British IS schoolgirl 'wants to return home'

[Sprocket.]

If you're aware there aren't any authorities then why did you post with that suggestion?

Because I don’t want them back here.

 

[tim]

Perhaps they should all be handed over to the authorities in those countries they have committed the atrocities in.

Do you mean the resurgent Assad regime that had been torturing raping and slaughtering its perceived opponents and their children for decades. Albeit in the name of a secular ideology: not that the latter stopped in from having a clear sectarian bias

 

[tim]

Put your crystal ball away, you can't read minds.

I can read his misogynistic posts.

 

[cupid_stunt]

I think that's a very charitable interpretation - the comment was aimed at the number of children she had had, he made no mention at all of how IS sees/grooms/recruits young women, the focus was all on her as an individual.

Based on the fact that she joined IS to become a bride of a fighter, and in order to be used by IS to produce new fighters.

 

[A380]

There either aren't any authorities - we're talking about disintegrating and failed states here - that's the point.

Actually, despite what Turrkey and Syria say ‘Kurdistan’ seem to be making a half decent stab at it, and aren’t completely shit in their treatment of women. I know they wouldn’t last more than a week without the West’s air power and I imagine there are some quite outrageous costs from us to keep that in place but I’m not sure they’re failing. Likewise Syria since we bailed out on the Syrian people and the Russians and Iranians started proping the regime up isn’t really a failed state anymore. Fucking awful dictatorship but not a failed state....

 

[Sprocket.]

Do you mean the resurgent Assad regime that had been torturing raping and slaughtering its perceived opponents and their children for decades. Albeit in the name of a secular ideology: not that the latter stopped in from having a clear sectarian bias

Something like that.

 

[Bahnhof Strasse]

If you're aware there aren't any authorities then why did you post with that suggestion?

Iraq is the only actual state authority in the region, when ISIS fighters are captured there they are tried and given death sentences and put on death row. Very few sentences have been carried out as far as I can tell, but this is the reason so many wish to surrender in Syria.

 

[SpackleFrog]

Because I don’t want them back here.

What do you want then? For her to be stripped off British citizenship?

 

[SpackleFrog]

Based on the fact that she joined IS to become a bride of a fighter, and in order to be used by IS to produce new fighters.

So that makes the factory comment alright as far as you're concerned?

 

[Sprocket.]

What do you want then? For her to be stripped off British citizenship?

Her back here and prosecuted if needed. Those who have been trained and have been actively murdering and raping their way around the region can fucking rot.

 

[A380]

Is P&P always like this?

I really really should come here more often.

 

[LDC]

What do you want then? For her to be stripped off British citizenship?

For the moment there are other alternatives that have been mentioned that don't involve her coming back here or being stripped of UK citizenship, she stays where she is for example.

 

[littlebabyjesus]

insisting on the basis of no evidence whatsoever that 'she knew what she was getting in to'

She took her sister's passport and smuggled herself into Syria to offer herself to IS and request an IS fighter to marry. She herself has said this. The idea that she is some innocent caught up by events is untenable.

 

[tim]

Something like that.

Rape and torture in the cause of Baathism: good.

Rape and torture in the name of Islam: bad.

Ba'athism - Wikipedia

Is that a reasonable summary of your attitude?

 

[LDC]

Actually, despite what Turrkey and Syria say ‘Kurdistan’ seem to be making a half decent stab at it, and aren’t completely shit in their treatment of women. I know they wouldn’t last more than a week without the West’s air power and I imagine there are some quite outrageous costs from us to keep that in place but I’m not sure they’re failing. Likewise Syria since we bailed out on the Syrian people and the Russians and Iranians started proping the regime up isn’t really a failed state anymore. Fucking awful dictatorship but not a failed state....

The DFNS (Rojava) are also having a go at constructing a different type of society, and one that (relevant to this discussion) is trying to have a different perspective on the traditional justice/legal system.

Take with a pinch of realist salt but...

The New Justice System in Rojava

Rojava an oasis of progress in Syria

 

[Sprocket.]

To be honest I really couldn’t give two fucks about any of it anymore.

 

[kebabking]

You don't think referring to her womb as a factory was out of order?

Genuinely, how would you describe what IS said they wanted, and the myriad statements from women from all over Europe who went to the IS said that's what they were going there to do?

IS specifically and overtly recruited women and girls with a vista of marrying an IS fighter and having lots of babies to populate the caliphate.

You may not like the term, but it's the idea that IS put forward, and the idea that this young woman agreed with. Personally, I think the term isn't inaccurate given that the babies were being made for a specific purpose, rather than being the result of when a mummy jihadist and a daddy jihadist love each other very much and have a special mummy and daddy jihadi cuddle.

 

[kebabking]

What do you want then? For her to be stripped off British citizenship?

Yes.

 

[likesfish]

tbf if the Kurds Iraqis Syrians or anyone shot the fighters and left them at the side of the road it would be perfectly legal geneva convention doesn't apply and if you decide to scribble all over the rules of war reciprocity is a thing.
children and non-combatants we have to eventually bring back but there's no rush or reason to spend taxpayers money to do it.
family can always crowdfund for it.
unaccompanied children we should

 

[SpackleFrog]

Her back here and prosecuted if needed. Those who have been trained and have been actively murdering and raping their way around the region can fucking rot.

Well that's a bit confusing, given you just said you don't want her back here.

 

[cupid_stunt]

So that makes the factory comment alright as far as you're concerned?

It's not a term I would have used, but it's not unreasonable under the circumstances, as per kebabking's post just above this one.

 

[LDC]

tbf if the Kurds Iraqis Syrians or anyone shot the fighters and left them at the side of the road it would be perfectly legal geneva convention doesn't apply

You were peeling potatoes the day of that lecture in training right?

 

[SpackleFrog]

She took her sister's passport and smuggled herself into Syria to offer herself to IS and request an IS fighter to marry. She herself has said this. The idea that she is some innocent caught up by events is untenable.

She left the country with a fake passport? Oh my god. I am so morally outraged right now. Won't somebody think of the children etc

 

[littlebabyjesus]

She left the country with a fake passport? Oh my god. I am so morally outraged right now. Won't somebody think of the children etc

Don't be a fucking cunt. She joined IS ffs. What the fuck is wrong with you on this?

 

[cupid_stunt]

Put another way, gentlegreen is innocent, compared to her.

 

[SpackleFrog]

Genuinely, how would you describe what IS said they wanted, and the myriad statements from women from all over Europe who went to the IS said that's what they were going there to do?

IS specifically and overtly recruited women and girls with a vista of marrying an IS fighter and having lots of babies to populate the caliphate.

You may not like the term, but it's the idea that IS put forward, and the idea that this young woman agreed with. Personally, I think the term isn't inaccurate given that the babies were being made for a specific purpose, rather than being the result of when a mummy jihadis and a daddy love each other very much and have a special mummy and daddy cuddle.

I might well say that Daesh sees women as reproductive machines who exist for the purpose of producing children. No issue with that. Although that doesn't make them particularly exceptional - the capitalist system of production sees women first and foremost as reproductive machines who exist for the purpose of producing children.

What I wouldn't do is call a women a 'factory' myself. Because that's a different thing.

 

[Sue]

Rape and torture in the cause of Baathism: good.

Rape and torture in the name of Islam: bad.

Ba'athism - Wikipedia

Is that a reasonable summary of your attitude?

No one has said or suggested rape and torture are good. Why are you saying they have?

 

[SpackleFrog]

Yes.

Do you foresee any potential dangers associated with your support for this Tory govt to strip someone of their citizenship?

 

[A380]

tbf if the Kurds Iraqis Syrians or anyone shot the fighters and left them at the side of the road it would be perfectly legal geneva convention doesn't apply and if you decide to scribble all over the rules of war reciprocity is a thing.
children and non-combatants we have to eventually bring back but there's no rush or reason to spend taxpayers money to do it.
family can always crowdfund for it.
unaccompanied children we should

Presumably the men and women in shipping containers at Waddington are also doing this legally, just slightly less up close and personal.

 

[weepiper]

I might well say that Daesh sees women as reproductive machines who exist for the purpose of producing children. No issue with that. Although that doesn't make them particularly exceptional - the capitalist system of production sees women first and foremost as reproductive machines who exist for the purpose of producing children.

What I wouldn't do is call a women a 'factory' myself. Because that's a different thing.

Absolutely this.