Far-right response to Southport Outrage And Ongoing Violent Disorder

[BristolEcho]

I'd say it's highly likely that these are shit lists designed to cause chaos. That doesn't mean that it doesn't cause fear into the communities being targeted. It certainly doesn't mean that it's not worthwhile organising counter demos. From what I've seen online there are loads of antifascist mobilisations across the country happening. It's important to get people out onto the street to show solidarity and show the fascists that their bullshit will not be tolerated. It helps build connections amongst antifascists, brings more people into this kind of activity and gets people prepared to mobilise for the future.

The other option seems to be to ignore these now very public lists. I don't think that's really an option any more. (I'm not saying that you're saying this btw).

And also if there is nothing going on to then not get drawn into fighting the police or doing anything stupid.

 

[A380]

Every offensive thing he has endlessly posted on these boards, his username, his always being there to gather email addresses on PM chats, his many house visits to loads of urbs, sorry but if we're talking about being careful online I'll give him a wide berth thanks, best to be cautious. Suggest everyone always remains over cautious.l if they have need .

If anything his suggestion just encourages people to post information that can be used by police.

You’ve obviously never met him…

 

[Sue]

If I was the fash I'd be dropping all of the editors of the national and regional newspapera a thank you for blasting their 'planned events' across the media. Gullable idiots on twitter etc the same.

Some of these mobilisations, like the risible claim that they were going to show in Small Heath on Monday are just fantasy. Some seem designed to bring anti fascists/minority groups onto the streets presumably to tie up police resources/wrong foot counter protests/spark trouble that they can use on SM as evidence of 'two tier policing'. Some might even happen organically without the need for any far right resources thanks to the free publicity as locals turn up for the row.

In all the talk of state led SM bans, calls to bring the army onto the streets etc nobody has asked whether or not its wise to freely/hysterically publicise this stuff.

I absolutely agree with this. I get people are worried and scared but people not going out and businesses closing etc based on vague rumours kind of feels like letting the far right win without a shot being fired (so to speak) in many areas.

I mean do I think the far right are going to try anything in Hackney, one of the most ethnically-diverse areas of London? No, no I don't. Does giving these rumours publicity help? No, it doesn't. And on the off-chance anything did happen round here, I suspect passers-by would get stuck in pretty quickly. (As happened quite recently when immigration tried to pick up some Deliveroo drivers and there was a spontaneous response by people passing to stop it.)

 

[Silas Loom]

You’ve obviously never him…

Met? Employed?

 

[stoatie]

I absolutely agree with this. I get people are worried and scared but people not going out and businesses closing etc based on vague rumours kind of feels like letting the far right win without a shot being fired (so to speak) in many areas.

I mean do I think the far right are going to try anything in Hackney, one of the most ethnically-diverse areas of London? No, no I don't. Does giving these rumours publicity help? No, it doesn't. And on the off-chance anything did happen round here, I suspect passers-by would get stuck in pretty quickly. (As happened quite recently when immigration tried to pick up some Deliveroo drivers and there was a spontaneous response by people passing to stop it.)

Yeah, if they do show up here they won't last long. I mean, even the 2011 riots didn't manage to get past Dalston once all the Turkish shopkeepers mobilised. Seems like a very stupid idea. Especially if half of them are in Walthamstow.

Still, though, a nice display of solidarity would be a good thing even if the fash don't show. People are scared, and it'd be cool for them to see they've got backup.

 

[Spymaster]

Met? Employed?

Shagged.

 

[Smokeandsteam]

I absolutely agree with this. I get people are worried and scared but people not going out and businesses closing etc based on vague rumours kind of feels like letting the far right win without a shot being fired (so to speak) in many areas.

Exactly this. I do get why people might be worried and I do, obviously, understand why people want to come out and defend their community and support them in doing so. But, the media and liberal bed wetters need to leave the organising strategy of the fash to the fash and not do it for them.

 

[Kaka Tim]

Like others I dont think todays planned Krystalnacht will come to anything. Its just a list of targets on social media - its midweek, a high proportion of the twats have been knicked, and they dont have the numbers. I seriously doubt that more people are gogin to flock to join the ranks of the hotel burners. Loads of services and centres are closing down today - I think its a massive over-reaction which is giving them what they want. Many of these places are in highly diverse areas and if any of the hatemob turned up they would have their arses handed to them in short order (and the fash know this very well).
Im pissed off that my work cancelled a trip out for the guys in the hotel - we should be standing with people, not abaondoning them. Its the fascists and racists who should be keeping their heads down - not the people on their hate list.

 

[two sheds]

Surely all this has to bump up any Conspiracy charges when it comes to it. I'd imagine they'll want to clamp down on anonymity on the web, too though.

Just imagine what the prison sentences would be like if this was being orchestrated by Corbyn

 

[YouSir]

Surely all this has to bump up any Conspiracy charges when it comes to it. I'd imagine they'll want to clamp down on anonymity on the web, too though.

Just imagine what the prison sentences would be like if this was being orchestrated by Corbyn

 

[emanymton]

I absolutely agree with this. I get people are worried and scared but people not going out and businesses closing etc based on vague rumours kind of feels like letting the far right win without a shot being fired (so to speak) in many areas.

I mean do I think the far right are going to try anything in Hackney, one of the most ethnically-diverse areas of London? No, no I don't. Does giving these rumours publicity help? No, it doesn't. And on the off-chance anything did happen round here, I suspect passers-by would get stuck in pretty quickly. (As happened quite recently when immigration tried to pick up some Deliveroo drivers and there was a spontaneous response by people passing to stop it.)

There was stuff in the MEN yesterday about something happening in Salford and lots of shops shutting early. Then Fuck all happend except for cops hanging around questioning any teenagers who came by.

 

[maomao]

Met? Employed?

Are you trying to suggest Spymaster is employed by the met? I think it's more likely he's just paid for information on a freelance basis.

 

[Spymaster]

Oh ffs honestly Ska, catch a hold of yourself.

First rule of undercover tradecraft. Tell everyone you're a spy. They'll either not believe it or worry it's a double-bluff.

 

[Silas Loom]

Are you trying to suggest Spymaster is employed by the met? I think it's more likely he's just paid for information on a freelance basis.

They’d want his analysis and insight as well as just intel. Interesting patterns of dates, that sort of thing. So he’s probably on a retainer with a set cadence of outputs.

 

[emanymton]

Like others I dont think todays planned Krystalnacht will come to anything. Its just a list of targets on social media - its midweek, a high proportion of the twats have been knicked, and they dont have the numbers. I seriously doubt that more people are gogin to flock to join the ranks of the hotel burners. Loads of services and centres are closing down today - I think its a massive over-reaction which is giving them what they want. Many of these places are in highly diverse areas and if any of the hatemob turned up they would have their arses handed to them in short order (and the fash know this very well).
Im pissed off that my work cancelled a trip out for the guys in the hotel - we should be standing with people, not abaondoning them. Its the fascists and racists who should be keeping their heads down - not the people on their hate list.

But just to be clear it is no masterstroke of misinformation either. They are simply not that well coordinated. It is an aspirational wish list some dickhead put together that got circulated in the hope that some would come off. And some probably will, with a little help from the press.

 

[The39thStep]

At the risk of looking stupid in 12 hours...I still think they are 'shit lists' designed to cause the chaos it apparently is causing. The list of mainly solicitors in England - these are not natural targets for demonstrations. I've googled a few. They look more like targets for bricks through the windows at some undefined point - but not all at "8pm Wednesday, arson here".

The Welsh list looks vague. Motorpoint does not look like a great rallying spot (though I don't know Cardiff that well). Swansea "town". Yeah, ok. Aberystwyth on a Monday lunchtime? No. Tenby 'seafront' is vaguely believable.

I think it's designed to cause chaos and it's working.

Dunno if they were designed to cause chaos tbh , I think it was just some random throw it in the air incitement but these and other rumours do cause chaos. Most shops in Salford Precinct were closed early yesterday and some staff send home from offices nearby because of such a rumour. Nothing happened even the 'organiser' went home early

 

[planetgeli]

I think it was just some random throw it in the air incitement

Yeah, you're much politer than me. My 'shit list' covers your 'throw it in the air incitement'.

 

[planetgeli]

First rule of undercover tradecraft. Tell everyone you're a spy. They'll either believe it or worry it's a double-bluff.

Well you don't fool me.

I also believe you have a PhD in Mathematics.

 

[ID47]

First rule of undercover tradecraft. Tell everyone you're a spy. They'll either believe it or worry it's a double-bluff.

Mossad or Iranians?

 

[cupid_stunt]

I would have thought with all the coverage of people being sent down on remand and having their cases transferred up to the Crown Court, plus the talk of charging people with terrorist offences is likely to put off most thinking about joining a mob of loons.

 

[Kevbad the Bad]

A vocal local from Reform UK maintains that in Sunderland a police station was burned down by armed Islamists. The fact that you won't hear that on mainstream media only goes to show how the establishment control everything. How do you argue with that kind of logic?

 

[emanymton]

I would have thought with all the coverage of people being sent down on remand and having their cases transferred up to the Crown Court, plus the talk of charging people with terrorist offences is likely to put off most thinking about joining a mob of loons.

I don't know, If you are the sort of person inclined to do it in the first place I'm nit sure it matters.

One thing that we do know is that prison sentences do no have a effect on crime rates in general.

 

[mwgdrwg]

Reading about people in London not going to work and working from home due to "fear" etc. Is this bollocks?

It's not making me feel great about my (immigrant) partner visiting London next week.

 

[emanymton]

Reading about people in London not going to work and working from home due to "fear" etc. Is this bollocks?

It's not making me feel great about my (immigrant) partner visiting London next week.

Yes it bollocks in my opinion, people just looking for a reason to work from home.

 

[bellaozzydog]

But just to be clear it is no masterstroke of misinformation either. They are simply not that well coordinated. It is an aspirational wish list some dickhead put together that got circulated in the hope that some would come off. And some probably will, with a little help from the press.

A brick through a window, whether by a random internet inspired 14 year old or and organised right wing mob has the same physical and mental impact

The strategy doesn’t have to be “Epic set piece” or “Small isolated individual acts” it all adds up.

 

[weepiper]

 

[danny la rouge]

Every offensive thing he has endlessly posted on these boards, his username, his always being there to gather email addresses on PM chats, his many house visits to loads of urbs, sorry but if we're talking about being careful online I'll give him a wide berth thanks, best to be cautious. Suggest everyone always remains over cautious.l if they have need .

If anything his suggestion just encourages people to post information that can be used by police.

Mate, come on, there’s cautious and there’s paranoid. He’s playing an extremely long game if he’s a spy cop.

Plus, I’ve met his wife and seen how often she rolls her eyes when he speaks. If she’s part of his cover story she’s not read the brief.

 

[danny la rouge]

Reading about people in London not going to work and working from home due to "fear" etc. Is this bollocks?

Is everyone’s fear bollocks? No. And that’s the point.

 

[emanymton]

Mate, come on, there’s cautious and there’s paranoid. He’s playing an extremely long game if he’s a spy cop.

Plus, I’ve met his wife and seen how often she rolls her eyes when he speaks. If she’s part of his cover story she’s not read the brief.

All part of the act to lure you in.

 

[Sue]

Reading about people in London not going to work and working from home due to "fear" etc. Is this bollocks?

I'd say it's an overreaction.

It's not making me feel great about my (immigrant) partner visiting London next week.

TBH, I think London's probably about as safe as it gets. Where exactly will they be? (Sure, there are some dodgy bits but I'm guessing they're pretty unlikely to be going to any of them?)