Urban v's the Commentariat

[rekil]

Speaking of Vikings, it's the 1000th anniversary of the Battle Of Clontarf this year. What would an intersectional bien-pensant's analysis look like. A mere white on white contretemps? Or the totally fascist butchery of an ethnic minority.

 

[el-ahrairah]

i suspect we need to examine each case individually. so if you can all submit videos of your sex practices to me, i will examine each case ideaologically and put the results on twitter.

 

[el-ahrairah]

Not a single horned helmet has ever been found at any Viking archaeological site, or anywhere else, or in any contemporary accounts.

this identity shaming must stop, you cisgendered anti-viking hatemonger.

 

[butchersapron]

Speaking of Vikings, it's the 1000th anniversary of the Battle Of Clontarf this year. What would an intersectional bien-pensant's analysis look like. A mere white on white contretemps? Or the totally fascist butchery of an ethnic minority.

I think also, Alvarenga. There's some stuff going on here.

 

[frogwoman]

So ok I can see that white people (especially ones from the USA) getting their rocks off on whipping black people is tricky - although god knows sexual desire seems pretty un-PC (the old gag; Q. 'is sex dirty?' A. 'only if you're doing it right')

But what about masochism? I used to live next door to a dom and she had a nazi uniform which she kept for putting on when she had a jewish client who wanted to act out *that* scenario, quite a commonplace one for jewish masochists apparently...I mean - is he allowed to do this? Is she?

Back to the USA black/white slave game - I mean what about African-American masochists who want to play out this role? I mean you either ban masochism all together - or you can expect it to find expression in the roles and uniforms etc etc of the culturally appropriate 'most-realistic' humiliation - which will be the real life historical (or contemporaneous) version. And - back to the is-sex-dirty? gag - presumably the more taboo the humiliation the hotter it is.

Consenting adults and all that.

Its not my business what consenting adults do in the bedroom, the fact that its so out of order like slaves and slave owners and Nazis and Jews is part of what turns people on I think, if its consenting and there are no kids or animals involved you can't really decide to say that certain fetishes are off limits when its the whole being off limits thing that turns people on

 

[Ole]

Here's one American who seems to get the point:

http://publicautonomy.org/2014/01/27/the-rise-of-the-post-new-left-political-vocabulary/

"If a handful of time-travelling activists from our own era were somehow transported into a leftist political meeting in 1970, would they even be able to make themselves understood? They might begin to talk, as present-day activists do, about challenging privilege, the importance of allyship, or the need for intersectional analysis. Or they might insist that the meeting itself should be treated as a safe space. But how would the other people at the meeting react? I’m quite sure that our displaced contemporaries would be met with uncomprehending stares."

I found this quite depressing, in how seemingly accepted and definitive this 'privilege'/'calling out' jargon has become in and of the American left, especially because it looks so piss-poor side by side with the meaningful political vocabulary he contrasts it with. To be honest, I can't bring myself to sincerely refer to them as leftists or even activists. The actual political action they propose to achieve social change with seems to be limited — literally — to attempting to police people's language and actions with guilt-trips. Try and translate that into actually challenging power structures which have long since had the values that serve their power established into the fabric of society.

How do you challenge your boss using these tactics? Call them out on their boss's privilege? It's fucking useless. It's not designed to challenge power.

 

[butchersapron]

It's all academic student stuff. Private liberal college stuff. Real world stuff it's not and can't play in.

 

[J Ed]

How do you challenge your boss using these tactics? Call them out on their boss's privilege? It's fucking useless. It's not designed to challenge power.

I've thought for a while that if I were in charge of trying to hamstring any movement attempting progressive social change then I would try my best to disseminate this ideology.

 

[ska invita]

devils advocat [sic]: i gather the original round of PC language thinking came from the same liberal US universities and those ideas did trickle out to create new cultural norms over time... could more of the same happen here?

 

[butchersapron]

devils advocat [sic]: i gather the original round of PC language thinking came from the same liberal US universities and those ideas did trickle out to create new cultural norms over time... could more of the same happen here?

Cultural norms? They couldn't be further from cultural norms if they tried. They're class bolund elitist terms/worldviews and concepts.

 

[ViolentPanda]

Its not my business what consenting adults do in the bedroom, the fact that its so out of order like slaves and slave owners and Nazis and Jews is part of what turns people on I think, if its consenting and there are no kids or animals involved you can't really decide to say that certain fetishes are off limits when its the whole being off limits thing that turns people on

Transgressive sex within the bounds of legality (and, dare I say, propriety) has always been a feature of normative sexuality, however much people may have tried to imply that it isn't. I refuse to judge fetish behaviour (except adult babies) because most of it , while transgressive, isn't morally or legally repugnant.

 

[butchersapron]

Cultural norms? They couldn't be further from cultural norms if they tried. They're class bolund elitist terms/worldviews and concepts.

Seriously, the only norm this are for is for themselves. (cheers etc)

 

[J Ed]

Transgressive sex within the bounds of legality (and, dare I say, propriety) has always been a feature of normative sexuality, however much people may have tried to imply that it isn't. I refuse to judge fetish behaviour (except adult babies) because most of it , while transgressive, isn't morally or legally repugnant.

Why the exception for adult babies? Not criticising, seems weird to me. Is it cos of a link to paedophiles?

 

[co-op]

yeah telling someone they shouldn't engage in race play or bdsm or whatever because it's degrading is kind of missing the point.

Kind of.

 

[The39thStep]

The Gospel comes to New Guinea

Laurie Penny ‏@PennyRed3 hrs
I made a simple risotto for a household that'd been existing on something like Soylent; they were so excited it was like I'd fed them drugs.

 

[Idris2002]

The Gospel comes to New Guinea

For an awful moment there I thought you meant that she was actually in Papua New Guinea, where people have enough problems already.

 

[J Ed]

Risotto civilising mission lol

 

[Idris2002]

Risotto civilising mission lol

Avanti popolo, a la risotto. . .

 

[revol68]

Why the exception for adult babies? Not criticising, seems weird to me. Is it cos of a link to paedophiles?

i think it's just a joke about how weird it is, it's kinda the opposite of paedononcery.

 

[co-op]

Avanti popolo, a la risotto. . .

piatto rosso, piatto rosso

 

[frogwoman]

I found this quite depressing, in how seemingly accepted and definitive this 'privilege'/'calling out' jargon has become in and of the American left, especially because it looks so piss-poor side by side with the meaningful political vocabulary he contrasts it with. To be honest, I can't bring myself to sincerely refer to them as leftists or even activists. The actual political action they propose to achieve social change with seems to be limited — literally — to attempting to police people's language and actions with guilt-trips. Try and translate that into actually challenging power structures which have long since had the values that serve their power established into the fabric of society.

How do you challenge your boss using these tactics? Call them out on their boss's privilege? It's fucking useless. It's not designed to challenge power.

HR: If you go on strike, you could face severe consequences
Union: Check your privilege

 

[SpineyNorman]

when you quite literally get the horn

Yet more of the racism there

 

[The39thStep]

For an awful moment there I thought you meant that she was actually in Papua New Guinea, where people have enough problems already.

Could give her more to write about

 

[ViolentPanda]

I found this quite depressing, in how seemingly accepted and definitive this 'privilege'/'calling out' jargon has become in and of the American left, especially because it looks so piss-poor side by side with the meaningful political vocabulary he contrasts it with. To be honest, I can't bring myself to sincerely refer to them as leftists or even activists. The actual political action they propose to achieve social change with seems to be limited — literally — to attempting to police people's language and actions with guilt-trips. Try and translate that into actually challenging power structures which have long since had the values that serve their power established into the fabric of society.

How do you challenge your boss using these tactics? Call them out on their boss's privilege? It's fucking useless. It's not designed to challenge power.

No, it's designed to cow those who aren't invested in it, to dominate and silence opposition to the ideology, not to advance the sum of human happiness or provide an alternative politics of governance. It's top-down authoritarianism dressed up in a critique of social inequality, which it uses as a lever to open doors, rather than as a basis for formulating action.

 

[ViolentPanda]

It's all academic student stuff. Private liberal college stuff. Real world stuff it's not and can't play in.

And, as usual, it's a "social science" idea, mostly borrowed by humanities students who think a "social construction" is a council house.

 

[rekil]

HR: If you go on strike, you could face severe consequences
Union: Check your privilege

HR: I have a stack of CVs on my desk you know.
Union: <Waggly hands>
HR: ?
Union: You're ugly. It would be oppressive of me to assert my attractiveness privilege so I defer to you. STEPPING BACK!

 

[ViolentPanda]

I've thought for a while that if I were in charge of trying to hamstring any movement attempting progressive social change then I would try my best to disseminate this ideology.

As I've said before (possibly ad nauseam ), a generation ago, similar identity-based politics did for "the left" as a cohesive political force. What generally came under the aegis of "socialism" became a fractured bunch of social "isms", as everyone competed for recognition, for funding and for political dominance. Obviously, prior to that we had factions, but each faction was generally socially diverse in and of itself. After the turn to identity politics, many factions were, bluntly, monocultural.

 

[ska invita]

Cultural norms? They couldn't be further from cultural norms if they tried. They're class bolund elitist terms/worldviews and concepts.

what arent cultural norms, the first wave of PC language stuff, or this wave? Arguably the first wave werent cultural norms but are now

 

[butchersapron]

what arent cultural norms, the first wave of PC language stuff, or this wave? Arguably the first wave werent cultural norms but are now

They're not cultural norms. If you follow this logic that any private school nonsense will become a cultural norm then what are you left with? Silly post.

 

[ViolentPanda]

Why the exception for adult babies? Not criticising, seems weird to me. Is it cos of a link to paedophiles?

Nope, it's just that in my humble opinion, adult babies are beyond the pale. If you want to piss and shit yourself, fine, but don't do it wearing a babygro - have some self-respect!