Treacle Toes
Time
I think you meant to post the opposite of this.
What you've posted describes people joyfully enjoying the 2 metre rule in full on festival dress and party mode.
Flouting Is the word you are looking for.
Government floats bonkers idea of loosening lockdown in groups of ten people
- Thread starter bimble
- Start date
What you've posted describes people joyfully enjoying the 2 metre rule in full on festival dress and party mode.
Flouting Is the word you are looking for.
Epona
Sonic: 1 Nov 2006 - 8 Jan 2022
From my own perspective as someone becoming increasingly depressed and anxious, I do wish they would start saying something about how lockdown might be eased, even if it is talking 3 months from now or 6 months from now - the uncertainty is something I find very difficult to deal with.
There are the needs of lots of people that need to be balanced - forget about the economy for a moment - emotional and developmental needs of children has already been mentioned, there is also the need of a large number of people with mental health issues or who are struggling right now. Despite my issues (autism, depression, anxiety, OCD), I have never considered myself likely to consider suicide. I am not considering it now, but I was talking with the husband yesterday about how awful it must be for people with MH issues who are alone and who don't have pets to look after to keep them going on getting out of bed every day. I broke down crying while I was talking about it, because if I was by myself and without the cats I know I would need something to stop me killing myself, I do not want to live like this. I will not if it is going to go on a long time with nothing more than slogans from the government.
There are the needs of lots of people that need to be balanced - forget about the economy for a moment - emotional and developmental needs of children has already been mentioned, there is also the need of a large number of people with mental health issues or who are struggling right now. Despite my issues (autism, depression, anxiety, OCD), I have never considered myself likely to consider suicide. I am not considering it now, but I was talking with the husband yesterday about how awful it must be for people with MH issues who are alone and who don't have pets to look after to keep them going on getting out of bed every day. I broke down crying while I was talking about it, because if I was by myself and without the cats I know I would need something to stop me killing myself, I do not want to live like this. I will not if it is going to go on a long time with nothing more than slogans from the government.
xes
F.O.A.D
Well if I want trophy off of the grand old duke of York, I'll have to start somewhere!
SpookyFrank
A cheap source of teeth for aquarium gravel
And when one of the the 17,000 thousand things they said would happen actually happens they'll act like they knew all along, and never mind the 16,999 things that turned out to be total bollocks.
where was that?
chilango
Hypothetical Wanker
Telegraph, some ITV journo, Spiked, etc.
SpookyFrank
A cheap source of teeth for aquarium gravel
You're not alone in that. I'm sure there are plenty of psychologists already licking their pencils and pondering the introductions to their bestselling books about the new and exiciting kind of trauma they've discovered. In reality it's not new at all, and the effects of this kind of ongoing, continual pressure and powerlessness are well known. The fact this is barely mentioned by the government or media, and we hear instead the possibility of easing lockdown for the sake of the economy doesn't help IMO. It was 'protecting the economy' that got us to this parlous state in the first place. And now surprise surprise those nations that prioritised protecting people instead are starting to head back towards normality, while we're stranded in both economic and social purgatory.
Epona
Sonic: 1 Nov 2006 - 8 Jan 2022
The thing is, I am fully aware that the virus is still around. I am fully aware that it will still kill people. I am also fully aware that continuing on like this without a tangible plan will kill people - maybe in different ways - ill health through sitting at home such as increasing rates of obesity, DVT from sitting still too long, poor diet, not seeking medical help due to acute health issues, domestic violence, or not getting the usual help for chronic health issues, poverty through not being able to work, heatstroke from being indoors in a flat at high temperature for hours at a time, or suicide. It isn't enough to say we all need to stay home indefinitely to protect the most vulnerable in our society. There are a whole load of people who are vulnerable but not necessarily because they will get a worse dose of the Rona than most, but because of the measures to protect people from the virus.
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There are 24/7 helplines being set up throughout England for MH support during the coronavirus, so there has been a public health response to this.
I was probably feeling a little defensive. I've actually enjoyed more of a feeling of community on our estate the past few weeks, and I don't like to think badly of our neighbours, they're very good neighbours in other ways.
Epona
Sonic: 1 Nov 2006 - 8 Jan 2022
Oh good, I can phone someone, that has never existed before and will surely fix anything. If you can see a need for your kids to see both parents, you must be aware of challenges that other people face during this that a helpline cannot fix.
EDIT: Sorry, I just saw your next post - I think we are all feeling a little or a lot defensive - we're all stuck in pretty much the same shitty boat right now, wish you all the best.
I was simply saying there'd been some acknowledgement from government about the psychological pressures.
And yes, it's extremely difficult for everyone. I wish you all the best too.
SheilaNaGig
Break requested
Oh god it will be even worse than always being picked last for team sports in PE lessons when I was a kid
Fuck em. Come down behind the wall and hang out with the unpopular interesting kids.
SheilaNaGig
Break requested
Innit...
Innit
Yep. innit.
innit
innit...
Innit!
Yarse... innit.
Is it...?
This shit is pissing me off, the assumption stuff. Not you, them. The burden of care falls on me/you to consider and weigh up the is it isn't it a risk.
(I ended up crying in Tesco this afternoon because apparently I was the only human being in the place who cares / is vulnerable )
... innnottitt...etc
innit. And I suppose people are thinking "If I've not got it by now I aint gonna and the lockdown has protected me so Im safe". Pragmatic assessment is goomg to be a primary and crucial aspect of whatever happens next. And for the foreseeable future too.
Btw where the fuck is @butcherapron right now?
innit...
Even as a single person living alone the parameters of all this are shock and lazy as hell.
A friend has just (yesterday) been diagnosed with terminal cancer. No idea they had cancer, had tests, was kept in, told they have weeks to live. They know more than 10 people, who each know more than 10 people , most of whom know her too if only by reputation. So who are her ten people? Who are my ten people.
It's nonsense, derived from the notion that there is no such thing as society,
Ha! Innit tho!
Reports and warnings from Italy
Italy convinced people to stay home. Now it needs to help them cope
The lockdown is taking its toll on the country's mental health.
qz.com
Mental health in lockdown – DW – 03/31/2020
The COVID-19 outbreak has been wearing down Italians, who have lived under a strict lockdown since March 9. How bad the psychological consequences are depends on how long the crisis lasts. But there is help.
www.dw.com
There's going to be a whirlwind wake of emotional PTSD stuff following for this for everyone everywhere.
Brace! brace! brace! etc.
SheilaNaGig
Break requested
/too much rum]
Saul Goodman
It's all good, man
Innit
Epona
Sonic: 1 Nov 2006 - 8 Jan 2022
Also I've been saying all along, Coronaviruses don't tend to result in longterm immunity - WHO confirmed that again yesterday that there is evidence that people who got it once can get it again.
I don't think we should be expecting a situation where if you had it you become immune, or that a vaccine has a high % success rate. One thing that has been in my mind a lot lately is that there is a feline coronavirus (FCoV) which has been around for decades and seems to be somewhat similar to this in the way it attacks the body in certain vulnerable cats - cats have a fair amount of similarity with humans in the types of viruses and other diseases that spread within feline populations (FIV, FSE etc) - there has never been an effective vaccine or treatment for FCoV and it is endemic in the cat population, apparently healthy looking cats shed it in various bodily fluids and faecal matter for long periods of time, what happens is for most it causes a very minor illness or is asymptomatic but when they are old or at low ebb or have a comorbid condition it pops up and kills them - either from pneumonia or damage to gastric tissues or neurological issues - and there has never been an effective vaccine made for that - the drug companies would love to come up with one, that is better money for them! My Radar had cancer, but what it said on his insurance claim as the disease he was admitted to the vet hospital with at the end of his life was feline coronavirus related pneumonia. This could be what we live with now, a coronavirus like that of our own with a high transmission rate such that it becomes endemic, no vaccine, no treatment, and picks off those at low ebb, old, or with other health issues.
Sorry, feeling a bit low atm.
EDIT: I want to be absolutely clear, the diseases I am talking about in cats are NOT the same ones we get as humans and cannot be caught from cats- they are similar diseases that cats can suffer from (although NOT transmissable to humans!) and therefore are interesting in academic terms of looking at how they spread and affect the cat population as a whole over a long period of time.
I don't think we should be expecting a situation where if you had it you become immune, or that a vaccine has a high % success rate. One thing that has been in my mind a lot lately is that there is a feline coronavirus (FCoV) which has been around for decades and seems to be somewhat similar to this in the way it attacks the body in certain vulnerable cats - cats have a fair amount of similarity with humans in the types of viruses and other diseases that spread within feline populations (FIV, FSE etc) - there has never been an effective vaccine or treatment for FCoV and it is endemic in the cat population, apparently healthy looking cats shed it in various bodily fluids and faecal matter for long periods of time, what happens is for most it causes a very minor illness or is asymptomatic but when they are old or at low ebb or have a comorbid condition it pops up and kills them - either from pneumonia or damage to gastric tissues or neurological issues - and there has never been an effective vaccine made for that - the drug companies would love to come up with one, that is better money for them! My Radar had cancer, but what it said on his insurance claim as the disease he was admitted to the vet hospital with at the end of his life was feline coronavirus related pneumonia. This could be what we live with now, a coronavirus like that of our own with a high transmission rate such that it becomes endemic, no vaccine, no treatment, and picks off those at low ebb, old, or with other health issues.
Sorry, feeling a bit low atm.
EDIT: I want to be absolutely clear, the diseases I am talking about in cats are NOT the same ones we get as humans and cannot be caught from cats- they are similar diseases that cats can suffer from (although NOT transmissable to humans!) and therefore are interesting in academic terms of looking at how they spread and affect the cat population as a whole over a long period of time.
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quimcunx
imprimeo, lamino, distribuo
I think it is worth remembering that while a small number are being reckless there are some who are taking calculated risks and many more who are still within guidelines just not staying in as much as they had been.
For instance we have all been allowed to take a walk every day for the last month but I didnt. I didn't go for walk at all the first couple of weeks but now I am taking some walks. Multiply that by a few hundred other people within a 5 min walk from mine and the streets start looking very busy and, in comparison, as if the lockdown is failing.
It's similar to the panic buying and hoarding. Mostly people just bought a few more things because they needed to make their own lunch and use their own toilet more etc.
And it is us doing the lockdown, however imperfectly, that has caused the transmission to drop. Its not perfect but we have done it. And we're still mostly doing it. Well done us.
For instance we have all been allowed to take a walk every day for the last month but I didnt. I didn't go for walk at all the first couple of weeks but now I am taking some walks. Multiply that by a few hundred other people within a 5 min walk from mine and the streets start looking very busy and, in comparison, as if the lockdown is failing.
It's similar to the panic buying and hoarding. Mostly people just bought a few more things because they needed to make their own lunch and use their own toilet more etc.
And it is us doing the lockdown, however imperfectly, that has caused the transmission to drop. Its not perfect but we have done it. And we're still mostly doing it. Well done us.
Epona
Sonic: 1 Nov 2006 - 8 Jan 2022
I like your optimism. I really mean that, thank you for providing that perspective.
Doesn't necessarily explain the masses of people out here yesterday, but it still helps a bit.
I've only been going out for shopping occasionally, I am more worried about DVT and depression than I am about the Rona right now!
Aladdin
Well-Known Member
As someone who has 4 underlying medical conditions that put me at a very high risk of dying from this virus...I find the fact that people are beginning to not respect the science and the lockdown absolutely terrifying.
I've been at home since the first week in March. I've not gone to a shop or anywhere. Not even a walk on the path outside the house.
I've been busier than ever what with working from home and reading, gardening a bit, growing veg on the windowsill.
Being at home is not causing any mental health issue for me I think...although I am not sure. The fear of getting the virus is absolutely freaking me out. The fear that politicians might bow to public pressure and that I might have to return to work. The absolute knowledge that there will be no way to control my environment at work is 100% freaking me out. While the government stays strong on social distancing my MH will be ok. But the fear that restrictions will be lifted; the fear of the way this virus will spread is affecting me. The knowledge that vulnerable people will eventually be overlooked and we will die because people find it too hard to just stay home. I saw more people out walking yesterdsy passing the house than I've ever seen before. Its as if the one hour is compulsory. People are going to make decisions that will mean others will die. And the health services will not cope. And our drs and nurses will die. And the people who wanted to go out and about will go back to their old way of life sat in front of a giant tv screen in their joggers playing computer games oblivious to the fact that they contributed to the deaths of others.
We are not being asked to go to war. We are simply being asked to maintain social distance, take exercise and not go to work. I mean that's not torture. We are in the fortunate position of being able to video call loved ones and friends.
I figure that we will have the next wave soon here. It will have a massive effect on areas where people are flouting guidelines. Public health and the government will get the blame but in reality it will be down to ordinary people deciding they're ok so fuck everyone else. I can hear them..
"Fuck the sick and elderly. They've had their chance. We locked down for a month and that's enough so we did our bit now they can do theirs and fuck off and die so we can get our lives back. Why should we lose our lifestyle so these drains on society can have theirs?"
It may well come to that.
I've been at home since the first week in March. I've not gone to a shop or anywhere. Not even a walk on the path outside the house.
I've been busier than ever what with working from home and reading, gardening a bit, growing veg on the windowsill.
Being at home is not causing any mental health issue for me I think...although I am not sure. The fear of getting the virus is absolutely freaking me out. The fear that politicians might bow to public pressure and that I might have to return to work. The absolute knowledge that there will be no way to control my environment at work is 100% freaking me out. While the government stays strong on social distancing my MH will be ok. But the fear that restrictions will be lifted; the fear of the way this virus will spread is affecting me. The knowledge that vulnerable people will eventually be overlooked and we will die because people find it too hard to just stay home. I saw more people out walking yesterdsy passing the house than I've ever seen before. Its as if the one hour is compulsory. People are going to make decisions that will mean others will die. And the health services will not cope. And our drs and nurses will die. And the people who wanted to go out and about will go back to their old way of life sat in front of a giant tv screen in their joggers playing computer games oblivious to the fact that they contributed to the deaths of others.
We are not being asked to go to war. We are simply being asked to maintain social distance, take exercise and not go to work. I mean that's not torture. We are in the fortunate position of being able to video call loved ones and friends.
I figure that we will have the next wave soon here. It will have a massive effect on areas where people are flouting guidelines. Public health and the government will get the blame but in reality it will be down to ordinary people deciding they're ok so fuck everyone else. I can hear them..
"Fuck the sick and elderly. They've had their chance. We locked down for a month and that's enough so we did our bit now they can do theirs and fuck off and die so we can get our lives back. Why should we lose our lifestyle so these drains on society can have theirs?"
It may well come to that.
Epona
Sonic: 1 Nov 2006 - 8 Jan 2022
It is torture for some though - if it weren't for my cats I would kill myself if my life had to go on like this indefinitely with no end in sight. I am having suicidal thoughts for the first time in my life due to this.
Perhaps we need to get to a point where if you want to stay home to protect yourself you can, but I can go out to prevent myself from opening up my wrists.
As I said before, the number of vulnerable people in this are not just those vulnerable to the virus (and everyone I love is in a high risk group, but NONE of us, not a single one, want to spend the next few years like this just in case)
Perhaps we need to get to a point where if you want to stay home to protect yourself you can, but I can go out to prevent myself from opening up my wrists.
As I said before, the number of vulnerable people in this are not just those vulnerable to the virus (and everyone I love is in a high risk group, but NONE of us, not a single one, want to spend the next few years like this just in case)
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FridgeMagnet
Administrator
I sometimes wonder at the number of people I see on the street but then I remember that this is a reasonably dense residential area, and there are a lot of people here, and so the numbers are relatively quite small and as far as I can see in line with the guidelines.
Also that cities just aren't designed for people to live indoors - accommodation just isn't big or well-equipped enough. Cities are designed so that people are able to go out, to parks, pubs, museums, shops etc - even going to work. Even in normal times, areas which have fewer of these facilities have problems, and they figure into deprivation indices.
Also that cities just aren't designed for people to live indoors - accommodation just isn't big or well-equipped enough. Cities are designed so that people are able to go out, to parks, pubs, museums, shops etc - even going to work. Even in normal times, areas which have fewer of these facilities have problems, and they figure into deprivation indices.
platinumsage
HaveMyPassword123
It seems the idea of only socialising only within a group of ten people came from a leaked paper on options for easing the lockdown in Belgium.
This was reported the day before the Mail ran with story that the UK government were considering it:
www.euractiv.com
"In the leaked draft, the experts suggest reopening some shops from 4 May to avoid “unfair competition” from big stores, most of which also sell products other than just basic necessities... They also suggest to loosen social distancing where it is possible and recommend to allow people meet with family or close friends one night a week, in groups of no more than 10 (it has to be the same 10 people only). It is unclear, how this is meant to be controlled."
This was reported the day before the Mail ran with story that the UK government were considering it:
‘Irresponsibly’ leaked paper on Belgian lockdown phase-out sparks criticism
Belgian experts tasked with devising the country's lockdown exit strategy have proposed reopening some shops, partially relaxing some restrictions on gatherings and outdoor activities from 3 May and to resume school from 18 May, according to draft recommendations obtained by Le Soir.
www.euractiv.com
"In the leaked draft, the experts suggest reopening some shops from 4 May to avoid “unfair competition” from big stores, most of which also sell products other than just basic necessities... They also suggest to loosen social distancing where it is possible and recommend to allow people meet with family or close friends one night a week, in groups of no more than 10 (it has to be the same 10 people only). It is unclear, how this is meant to be controlled."
two sheds
Least noticed poster 2007
And particularly with British new build houses being the smallest in Europe. Another downside of the short-term profit ignoring what people actually need.
bimble
floofy
Yep. Didn’t even know where it came from tbh just immediately imagined the comedy nightmare of them actually announcing it as a plan. I think we can safely assume this one won’t make it off the back of the envelope brainstorming session.
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