, etc, comdemns that slogan, about 'jews to the oven', FFs, if the far right shouted that on a demo there would quite rightly be uproar,
http://www.hurryupharry.org/
double standards?
http://www.hurryupharry.org/
double standards?
Its an alternative pov and one which is getting drowned out by the pro hamas stuff. Personally I think that info from a democratic country (Israel) can be more reliable than info supplied by a fascistic nut job organisation (Hamas).
I see your point but it did look as if there ws only one missle and the larger explosion looked like it was more uncontrolled like it was from a store of explosives and followed very quickly afterwards. Of course there is the danger that a two bomb attack could be passed off as a one bomb attack but in this case I'll give the IAF the benefit of the doubt until proved otherwise.
Personally I'd trust the Israelis far more than info coming out of Hamas.
frogwoman
No amount of cajolery...
Out of interest what is you definition of "pro hamas stuff"?
All the 'the Israelis are deliberately committing genocide on the Pals' sort of stories that are coming out. The unquestioning use of hamas supplied bodycounts things like that.
I do recognise that both sides are running a media war as well as a real one but the big difference is you can safely challenge in public for example in a court information put out by the Israelis, doing the same with Hamas or attempting to do the same would just end up with the person getting their head chopped off.
frogwoman
No amount of cajolery...
I'd rather trust a leader awarded an MBE from the queen who has been democratically elected several times than a western backed group whose leadership have been in prison and have associated themselves with very dodgy bedfellows in the past.
yep, i'll believe robert mugabe over the MDC until shown otherwise
frogwoman
No amount of cajolery...
i agree that the use of the word genocide is a little bit off ...
... but only a little bit.
Of course such slogans should be condemned.
I don't see any reason to trust one over the other.
Jeff Robinson
Marxist-Lentilist: Jackboots and Jackfruit
So some fucking moron on a demonstration in Florida shouts some shit and it's the job of everybody in the whole world who supports Palestinian rights has to denounce it or be guilty by association? Are you fucking serious?
frogwoman
No amount of cajolery...
What do you mean by "democracy" in the context of Israel?
JR its a lot deeper than that. Much of the 'antizionist' left is infested with antisemites and apologists for antisemitism. A few years back I was disgusted to hear on an 'anti war' demo a group of wankstains chanting 'Palestine you'll be free from the Jordan to the sea' The fact that none of the lefts around me thought this was unusual or wrong made me realise just how shallow the lefts committment to equality and fair play are when Jews or Israel are involved.
Israel is a democracy whereas Hamas and similar groups are theocracies. I certainly know what sort of regime I trust more.
Fancy having your local evangelical church call the shots on your life I know I wouldn't but for the average Palestinian what Hamas do is much much worse.
Israeli democracy like all democracies is not perfect but a darn sight better than living under the cosh of Hamas and similar groups.
frogwoman
No amount of cajolery...
What makes Israel a democracy?
People can vote to change govts, there is freedom of expression and freedom of thought, there is a market economy, there is a free press and freedom of religion. None of these would be possible under a Hamas govt.
ViolentPanda
Hardly getting over it.
When did you become an expert on explosions?
I've seen an entire Victorian brick warehouse be brought to rubble by the detonation of half a dozen 30lb propane bottles, just to give you an idea of what they can do when someone knocks the regulator off a bottle and the gas catches. What you're talking about here is even more powerful, because the gas doesn't burn as it leaks, it ignites instantaneously due to the missile's payload detonating. Just have a think about the blast wave that would be generated by half a dozen bottles simultaneously igniting, and the radius the blast would have.
By the way, before you say "but it might not have been gas etc...", bear in mind that much gas and liquid fuel has to be smuggled into Gaza because of blockade, and it gets stored wherever there's room, including the mosques.
Oh, and I suspect that weapons experts will be perusing the footage, as many explosions have distinct characteristics.
Jeff Robinson
Marxist-Lentilist: Jackboots and Jackfruit
Yep, it's also a cloak used to dishonestly beat Palestinian rights supporters with - to label them anti-semites etc. Also serves a distraction device to divert attention away from the on-going Israeli atrocities in Gaza. Doesn't work on me.
frogwoman
No amount of cajolery...
What would happen if Scotland was about to become independent and David Miliband stood up in parliament and said that Scottish people living in Britain would have to accept that their home was in Scotland and not here?
Would you still say that that was a democracy?
Or if there was a charity owned by the Church of England that owned most of the land in the country and if you wanted a house or to buy land you had to accept Jesus as your lord and saviour, and if you didn't you were at risk of having your house confiscated and turned into some sort of whackjob Christian theme park?
Would you still say that that was a democracy?
Or if there was a charity owned by the Church of England that owned most of the land in the country and if you wanted a house or to buy land you had to accept Jesus as your lord and saviour, and if you didn't you were at risk of having your house confiscated and turned into some sort of whackjob Christian theme park?
Dimitris
Well-Known Member
Just because you have an electoral system does not mean that this is "democracy"... This is a delusion of democracy, especially when all your candidates and presidents up to now are either former military officials, or have all a specific (nationalist zionist) political agenda related to this issue. Your state's action against pacifist groups and anyone having a different political agenda is not democratic either.
Also none "democracy" would ramm a ship with humanitarian aid in international waters
Also none "democracy" would ramm a ship with humanitarian aid in international waters
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