Beating the Fascists: The authorised history of Anti-Fascist Action
- Thread starter cogg
- Start date
malatesta32
Not Serb. No, Really!
anything you can get wd be great - even just dates! im trying to fill the gap between 1996 - 2009!
Red Storm
M14
Shit side of the 38th parallel for the time being.
bignose1
Searchlight Spoiler
This a Korea move.....
audiotech
wav, aiff, mp3, ogg, flac
Le Pen visit and a '"machete-type weapon" found in a car, with three men arrested'. For hacking flesh out presumably?
framed
Leave it!
I respect the Ayatollah for what he did during his period of anti-fascist activism, but not for some of his politically sectarian posts here.
malatesta32
Not Serb. No, Really!
[/quote]
i believe that is just the ticket! perfect! cheers mate .
i believe that is just the ticket! perfect! cheers mate .
framed
Leave it!
Regarding when AFA did or did not 'leave the scene of the crime'. In Scotland no-one stood down or was told to stand down. It was, as described by Joe Reilly in an earlier post, a natural drift. The organisations wound down because the fash had moved on to try to assert themselves in the political mainstream.
Even at the election count in 1997 in Glasgow, despite the fash going around clicking the heels of the mIllies and threatening them, when AFA (with the help of Militant) entered the SECC their arses collapsed. Before it kicked off, the Scottish Organiser of the BNP, Scott McLean, tried to approach me twice to discuss how they were 'no longer a violent organisation'. This was only a couple of weeks after the Penilee clash.
First time he came towards us was as we entered the count, I was at the front with one of the top lads from the Celtic casuals. He came towards us and said, "What are you lot doing here? We're not into violence any more..." To which the Celtic lad immediately quipped, "You're fucked then, cos we are!"
Second time was when AFA made a move towards them and he came towards me again with hands out saying, "Look, we don't want this, we're political now..." and was immediately punched in the mouth by one of the boys and told, "We don't talk to fascists."
He went immediately to the cops and tried to get me and the other lad arrested, but the cops didn't want to know, they'd been surprised by the AFA 'infiltration' and were still weighing up which side would be easier to get out of the building.The thing is, no-one really stopped doing anti-fascist work. To this day, there are still people in Scotland who were involved with AFA and RA doing monitoring and surveillance around the fash. Older heads have also acted in an advisory role to a new generation of younger militants. I spoke as a former AFA organiser to an 80 strong meeting of Celtic Ultras in 2009 along with two IWCA representatives and the son of a recently deceased Spanish Civil War veteran.
Two years ago at the 20th anniversary party of the TAL Celtic fanzine we also had a number of young lads who had formed themselves into a militant group and were doing martial arts training for the possibility of clashes with a violent fascist minority in the SDL. They looked to AFA as their inspiration, so all us old men and 'retirees' couldn't have been doing so badly still to be sought out and asked for advice.
malatesta32
Not Serb. No, Really!
awesome stuff wee man! thanks loads!
malatesta32
Not Serb. No, Really!
i think this is what im gravitating towards:
AFA de-escalated after BNP booted off the streets.
FT still went on even tho RA did IWCA - joe said before.
C18 - the men who never were, never did anything much. nor did RVF BPP arsebugles.
folk as usual were involved in other stuff apart from AF stuff.
activists acted when needed, antifascist activity was engaged in as, when and how approrpriate.
like with most history it seems there wasnt a start and finishing point.
' a natural drift. ' sounds about right
this is up for discussion and i would appreciate any input and guidance. and no shouting!
DaveCinzano
WATCH OUT, GEORGE, HE'S GOT A SCREWDRIVER!
bignose1
Searchlight Spoiler
Or a bit of seoul searching.......
malatesta32
Not Serb. No, Really!
you will never better 'toast brown, this time he wants his toast brown!'
Pickman's model
Starry Wisdom
the pugh article's interesting: but i imagine you're using a load of sources for the mosley chapter. pugh's a reputable academic, so you shouldn't go too far wrong by using him.
malatesta32
Not Serb. No, Really!
yeah i have his book which also features his central thesis in the paper. but thanks for the heads up i will adjust the section accordingly!
Pickman's model
Starry Wisdom
while the main thrust of your book's anti-fascism, some consideration of the intricate and frankly confusing relationship between c18 and b&h/rock against communism during the 90s would be useful, especially as things like waterloo and the unhappy welling incident in 2009 were closely with b&h activity.
malatesta32
Not Serb. No, Really!
ha ha! just finished editing the C18/B&H section last night - about 1.45am.
Joe Reilly
Well-Known Member
Yet more lies in a pathetic effort to provide some moral camouflage for your general mendacity, and your malign and baseless inventions on this thread and elsewhere.
bignose1
Searchlight Spoiler
Joe Reilly
Well-Known Member
List the 'basic untruths'.
Joe Reilly
Well-Known Member
1. AFA never 'de-escalated'. There was never any pro-active response operationally to the BNP chucking it. There was a political assesment of where militant anti-fascism's responsibility lay should the BNP disengagement from the streets prove to be permanent.
It was multiple choice: should militant anti-fascism support efforts to fill the political void in working class areas or simply allow the BNP a free run at what is after all 'our', which is to say the Left's historic constituency?
Back Labour or the Trot left in doing so?
Or finally do nothing, sit on the sidelines, on the grounds that interfering politically was beyond the anti-fascist remit (Searchlight's position as articulated via Leeds/Huddersfield)?
(2). Post 1994 AFA operated exactly as before. Regional meetings were maintained. Surveillance was carried out. The national office was manned and funded. The website was kept updated. FT was produced distributed and sold as before. RA, on which the responsibility landed, always devoted sufficient resources in terms of personell and funds to maintain AFA profile and structures.
(3). Individually C18 membership was extremely dangerous, well capable of extreme violence, including murder ( and would have cut a swathe through traditional left had that been their target) but operated as a hooligan firm, were poorly led, and also suffered from state infiltration at leadership level.
(4). Red Action's developmemt of the IWCA outside of AFA was in addittion to the responsibilities addresssed in answer (2).
(5). Post 1997, it increasingly became apparent that there was little or nothing to do - unless you consider stalking hopelessly small groups that couldn't muster more than 50 degenerates nationally the epitome of anti-fascism, while ignoring the vastly superior numbers of the politically ambitious fascists massing in a different arena.
Which brings us back to the multiple choice oulined in (1).
bignose1
Searchlight Spoiler
Tell me why Clifford needs a crew?
Your forum circa 2003 was a foul mouthed virulent malevolent threatening hate fest. You invited a free for all. The plain old shit stirrers....fakers...fantasists and trolls......clowns...fash...plod and last but not least those behind the threats.
This happened. You were responsible for that site as a leading member.
Similar threads
