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Beating the Fascists: The authorised history of Anti-Fascist Action

malatesta32 said:
i said i dont know 100% definite. im obviously not going to say why am i?
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:D
 
Joe Reilly said:
Still waiting to hear about us all 'hiding behind gangsters' Steve.
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Dont be pathetic...you know you did. Im still waiting to hear why Denis (50) has to say to me ''should see the size of our crew now''. Ask him go on and I might give up an example or two. Was it that because a certain person was no longer around he now needed a 'crew' ....when one person might have done the trick previously.
 
DaveCinzano said:
PS I believe that the "strange group [which] handed out a leaflet explaining not just why they hadn't joined our march but how they opposed it" was the RCP.
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happy days - I had one RCPer trying to tell me why it was wrong to go on the demo even as the blood was running down my head. he did at least have the decency to look slightly embarrassed upon being told to fuck off.
 
belboid said:
happy days - I had one RCPer trying to tell me why it was wrong to go on the demo even as the blood was running down my head. he did at least have the decency to look slightly embarrassed upon being told to fuck off.
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If only I had had your turn of phrase I might have saved myself :facepalm:
 
Joe Reilly said:
I am reliably informed that there was no involvement by any DAM in Manchester AFA. So if he wasn't involved in Manchester where did he hail from?
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There were a couple involved in the Manchester Martyrs stuff, one of them was a manager in some chemical works.
 
Joe Reilly said:
Another cracker from Wikipedia:

"Critics of the IWCA say it has abandoned socialist politics but only replaced it with a confused "localist working class self-help electoral politics , exemplified by the IWCA slogan " working class power in working class areas". Critics from the Left say this is an unachievable illusion in a capitalist society and an opportunist political approach which tacks to the wind of reactionery white working class attitudes to ethnic minorities, crime, and tolerant multiculturalism , for local electoral advantage. Indeed many critics on the Left would deny that the IWCA sits politically on the Left at all ..." etc

Not I grant you the amusing 'full on Strasserite' denunciation of the IWCA, coined by the late an unlamented bignose1, though some might think it more than a little short in the evidence department for the likes of Wikipedia.
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BobfromBromley is a busy man http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Bobfrombrockley
 
Joe Reilly said:
Let's just put the 'hiding behind gangsters' lie to bed then shall we and just toss into the bin brimming with the rest of your utterly bonkers fabrications.
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The truth is Joe and Im sure youll understand there needs to be a bit of tippy toeing on the subject for good reasons. I wouldnt put it past ceratin people to crank it up and start trouble which I dont need. Theres a bit of a queue at the moment tbh. The last but one time I was in DC's company it was obvious he fired a warning shot by his statement...with my final outing being a smack in the mouth from one of his 'crew' and it fucks me off that you cannot see this. You laughed at the bitch slapping..thats what I mean...That was for fuck all but you found it funny.

When Clifford wheeled out you know who to lean on the South M/CR BNP ex organiser...it exemplified what I was saying. Total overkill and uneccessary. I even had disagreements with DH on this.

Then there was this bizarre anaylsis by DC of my attendance at the 'funeral'...totally fucking strange thinking. You as Ive said have cunted me off numerous times for some blatantly untrue and unfair reasons for several years. Youve got the whole Searchlight/NR totally wrong. I find no great satisfaction in all this but Ill be fucked if you think you can get away scot free.

Its sad that although I said to myself when I was away in Spain Id fuck this site off when I got back I find it hard to take the perpetual personal hassle. You put me on offer to all and sundry and then you all sit back and stroke your collective dicks like spotty teenagers not quite able to get to the money shot.

As people have said it on here it isnt serving any worthwhile purpose to have this continual bickering. It doesnt fiurther an honest debate but I felt that a stand had to be taken. I dont denigrate your and RA/AFA's contribution for those early years. What ever I did that you may not have agreed or had suspicion of and I can accept someof that..my loyalty was/is to the anti facsist movement in Manchester and where needed further afield. That much surely by record shouldnt be open to contention...??
 
malatesta32 said:
bolton DAM and manchester DAM were involved - either individually or as a group - in northern network mobilisations.
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Thats news to me. The Bolton group were anarchists but far far from the DAM. They were good people into food co-ops etc and with a background in direct action politics, Hunt Sabbing etc. Vandalising churches with slogans charicaturing what it means to let jesus enter you was one of their classics..aledgedly. But no not part of the DAM.
Manchester DAM were never involved even locally and I cant think of any individuals in Manchester DAM who participated in any northern network call outs from the foundation of the NN to 1998. If I am wrong its the exception that proves the rule Im afraid. DAM people from Preston and I think York did participate for a couple of years and obviously Liverpool made a very important contribution to the NN.
 
anyone got info or links on these?
'JR: There were still major clashes in 1996 with C18 in Holborn and in January 1997 a large mobilisation in pursuit of the NF in Islington, and a clash at count in Glasgow in the same year. '
also trying to flesh out a chronology of events (Le Pen, Griffin, Tyndall) that may have happened. there seems to be a bit of a 'hiatus' between this and 2009. any help gratefully received.
 
bignose1 said:
As people have said it on here it isnt serving any worthwhile purpose to have this continual bickering. It doesnt fiurther an honest debate but I felt that a stand had to be taken. I dont denigrate your and RA/AFA's contribution for those early years. What ever I did that you may not have agreed or had suspicion of and I can accept some of that..my loyalty was/is to the anti facsist movement in Manchester and where needed further afield. That much surely by record shouldnt be open to contention...??
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And that has been acknowledged several times on this thread, certainly by myself and Liam I think, if not others. My own personal dealings with you were good, but there's no medals to hand out mate...

You still seem bitter about the response to NR from RA, but what did you expect? Dave was an ex-member who was forced out under a cloud of suspicion of his own making and a court case that Red Action personnel fished him out of. If it hadn't been for the legal strategy devised and implemented on Dave's behalf he might well have gone to prison, but the strategy worked and he got off. The condition for RA assistance was that he leave all associated organisations, he had brought anti-fascism into disrepute and he had to go.

It doesn't give me any pleasure whatsoever to say these things Steve, because I liked Dave a lot and regarded him as a friend. He was a regular visitor to Glasgow and me to Manchester, him and G were good mates of mine inside RA. It's tragic what happened but I still back the decisions made at the time.

You've thrown so many more counter-allegations against RA personnel into the pot along the way that it's inevitable that there will continue to be discussion around these issues.
 
malatesta32 said:
anyone got info or links on these?
'JR: There were still major clashes in 1996 with C18 in Holborn and in January 1997 a large mobilisation in pursuit of the NF in Islington, and a clash at count in Glasgow in the same year. '
also trying to flesh out a chronology of events (Le Pen, Griffin, Tyndall) that may have happened. there seems to be a bit of a 'hiatus' between this and 2009. any help gratefully received.
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I think I mentioned the count in Glasgow in 1997 a while back on this thread, but didn't go into detail. I'll see what I can dig out on it Mal. It's mentioned in BtF.

There's a press cutting from the Scottish Sun and I have video footage of it on a VHS tape somewhere. The video is good cos just before it kicks off in the count, the BBC's Kirsty Wark says, "We understand that an anti-fascist group has infiltrated the count..." The fash are then attacked as they stand up to wave UJ's and barrack Mohamed Sarwar the Asian Labour candidate. The BNP were then advised by the police to leave for their own safety and as they're escorted out there's AFA lads still having a pop at them, with the voice of Kirsty Wark commenting, "And there you can see some of the real citizens of Glasgow showing the BNP just exactly what they think of them..." :D

We also had a serious confrontation during that election campaign with the BNP in an area of the Govan constituency called Penilee that they regarded as a bit of a stronghold. I was calling the shots that morning and made a serious error of judgement in splitting our troops into two groups, complacently believing that it was a 'no show' from the fash and that our 'leafleters' were safe to split into two groups of 10 to get the leaflet job done quicker. Five minutes later, my group turn a corner and get hit with everything from a well tooled up gang of about 15 fascists and casuals. I think it was the first time experience of having flares fired at them that caused most of the boys to run, leaving me and an RA member from Edinburgh to stand them on our own. I got fucked on the head with an iron bar during that one, but was swinging a dog chain and gassing their front line at the same time. The Edinburgh lad was a kickboxer and he decked one of their main men straight away and they stood off, the silly bastards... our 'runners' recovered their composure and started to come back down the road, but the fash had made their point and headed back into a safer part of the scheme for them. It was a defeat for us though, they got a boost out of it because we were hearing stuff within hours from Celtic casuals who'd been phoned up by crowing rangers lads about the BNP chasing AFA out of Penilee, which wasn't strictly true, but we'd have probably claimed a victory ourselves had we been in their position... We went back two weeks later with 40 AFA and leafleted the whole area to no response from them, even though they came by in a couple of cars but they obviously didn't fancy it.

Post-1997, Edinburgh AFA with support from Glasgow were still mobilising squads off the James Connolly Commemoration and I'm sure they had run-ins with the fash in 1998 and beyond that, but I'll need to check with one of them to confirm and get more details, if you want it...
 
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