Do angry vegans turn you against going vegan?

[bimble]

Growing up as the only vegan at a state school in Hull in the 1980s was.. not very fun apparently. Good to see that folk here seem not to be imposing strict dietary rules on their offspring.

 

[Spymaster]

Growing up as the only vegan at a state school in Hull in the 1980s was.. not very fun apparently. Good to see that folk here seem not to be imposing strict dietary rules on their offspring.

Fancy some deep fried oysters tomorrow?

 

[Casually Red]

Hugh Fearnley-Whittingstall is doing some good work around this too, liberating vegans whose lifestyles were imposed on them by parents, and introducing them to high welfare meat diets.

This lot need to learn they lost world war 2 . Had they won we'd all be eating hummus now .

'Hitler Was A Vegetarian' His Former Food Taster Margot Woelk Confirms | HuffPost UK

 

[mr steev]

Many are extremely selective, in fact most that I know.

Most of my friends who eat meat would SAY they are selective too.. but they'll still order a meat curry or salami on pizza, or occasionally go to kfc.

Are you going to tell a struggling mum that her kids shouldn't eat cheap meat (or meat at all)?

I would suggest to any parent that relies on cheap meat to eat less of it and use the money they save to buy better quality.

I think it is true to say that a lot of people are uneasy about factory farming but not sufficiently for them to go for more expensive options.

If people were bothered enough there is a cheaper option... don't buy it.

 

[bimble]

Fancy some deep fried oysters tomorrow?

It's a thing I reckon: seafood (and bacon) was definitely verboten for me as a kid - very unkosher.. does seem to make the denied things that much more delicious later.

 

[PaoloSanchez]

Aaaaand, around we go.

There is nothing wrong with killing animals for food. It's not necessarily bad as you suggested last night. I strongly believe that, so we're at an impasse.

In your opinion there's nothing wrong with killing animals for food. This must be one of those scientific "facts" that lbj was on about. Well that is your opinion and I respectfully disagree with that. In our modern civilised societies there is no need for us to kill animals for food and in fact our insistence on doing so is having many well documented negative effects, which meat eaters appear to be in complete denial of.

If those animals can be treated as humanely as possible, great. Unfortunately that's not possible to do economically, all the time, so resources should be spent in providing affordable high welfare meat.

Not killing them is pretty damn humane and also very high in the welfare department. I believe it can be made to work economically, ecologically, environmentally and ethically if we used our considerable collectively brain power for better things than military hardware.

Don't know what else to say really.

You are not obliged to say anything at all, I am not holding you here against your will. You have chosen to respond and you can also choose to stop responding if this conversation is a bother to you.

 

[beesonthewhatnow]

For me, there is absolutely nothing wrong with killing an animal for food. See also, medical testing.

We may be animals ourselves but we're a rather unique one.

 

[PaoloSanchez]

As for this, it is also utter nonsense. You don't get the offensive nature of your language about civilisation and savages nor the implications your nonsense about 'natural meat-eaters' have for a wide variety of human cultures. It's nothing whatever to do with my preferred eating style.

I now understand why the cattle industry put so much effort into trying to sue Oprah using the food disparagement laws. I thought it was those horrible vegans that were the ones supposedly getting uppity. It is your choice to get offended. If you believe the language to be genuinely offensive then I suppose you can report me to the politically correct police and let them make a judgement, but I don't believe that anything I've said is offensive in fact I think it accurately describes the underlying harsh reality of our food choice decisions and I guess some people would rather not be reminded of it. Try a word association with the words butchery, slaughter and killing.

As veganomics said earlier, and I agree to a certain extent, humans have evolved and more and more people are less tolerant of cruelty and killing than we were even a few hundred years ago. Of course there are primitive tribes and indigenous folks where killing and eating animals is an inherent part of their lifestyle and I have no problem with that, in the same way that I don't have a problem with the fact that lions need to kill for their food. Those indigenous folks are at the fringes of society and live closely and are more in harmony with nature. The majority of the "civilised" world does not need to live like that and we can easily live healthily without killing and eating animals.

Even though you claim to be speaking from a factual basis (without presenting any genuine facts), I've yet to see any factual evidence presented by you demonstrating that humans cannot survive without consuming animal flesh. In fact it would appear that the opposite is true and that animal flesh consumption is associated with poorer health and earlier death.

Anyhow, you appear to be getting rather stressed by this exchange so if my opinion and language is really bothering you that much please don't feel obliged to react or respond. I promise I won't be offended.

 

[Calamity1971]

I thought during this quiet interlude I would share an Ahhhhh moment that we can all hopefully agree on is just lovely.

 

[littlebabyjesus]

Oh fuck off with this passive-aggressive shit. You still don't get it.

ETA: at PSanchez

 

[Calamity1971]

Seems my timing was out lbj

 

[PaoloSanchez]

Seems my timing was out lbj

Don't worry about it. Thanks for trying though. It would appear that some folks really don't like their viewpoint to be challenged and get all upset and offended and abusive if you don't agree with them.

 

[TruXta]

Don't worry about it. Thanks for trying though. It would appear that some folks really don't like their viewpoint to be challenged and get all upset and offended and abusive if you don't agree with them.

Talking about yourself?

 

[Yuwipi Woman]

I thought during this quiet interlude I would share an Ahhhhh moment that we can all hopefully agree on is just lovely.
View attachment 111208

I see your cow cuddling and raise you with pig belly rubs:

 

[PaoloSanchez]

This lot need to learn they lost world war 2 . Had they won we'd all be eating hummus now .

'Hitler Was A Vegetarian' His Former Food Taster Margot Woelk Confirms | HuffPost UK

Wow. Not this old chestnut again.

Vegan Sidekick has some good responses to this and all the other poor quality arguments that some meat munchers think we've never heard before...

55 Hitler was vegetarian
There is evidence to suggest that he wasn't. But let's just skip all that and pretend that he was a vegetarian for the sake of your argument. Presumably the point is, anything that Hitler did, we should all do the opposite. That obviously makes no sense, because as hideous as Hitler was and what he did to jews and other minorities, it does not mean that every single action he did can be compared to that or is even related.

In addition, why are we singling out Hitler? If you look at all dictators, serial killers, rapists, and tyrants throughout history, you can be sure that the vast majority are actually meat-eaters. So if the behaviour of heinous criminals dictates that you do the opposite, then why are you ignoring all of them and only talking about Hitler?

 

[Yuwipi Woman]

Of course, we shouldn't let the chickens feel left out:

 

[Spymaster]

In your opinion there's nothing wrong with killing animals for food. This must be one of those scientific "facts" that lbj was on about.

(My bold)

This is a joke post, right?

Not killing them is pretty damn humane and also very high in the welfare department. I believe it can be made to work economically, ecologically, environmentally and ethically if we used our considerable collectively brain power for better things than military hardware.

And I believe that you are deluded if you think there is a much wider will to achieve this. If not eating meat makes you feel better about yourself, that's great, but don't kid yourself that you're making any difference or that you're going to change anything, because if the above is your aim, you're pissing into the wind. Far better, imo, to devote your energy to something difficult but achievable, like convincing people to eat less mass produced meat and switch to higher welfare. But that's just my opinion. You of course, are free to do as you please.

 

[Bahnhof Strasse]

For me, there is absolutely nothing wrong with killing an animal for food. See also, medical testing.

We may be animals ourselves but we're a rather unique one.

Quite. Can't believe how self-important some people are to think that any of it matters one jot.

 

[Spymaster]

If people were bothered enough there is a cheaper option... don't buy it.

They not though. That's the entire point.

This arrogant view that if people care at all for animals they'd be vegan is pure bollocks. I care for my dog, other people's pets, and animals in general, right up to the point that they get eaten. Jeff, and I assume you, just care about them enough not to eat them. It's not a complex conundrum.

 

[IC3D]

People make far more fuss about vegans than vegans ever do about animal murderers.

Pretty sure Hitler was advised by his doctor to have a vegetarian diet because of a stomach problem, his meph habit probably put the kybosh on the old boys appetite anyway.

 

[mrs quoad]

This lot need to learn they lost world war 2 . Had they won we'd all be eating hummus now .

'Hitler Was A Vegetarian' His Former Food Taster Margot Woelk Confirms | HuffPost UK

To misquote someone else:

Really? Because I don't see any Germans going around eating haggis with Yorkshire pudding, and as I recall, we won the bloody thing

 

[mrs quoad]

I care for my dog, other people's pets, and animals in general, right up to the point that they get eaten.

I feel as if this sentence is missing a critical clause break, somewhere just after "pets."

 

[Spymaster]

... animal murderers

 

[bimble]

i was total twat when i was a young veggie, remembering now how i liked to talk about it quite a lot, hoping to make other people incl especially my parents, feel the shame of their moral inferiority.

 

[beesonthewhatnow]

Genuine question - is the a general vegan position on medical testing on animals?

 

[Bahnhof Strasse]

To misquote someone else:

Really? Because I don't see any Germans going around eating haggis with Yorkshire pudding, and as I recall, we won the bloody thing

The eat a lot of Big Macs in za Fatherland. Who won WW2 again?

 

[sealion]

My mate Anna makes 3, after 30 years of pastyness she's now noming the steaks.

My ex and sons mother makes it 4. She was vegan for 20 years but now she likes a bit of Sausage and ting.

 

[Spymaster]

Genuine question - is the a general vegan position on medical testing on animals?

They're fine with it

 

[editor]

Genuine question - is the a general vegan position on medical testing on animals?

Is this the start of a cunning and completely unforeseen pincer movement that ends up with the devastating question: "So you'd rather your ill mother die - YES DIE I TELL YOU - than have her cured as a result of animal testing?"

 

[Bahnhof Strasse]

They're fine with it

Cos beagles can't roll fags, so their manky Old Holborn is safe from the pilfering paws