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Fate of EU citizens in the UK post Brexit

One of the arguments about leaving EU was that we would get to control our borders. Out of EU we could set our own immigration policy without the EU interfering.

This argument does seem to be a cornerstone of brexit.

The EU does allow all sovereign states to set their own immigration policy with just a few guidelines such as not setting a minimum income requirement far above the rate at which it's citizens can claim help from the countries social security system. However restricting access to social security etc has never been a problem for the EU. Many countries in the EU allready do this. Of course this only applies to EU citizens not citizens of countries outside the EU which have allways been the responsibility of each sovereign state.

So Britain has allways had the ability to control its borders.

As an example in the country I now reside this ladies husband, as an american would be subject to criminal record checks and means tests to ensure he will not be a burden on society before residency is granted. Marriage is not a guarantee of acceptance but it does help immensly when applying for citizenship (not residence) as each case is considered individually.

The current rush by the government to implement changes to the british immigration policy then seems to be a simple piece of guile by the government to cover up its own incompetence by blaming the EU.
 
A bit more clarity required? NI is not a member of great Britain only of the UK this can be seen on any "British" passport. The UK of great britain and NI.

So is it not more correct to say she is UKish not british?



Is this the UK controlling its borders? Are the rules different for a citizen of an ex colony?



Couldn't agree more.

As far as I'm aware, there is no such word as "UKish." The term "British" (with a capital B) refers to citizens of the "United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland," even if it isn't "geographically accurate."

And if you read my post, you'd see that under the Good Friday / Belfast Agreement, which is an international treaty, people born in the 6 counties of Northern Ireland can choose to have Irish citizenship, British citizenship or both at the same time. Emma DeSousa chose to be Irish only, but the UK Government insisted that she was British first and foremost, and any rights related to her Irish nationality were superseded by that.

The situation was nothing to do with the UK "controlling its borders," and has nothing to do with Ireland being an "ex-colony." When the UK signed the treaty, they agreed that people in the North could choose to be Irish and choose not to be British. This was a really important step to getting the agreement signed and bringing an end to decades of violence. As Gramsci mentioned, this also made no difference to their rights because people of both nationalities shared the same rights under Freedom of Movement.

In order to make their racist, xenophobic fever dream of Brexit come true, both the Government and Opposition leadership have shat on this international treaty, stripping away rights that it guaranteed to people in Northern Ireland, as well as trying to force the Republic of Ireland into enforcing a "hard border" (and strangely unbothered by the prospect of migrants "slipping over" into UK territory if they don't).

This argument does seem to be a cornerstone of brexit.

The EU does allow all sovereign states to set their own immigration policy with just a few guidelines such as not setting a minimum income requirement far above the rate at which it's citizens can claim help from the countries social security system. However restricting access to social security etc has never been a problem for the EU. Many countries in the EU allready do this. Of course this only applies to EU citizens not citizens of countries outside the EU which have allways been the responsibility of each sovereign state.

So Britain has allways had the ability to control its borders.

As an example in the country I now reside this ladies husband, as an american would be subject to criminal record checks and means tests to ensure he will not be a burden on society before residency is granted. Marriage is not a guarantee of acceptance but it does help immensly when applying for citizenship (not residence) as each case is considered individually.

The current rush by the government to implement changes to the british immigration policy then seems to be a simple piece of guile by the government to cover up its own incompetence by blaming the EU.

I think I cross posted there - yes, for decades the UK Government - mostly when led by Tories - has lied about the EU being to blame for all manner of policies that were actually within their gift to change, but it suited them not to.
 
Christ on a buttered biscuit - but you could see this coming from miles away. :mad:

Home Office admits sharing details of hundreds of EU citizens

The Home Office has apologised for committing its second potential data breach of UK residents in a week after accidentally sharing the details of hundreds of EU nationals seeking settled status.
The department has informed 240 applicants it “inadvertently” shared their email addresses with others who had applied under the scheme, in its attempt to establish the reasons behind “technical difficulties” they had been experiencing.
In an email to the EU nationals affected by the latest error, the department said: “We take this opportunity to apologise for any inconvenience caused by this incident. We value your patience and understanding at this time. We would like to reassure you that we are taking this matter very seriously.”
The admission comes just days after the Home Office apologised to members of the Windrush generation again after admitting it wrongly shared 500 private email addresses while launching the compensation scheme.
 
In fact measures the British government could take(and things they promised in event of a remain vote) to restrict FOM were discussed on here prior to the ref.
Even if members of this small online forum were aware that restrictions on FOM were well within the gift of the Government, I'm pretty sure most of the general public were less clear.

I would suggest the UK Government have not been candid about this - in some cases outright lying and blaming the EU and individual EU nations for failures of the Government and UK Home Office. Certainly the media has spread lies about the EU during the 35 odd years I've lived in the UK. I can't recall any specific examples of the media challenging representatives of the Government about their responsibility for determining controls on Freedom of Movement, or indeed about other myths about EU regulations. I'm pretty sure all the lies and scapegoating have contributed to negative views of the EU and its institutions, as well as ramping up of hostility toward people from those countries living in or visiting the UK.

It created the perfect storm for the turkeys to vote for Christmas, and even as they were figuratively having Brexit brand stuffing shoved up their arses many were still - are still screaming how unfair it is they've not been put in the ovens yet.
 
Even if members of this small online forum were aware that restrictions on FOM were well within the gift of the Government, I'm pretty sure most of the general public were less clear.

I would suggest the UK Government have not been candid about this - in some cases outright lying and blaming the EU and individual EU nations for failures of the Government and UK Home Office. Certainly the media has spread lies about the EU during the 35 odd years I've lived in the UK. I can't recall any specific examples of the media challenging representatives of the Government about their responsibility for determining controls on Freedom of Movement, or indeed about other myths about EU regulations. I'm pretty sure all the lies and scapegoating have contributed to negative views of the EU and its institutions, as well as ramping up of hostility toward people from those countries living in or visiting the UK.

It created the perfect storm for the turkeys to vote for Christmas, and even as they were figuratively having Brexit brand stuffing shoved up their arses many were still - are still screaming how unfair it is they've not been put in the ovens yet.
you don't put turkeys in the oven in april
 
And on and on it goes . . .

Brexit extension: The EU just condemned migrants to seven months of 'flexible' uncertainty

Ultimately, we are where we are because of the decisions Theresa May made. This began when she dragged the rights of EU citizens in the UK into the Brexit negotiations in the first place. She did this before she even became prime minister - it was part of her leadership pitch.

But as dreadful as that was, it is in the past. The remaining hurdle to certainty now is the EU.

The citizens’ rights agreement was made in December 2017. There are no disputes over it. Yet we do not know if it is worth anything. Should EU citizens in the UK continue to apply for settled status even though we do not know yet what status we are actually signing up for? Some of us cannot be sure whether we will still have jobs, healthcare or be able to live as families after October.

Imagine having questions like that hanging over your head all this time. Imagine that situation culminating in two points of potential catastrophe, March 29th and April 12th, only to find that there could be a new date for it now on October 31st. After over 1,020 days, we cannot continue to just live in the hope that all will be fine in the end. Millions are already not fine.
 
https://assets.publishing.service.g.../20160523_Leaflet_EASY_READ_FINAL_VERSION.pdf

Check this out, the british government knew it had control of its borders before the referendum duh?

it seems some are still confused about freedom of movement and border control.

Brexit extension: The EU just condemned migrants to seven months of 'flexible' uncertainty

The EU allows each country to sort out its own immigration policy. The extension was granted after Britain pleaded for an extension.

The EU has allready agreed with Britain on reciprocal arrangements on the fate of EU citizens in Britain and expats in the EU.

Britain can guarantee the rights of EU citizens in the UK without leaving the EU as some EU countries have allready done for British expats living in their country. In fact the country in which I live has gone a little further and will guarantee expat rights no matter how britain leaves the EU.

I can understand the political expediancy of not letting the British public know until after brexit so as to have a ready answer acceptable to government. After brexit "The EU would not let us" but before brexit "we were just to lazy and incompetant to bother".

Now as a remainer, I will criticize the EU for granting the extension, just get it over with why give the british government another six months to come up with a plausible excuse to blame the EU when "They wouldn't grant an extension so we had to crash out" is enough for the british government to blame the EU for years yet to cover up their incompetence.

All in all I believe the headline here should read britain condemns all it's citizens remainers, leavers and confused together with all EU citizens working in britain and british expats in the EU to seven more months of prevarication.
 
Part 5. On the 10th April the settle status people got back to us requesting more information about me, needing my Irish passport (which we had already supplied to them at time of Original application) and five years of p60's, three months of payslips and 5 years including current council tax bills. We've also supplied them with letters from my national school, my secondary school, UCD (my university) and previous employers (UCD and DIT) and payslips my first and last payslips from DIT.

All of the above was acceptable when my wife got her EEA family member permit in 2014.

We haven't heard a thing since. My wife's visa runs out in a week. My wife and I have an overwhelming sense of being fucked. We hoping to hear something by Friday.

eta all the above is fyi as the process is slow, cumbersome and shit.
 
East European workmate has decided to go back home.

He has worked in Germany previously.

I asked him if he would come back here.

He doubts it if Brexit goes ahead. He also didnt like the anti immigration stuff around Brexit referendum..

This goes for all my EU friends. They don't think everyone here is anti immigrant. But referendum result made them feel unwelcome here.
 
Part 5. On the 10th April the settle status people got back to us requesting more information about me, needing my Irish passport (which we had already supplied to them at time of Original application) and five years of p60's, three months of payslips and 5 years including current council tax bills. We've also supplied them with letters from my national school, my secondary school, UCD (my university) and previous employers (UCD and DIT) and payslips my first and last payslips from DIT.

All of the above was acceptable when my wife got her EEA family member permit in 2014.

We haven't heard a thing since. My wife's visa runs out in a week. My wife and I have an overwhelming sense of being fucked. We hoping to hear something by Friday.

eta all the above is fyi as the process is slow, cumbersome and shit.
Yup. Then the teams dealing with it were all broken up for some reason and put back to their normal jobs, later on the new teams come in and none of the fucking records can be found and they're back at the fucking start.

Many are concerned this was deliberate from on high.
 
No, some weird shit though. Her employer checked that she had to leave the job but the advice her employer got was she could work until October. We’re confused. The solicitor is looking into it. Getting into a total headfuck and would need to be tripping to make sense of it.
 
My wife got an email from the HO yesterday to tell her that they have received her documents. We knew they had because we got an email from them on the 10th April asking for more information. I guess re confirming is progress.
 
Not sure if this is the best place to post this, but it looks like hundreds of non-UK national EU Citizens are being turned away from polling stations, despite having polling cards and having contacted their councils to confirm they were eligible. Some sort of Byzantine two stage process involved where councils didn't have time to send out the second document?

The hashtag #DeniedMyVote is trending on Twitter now.

Here's an example from someone who's, perhaps ironically, an EU and migration law specialist.



And it looks like the Electoral Commission knew this was going to happen, but did zilch.

Many EU citizens will be unable to vote in UK, campaigners warn
 
I went to vote, no problem, Irish.

My girlfriends name was below mine with a redline through it, French. She's been registered to vote at this address for over 10 years. And has always been registered to vote before that as well. :mad:
 
Not sure if this is the best place to post this, but it looks like hundreds of non-UK national EU Citizens are being turned away from polling stations, despite having polling cards and having contacted their councils to confirm they were eligible. Some sort of Byzantine two stage process involved where councils didn't have time to send out the second document?

The hashtag #DeniedMyVote is trending on Twitter now.

Here's an example from someone who's, perhaps ironically, an EU and migration law specialist.



And it looks like the Electoral Commission knew this was going to happen, but did zilch.

Many EU citizens will be unable to vote in UK, campaigners warn

Lots of reports of this up here in Scotland too, no-one thinks it's accidental. :mad:
 
I went to vote, no problem, Irish.

My girlfriends name was below mine with a redline through it, French. She's been registered to vote at this address for over 10 years. And has always been registered to vote before that as well. :mad:
Lots about that issue here; seems like it's all down to correct submission and processing of a 'UC1' or 'EC6' form.
Registered EU nationals can generally vote in Locals etc. , but the EU ones are more complicated.
 
Lots about that issue here; seems like it's all down to correct submission and processing of a 'UC1' or 'EC6' form.
Registered EU nationals can generally vote in Locals etc. , but the EU ones are more complicated.

Yes it's to make sure no one gets a vote in 2 countries which is understandable. However it was really badly publicised and there are also lots of reports of people that did jump through the extra hoop still not getting a vote.

I'm a firm believer in cock up before conspiracy but it's a bad look.
 
Yes it's to make sure no one gets a vote in 2 countries which is understandable. However it was really badly publicised and there are also lots of reports of people that did jump through the extra hoop still not getting a vote.

I'm a firm believer in cock up before conspiracy but it's a bad look.
Somewhat inevitable with such a hollowed-out local state?
 
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