US election 2020 thread

[JTG]

Have noticed a few of the more shamelessly partisan pollsters putting out polls that are much closer than the average in the last 24 hours. Sceptical to say the least

 

[Smokeandsteam]

The idea of Trump himself as being some kind of horrific aberration is part and parcel of the same thing - fears that he'll use the Supreme Court to ignore the result of the election (as if that hadn't already happened in the very recent past), the idea in recent posts here that he'll refuse to turn up at Biden's inauguration in a fit of pique - he is an unusual politician, there's no doubt about that - but look at his record in office and it's not really much different from a standard Republican presidency of recent years.

The subtext of the criticism being, of course, that those criticizing are invested in, and guardians of, the existing order. Which, in most cases, is absolutely true.

 

[redsquirrel]

Victories to the likes of Trump, Bolsonaro, Duterte, Putin, Erdogan, Johnson, Hitler, etc, are something that should Scare Democracy.

It is not the fear for democracy that motivates anti-populists it is the fear of democracy. So you have liberals cheering on military coups attempting to remove Erdogan.

Which is not to say that Erdogan, Trump, Putin, Orbán, etc are not filth, of course they are but the retreat of some on the left into anti-populism is both depressing and appalling.

 

[bimble]

Hmm. I think ‘guardians of the existing order’ and ‘people who most hate or fear trump’ is not much of a matching set tbh. Interesting reading all this though.

 

[redsquirrel]

The idea of Trump himself as being some kind of horrific aberration is part and parcel of the same thing - fears that he'll use the Supreme Court to ignore the result of the election (as if that hadn't already happened in the very recent past), the idea in recent posts here that he'll refuse to turn up at Biden's inauguration in a fit of pique - he is an unusual politician, there's no doubt about that - but look at his record in office and it's not really much different from a standard Republican presidency of recent years.

Yes and I think that similarity to past Republican presidencies also illustrates a crucial difference between the populist radical right and the extreme (fascist) right.
For all the talk about not abiding by the results of the election the Republican Party like other populists is still reformist, it may be shouting about the swamp but its aims is still to win power via elections.

(And I know there are some mad MAGA nutters there but there is not any organised para-military group under the control of the Republican Party)

 

[tim]

We have the Crown, which is sovereign, except that Parliament is sovereign. Except that the government can act using Royal Prerogative, which is the Crown acting, but it isn't cos it's the government, which exists because the Commons supports it, except that it's appointed by the Crown, and acts through the Crown. And then there's the House of Lords.

So who's in charge again?

The "Freemen of the Land" could probably give you a succinct answer to that, if you were foolish enough to ask.

 

[tim]

Hmm. I think ‘guardians of the existing order’ and ‘people who most hate or fear trump’ is not much of a matching set tbh. Interesting reading all this though.

think they probably are to a fair degree. Trump has destabilised that existing order and I think there are plenty of professional politicians, Democrat and Republican who would want the old certainties back.

 

[frogwoman]

Certainly a few yes, there's plenty of other people in 'the establishment' who have done pretty well out of it tho.

 

[killer b]

The only republicans who're down on Trump are those who're concerned about him doing long-term damage to the party. His political programme is all good.

 

[Dogsauce]

Tweeting how small the crowds were.

given a Biden inauguration will likely take place when there are still restrictions on crowds, social distancing etc. then the attendanice will almost certainly be smaller than for Trump. He’ll be enough of a dick to try and make a point about it though.

 

[tim]

Certainly a few yes, there's plenty of other people in 'the establishment' who have done pretty well out of it tho.

The reality is that that there are different establishments. However, he's clearly not part of the Washington political establishment; the Libertarian right and the remaining Koch brother don't like him because of his protectionism; he's obviously not the darling of the "MSN", but he himself feels that Fox/Murdoch are also abandoning him; He has few fans in Hollywood or amongst the Liberal New York/East Coast elites; Bezos hates him, Apple can't flourish under him and Bill Gates is up there with George Soros amongst Trumpies so I can't see him being a fan but maybe some of the other tech companies are more ambivalent; Warren Buffet is no fan; and the military top brass are apparently convinced of his cuntitude.

 

[frogwoman]

I'm not at all sure about the libertarian thing tbh. But yeah fair enough

 

[tim]

I'm not at all sure about the libertarian thing tbh. But yeah fair enough

They want Free Trade, particularly with China, that isn't Trump compatible

Despite policy wins under Trump, the Koch network isn't helping the president's reelection bid

 

[frogwoman]

They want Free Trade, particularly with China, that isn't Trump compatible

Despite policy wins under Trump, the Koch network isn't helping the president's reelection bid

Spiked et al seem fairly keen on him tbf. Aren't they funded by then?

 

[killer b]

Spiked aren't keen on him, they just use him as a lever in their tedious culture war.

 

[Yuwipi Woman]

Obviously, the people behind the Lincoln Project don't care for Trump. I was shocked how far they were willing to go to get him out. According to a 60 Minutes interview, they were willing to support Bernie Sanders if he ended up being the nominee.




I'm sure some of that was dislike for Trump and some because they figured Sanders would be a one-term President if elected.

 

[agricola]

Obviously, the people behind the Lincoln Project don't care for Trump. I was shocked how far they were willing to go to get him out. According to a 60 Minutes interview, they were willing to support Bernie Sanders if he ended up being the nominee.




I'm sure some of that was dislike for Trump and some because they figured Sanders would be a one-term President if elected.

TBF it is profoundly depressing how much better they are at attack ads than anything the DNC have come up with. If Biden does win, they'll have played a big part in it.

 

[Yuwipi Woman]

TBF it is profoundly depressing how much better they are at attack ads than anything the DNC have come up with. If Biden does win, they'll have played a big part in it.

Yep. They'll be a real force in the 2022 and 2224 elections when they turn all of that back on the Democrats. The Democrats should be taking notes.

 

[agricola]

Used the wrong lane? Why then should your vote count?

 

[Yossarian]

Used the wrong lane? Why then should your vote count?

I hope the Texas Supreme Court is different from how I imagine it.

 

[Streathamite]

think they probably are to a fair degree.

Surely it's quite a stretch to put (say) people with pre-existing conditions and on low salaries, self-employed people struggling to get healthcare, undocumented immigrants, people who benefit from DACA, DREAMers, young women needing an abortion and members of the LGBTQ+ community, all in the same bracket as old guard country club Republicans?

 

[agricola]

I hope the Texas Supreme Court is different from how I imagine it.

View attachment 236324

in Texas the posse grabs you

 

[spring-peeper]

 

[teqniq]

Comedic interlude. Sketch on the debacle of the Omaha rally:

 

[Aladdin]

Have to say this is really strong.

 

[JTG]

Kamala Harris is off to Texas - including a campaign stop in the Rio Grande Valley. Strongly Democratic but also notoriously low turn out. They clearly think something's afoot in Texas

 

[scifisam]

The only republicans who're down on Trump are those who're concerned about him doing long-term damage to the party. His political programme is all good.

Are you including republican voters in that? Because I know a few former republican voters who aren't just concerned about the party, but about Trump.

 

[JTG]

 

[JTG]

75m votes have been cast nationwide

TX is past 90% of its final '16 turn out

 

[JTG]

Have some polling: