'Vegan diets are healthier and safer for dogs' says The Guardian about University of Winchester survey

[Yuwipi Woman]

tbh, my (albeit limited) experience of dogs suggests they’d clear out the entire bloody fridge. Most appear to be little more than walking dustbins.

I've known more than one dog who liked to snack out of the kitty litter tray.

 

[editor]

Perhaps you could outline why you think these studies merit inclusion, and describe them, like it says in the faq. One of them appears to be a master's dissertation so not peer reviewed, for example. The second seems only to have looked at 12 dogs.

No thanks. And my post is entirely in line with the FAQ.

 

[Pickman's model]

No thanks. And my post is entirely in line with the FAQ.

So what do you think these two studies demonstrate, what did you see in their methodology or conclusions that led you to share them? You haven't explained the nature or relevance of either of the links btw, and I can't find the quote you attribute to the first one in the thesis

 

[a_chap]

May I say that this thread is vintage Urban75

Carry on, people.

[orders more popcorn]

 

[tonysingh]

I don’t mind if people are vegans, I think it’s a bit counterproductive due to food miles and industrialisation, but I’m sure my diet is worse! I just dunno where they stand on pets tbh.

See, damn my autistic self coz standing on pets conjured up a very disturbing image coz I took it so literally.

May I say that this thread is vintage Urban75

Carry on, people.

[orders more popcorn]

Brilliantly there is now popcorn made for dogs.

 

[ElizabethofYork]

.

 

[littlebabyjesus]

Anyhow, insect-based food ftw, both for humans and dogs. Lots of b12. That's the future.

 

[platinumsage]

My cat eats insects and she isn't any more healthy than average.

 

[tonysingh]

Anyhow, insect-based food ftw, both for humans and dogs. Lots of b12. That's the future.

I'll have to fight the geckos and spiders for their supper.

"You bastard, that morioworm was mine!"

 

[campanula]

People do like to argue. Personally, I am very keen for (other) people to choose a vegan diet as we need as much diversity as possible. The more (some) people refuse meat, the better the environment functions for those of us who do (eat animal products). Surely similar cost/benefit balances pertain in most areas of life (such as using air travel, owning a car and so on). A really neat solution would be for everyone to eat much less animal protein, without resorting to arguments which rest on one singular position.This moralistic nit-picking of personal choices doesn't really make sense in any sort of collective society.
For the record, I do feed my dog a pretty balanced diet of meat (including wild meat such as rabbit, stuff from the butcher such as oxtail, breast of lamb, marrow bone, the odd pouch of commericial dog food, oily fish such as sardines or mackerel) and chopped vegetables...as well as a bit of scavenged leftovers...but mostly because I am in a position to do so, with access to a variety of food sources rather than some careful scientific assessment of what would be best.

 

[Pickman's model]

My cat eats insects and she isn't any more healthy than average.

Healthier than half cats is pretty good tho

 

[Bahnhof Strasse]

My dog totally ignored a cunt of a spider scuttling across the living room floor last night. The Henry didn’t miss the fucker tho.

 

[editor]

So what do you think these two studies demonstrate, what did you see in their methodology or conclusions that led you to share them? You haven't explained the nature or relevance of either of the links btw, and I can't find the quote you attribute to the first one in the thesis

Oh I am sorry. You appear to have forgotten how to use Google and seem to think we're in some sort of debating competition.

Here: 3 Studies on Vegan Diets for Dogs

And on that note I'm putting you on ignore for the rest of the day, Bye!

 

[kabbes]

I can absolutely believe that dogs can thrive on a vegan diet just as well as humans can. We already know they are omnivores. And my dog certainly loves fruit and veg as much as meat. Broccoli stalks are one of his very favourite foods, right up there with plums (the fruit and his own).

That study is terrible though. It’s the kind of thing we were given to write an essay about regarding the dangers of terrible study design, conflicts of interest and inappropriate statistical analysis. I’m not surprised it got published because there are some dogshit journals out there that will publish even worse than that. But I’m also not surprised that it was published somewhere with no impact factor worth mentioning. For people that actually understand the strengths and weaknesses of different design approaches and understand the assumptions and limitations inherent to different statistical methods, it reads as one big red flag.

 

[Pickman's model]

Oh I am sorry. You appear to have forgotten how to use Google and seem to think we're in some sort of debating competition.

Here: 3 Studies on Vegan Diets for Dogs

And on that note I'm putting you on ignore for the rest of the day, Bye!

Don't know why you didn't say there's three studies here which demonstrate X, and link to that site. It's a good thing this place isn't a debating competition because the number of times you're reduced to ad hominems would surely see you ejected early on.

It says in the faq u75 hosts lovely and robust debate. If only that were the case here, where the mildest of questions sends you going all brave sir robin

 

[MickiQ]

May I say that this thread is vintage Urban75

Carry on, people.

[orders more popcorn]

Vegan popcorn naturally

 

[littlebabyjesus]

I can absolutely believe that dogs can thrive on a vegan diet just as well as humans can. We already know they are omnivores. And my dog certainly loves fruit and veg as much as meat. Broccoli stalks are one of his very favourite foods, right up there with plums (the fruit and his own).

That study is terrible though. It’s the kind of thing we were given to write an essay about regarding the dangers of terrible study design, conflicts of interest and inappropriate statistical analysis. I’m not surprised it got published because there are some dogshit journals out there that will publish even worse than that. But I’m also not surprised that it was published somewhere with no impact factor worth mentioning. For people that actually understand the strengths and weaknesses of different design approaches and understand the assumptions and limitations inherent to different statistical methods, it reads as one big red flag.

A terrible study reported terribly.

Good old Graun.

The standard of science reporting generally in newspapers is appalling.

 

[Sasaferrato]

The research doesn't justify the headline and it isn't sufficiently rigorous to recommend that everyone should feed their dogs a vegan diet. It consisted only of asking the owners some questions ffs. If only all medical research was as simple as a quick questionnaire.

Indeed.

editor

Would you take a medication whose safety and efficacy were based on a similar 'study'?

 

[editor]

Indeed.

editor

Would you take a medication whose safety and efficacy were based on a similar 'study'?

And today's gold prize for whataboutery goes to Sass.

We're talking about dog food, not human medicine, you pillock.

 

[Sasaferrato]

And today's gold prize for whataboutery goes to Sass.

We're talking about dog food, not human medicine, you pillock.

Shit study is shit study you wazzok!

 

[Agent Sparrow]

Sorry if this has been addressed in the last 8 pages. It doesn’t sound like they controlled for potential confounding variables like household income, amount of owner leisure time spent with dog/exercising dog etc. These things are a huge issue with human health outcome research, can’t see how it would be much different for dogs.

 

[Magnus McGinty]

And it's back to vegan bashing by questioning their ethics. On a thread about dog food.

You think non vegans would desire giving their pet dog a vegan diet?

 

[nogojones]

I've known more than one dog who liked to snack out of the kitty litter tray.

And then they want to lick you. Revolting animals.

 

[Funky_monks]

Who the fuck do you think feeds the dogs?

What's that got to do with it?
It's a self reporting study - a questionnaire filled out anonymously by dog owners.

The researchers used the metric of "less vets visits" to conclude that the dogs on vegan diets were healthier. You could equally conclude that they were more likely to be neglected than the dogs on regular diets.
There's literally no evidence for either, all the researchers know is the owners of pets on vegan diets say they take them to the vets less.

Nobody saw the dogs, nobody checked with the vets.

The study is shit and the Guardian is shit.
I suggest you read the thread "Why the Guardian is Going Down the Pan" on these very boards.

 

[Funky_monks]

Feel free to post them up.

scholar.google.com

Let me Google (scholar) that for you.

Also; there's a precautionary principle here. Remember the 90s? Remember what feeding highly rendered meat products to ruminants did?
Fucking idiotic.

 

[Sasaferrato]

scholar.google.com

Let me Google (scholar) that for you.

Also; there's a precautionary principle here. Remember the 90s? Remember what feeding highly rendered meat products to ruminants did?
Fucking idiotic.

I was working for a medical equipment company at that time, and installed beds for a couple of CJD patients. Horrific.

 

[scifisam]

scholar.google.com

Let me Google (scholar) that for you.

Also; there's a precautionary principle here. Remember the 90s? Remember what feeding highly rendered meat products to ruminants did?
Fucking idiotic.

Are you suggesting humans are going to get ill because their dogs don't eat meat?

Fucking bizarre comparison. It is really weird how veganism winds some meat eaters up so much.

 

[Agent Sparrow]

The paper is open access and good Lord I’m actually starting to read it

First thoughts - their calculations didn’t account for breed. Whilst I do get their point that this would lead to too many groups with small numbers, given breed is strongly associated with various health outcomes that’s a major flaw.

 

[Pickman's model]

The paper is open access and good Lord I’m actually starting to read it

First thoughts - their calculations didn’t account for breed. Whilst I do get their point that this would lead to too many groups with small numbers, given breed is strongly associated with various health outcomes that’s a major flaw.

Yeh the methodology seems to me to leave a lot to be desired, and I'm glad it seems that way to you too

 

[Yuwipi Woman]

And then they want to lick you. Revolting animals.

No more so than most humans.