Ukraine and the Russian invasion, 2022-25

[emanymton]

Yeah I have a sneaking suspicion that we are that guy saying there are no Americans near Baghdad with the Abrams in the background.

The one I keep thinking of is a series of news reports that went something like this.

Good news allied forces are now just 10 miles from Baghdad.

Good news allied forces are now just 15 miles from Baghdad.

Good news allied forces are now 12 miles from Baghdad.

But we all know how it ended and I can't help but think Russian media could be putting out something similar but the end result will be the same.

 

[elbows]

Yes, you have said it several times that you don't know, now can you stop repeating yourself and boring everyone else?

I will continue to engage with other posters when they ask a question, even when its been covered before. Your hostility towards me has been apparent for some time but it will not dissuade me from continuing to post in my usual ways. Put me on ignore if you arent interested in what I have to say.

 

[weltweit]

Yeah, but the point is that her world has just ended and she's embarking on the previously unthinkable...but you knew that, surely?

I had edited my post probably just after you quoted it.

 

[emanymton]

That's the question I think. I don't live in the UK so I'm getting my updates from live news on YouTube - Sky and NBC mainly, but I've also been tuning in to RT and it's eye-opening the difference in reporting. RT is quite obviously biased so I take it with a pinch of salt, but then that makes me think why shouldn't I take the other news sources with a pinch of salt which are, on this topic, equally as biased. I certainly wouldn't trust what people are saying on Twitter (everyone's been talking about the "Ghost of Kyiv", an ace fighter pilot picking the Russians off; when they found out it was fake they said "oh well, it's good propaganda so I'll keep believing it").

What I know from all sources is that private Ukrainian citizens are taking up arms, and Kyiv is not (yet?) in Russian hands. Take from that what you will.

And on top of all the properganda and lies there is a big helping of confusion and misinterpretation.

 

[zahir]

If this is correct then its the first report I've seen of effective use of Molotovs.

 

[eatmorecheese]

I can't keep track of the tweets and rumours right now or their veracity. Going to take a break for a bit. Too early to tell if the Russians will prevail, all is confusing.

This is how the breathless reports seem to me atm:

 

[RileyOBlimey]

I will continue to engage with other posters when they ask a question, even when its been covered before. Your hostility towards me has been apparent for some time but it will not dissuade me from continuing to post in my usual ways. Put me on ignore if you arent interested in what I have to say.

You’re actively misleading people. There’s enough FUD out there please stop this.

 

[weltweit]

Why are they putting bits of polystyrene in their Molotov Cocktails?

 

[Doctor Carrot]

Yeah, but the point is that her world has just ended and she's embarking on the previously unthinkable...but you knew that, surely?

It's a powerful image. A few days ago she's teaching, having a few drinks with friends after work, dicking about on her phone and then, days later, having to fend off an invading army and knowing there's a strong likelihood of being killed in the process.

The only way I can even begin to empathise is the fear I felt at the start of the pandemic and the panic of trying to keep vulnerable family members safe yet it's still a billion miles away from what this must feel like. The trauma of war is more than just the risk of being killed, it's your life being turned upside down and dumped on its head in a matter of hours.

 

[Sprocket.]

Why are they putting bits of polystyrene in their Molotov Cocktails?

Because it makes the mixture into homemade Napalm.

 

[Ax^]

Why are they putting bits of polystyrene in their Molotov Cocktails?

have you heard of napam

sort of the same idea make it stick when it lands

same as adding soap

 

[weltweit]

OK, nasty ..

 

[Sprocket.]

have you heard of napam

sort of the same idea make it stick when it lands

same as adding soap

Yes I was going to say a squirt of washing-up liquid adds to the burn.

 

[Ax^]

that and the choking vapour

 

[Ax^]

OK, nasty ..

well if i throw a petrol bomb at you i'm not trying to be friendly

 

[likesfish]

The Dutch are bunging a couple of hundred Stingers into the mix too…

The Netherlands to supply 200 Stinger missiles to Ukraine - DutchNews.nl

The Netherlands has agreed to ship 200 Stinger air defence missiles to Ukraine as quickly as it can, following a request by the Ukrainian government, the cabinet has agreed. ‘There was a careful but, given the circumstances, shortened check to make sure this meets weapons exports criteria,’...

www.dutchnews.nl

Stingers fucked the Russians in Afghanistan, they may still work today.

useless against high flying fast jets. But helicopters or come down low and they will kill you

 

[bimble]

Why are they putting bits of polystyrene in their Molotov Cocktails?

i think I saw the same bit of film (and didn't know why the poystyrene either).
Bunch of women all ages who were doing their totally normal stuff last week but today are sat in a local square making molotov cocktails, one of them saying well we can't do normal life anyway and doing this is less frightening than doing nothing.

Same report was saying that every day in that as-yet untargetted city they are in 2-300 wounded are being taken from the fighting elsewhere into the hospital.

 

[Bahnhof Strasse]

If this is correct then its the first report I've seen of effective use of Molotovs.

Could be anywhere, anytime. Lot of old shit being posted around on the net today.

 

[Aladdin]

You’re actively misleading people. There’s enough FUD out there please stop this.

He is allowed to respond to posters. elbows is one of the most measured, intelligent and tboughtful posters here.

 

[Bahnhof Strasse]

Why is supplying arms not the same as engaging?

At what point is that line crossed?

 

[weltweit]

Why is supplying arms not the same as engaging?

At what point is that line crossed?

Yes, I was starting to worry about that. Lots of tank killing and aircraft killing munitions heading to Ukraine and .. well ..

 

[RileyOBlimey]

He is allowed to respond to posters. elbows is one of the most measured, intelligent and tboughtful posters here.

They’ve been misleading on this thread, inappropriately so.

 

[elbows]

You’re actively misleading people. There’s enough FUD out there please stop this.

I am not actively misleading people. I made some posts about a topic you dont think belongs here (BA IT), and I have stopped talking about it here for now. If you consider something else I've said in this thread about the war to be misleading then please say what it is. I have a track record of being boring and repetitive as far as some people are concerned, not misleading, and a lot of my posts are about propaganda and trying to help people not to be misled. Meanwhile...

Tonight the situation in Kyiv is understandably very twitchy by the sounds of it. Talk has started by Ukrainians on twitter about imminent large-scale air attacks in the coming minutes, including stuff that is being retweeted by verified journalists because the sources are a Ukrainian MP and others they must think have some credibility. This stuff is one of the horrible aspects of war as rumours spread. Are we allowed to make references to these things in this thread even when we do not know if the events described will actually take place? Because in my book those fears and messages are worth highlighting in themselves, even if they dont come to fruition, they provide a glimpse of the sort of states of mind people end up with when under attack, and how quickly such messages spread.

Just one example:

 

[brogdale]

The bravery of these people...

 

[Ax^]

They’ve been misleading on this thread, inappropriately so.

you been here 5 minutes fella

wind your neck in

we are like a pub best to watch listen and understand people before gunning someone

 

[existentialist]

A bit of speculation is always going to be inevitable, and I think we could be a little kinder about how we we call it out. We are, after all, not at war.

 

[2hats]

EU airspace apparently about to be closed to all Russian aircraft.

 

[Cid]

hopefully without trying to sound like a contrarian arse in asking this question, how confident are people on here that things are actually going badly for Russia? How much of their setbacks are representative of general incompetence/poor planning vs isolated incidents or fake news significantly amplified by wishful thinking?

I’d love Putin to be falling on his arse here but I’m just not confident this is actually happening or that the information I’m seeing is representative. Maybe this is just because I have such low expectations of the world. Ukraine could just fall in 24 hours and it’ll all seem futile, like those general elections when you were sure the Tories were going to fuck up because labour had a good ground game getting the vote out and everyone was optimistically sharing pictures of young people queuing at polling stations, only for the bad guys to triumph as usual. Am I right to be this pessimistic? I mean good on all these citizens resisting invasion, but they have a hell of a fight on their hands.

I think partly this is just urban, and we're probably all harbouring a bunch of similar doubts, it's just not very helpful having to caveat everything you say. There are only so many ways to phrase 'but really it could all change tomorrow'.

 

[frogwoman]

Sorry to post a meme but this is the example of the sort of memes that are going around on Facebook right now in Russia. Putin of course now having banned the word 'war' from the media.

'L. N. Tolstoy - Special operation and peace'

 

[existentialist]

It's a powerful image. A few days ago she's teaching, having a few drinks with friends after work, dicking about on her phone and then, days later, having to fend off an invading army and knowing there's a strong likelihood of being killed in the process.

The only way I can even begin to empathise is the fear I felt at the start of the pandemic and the panic of trying to keep vulnerable family members safe yet it's still a billion miles away from what this must feel like. The trauma of war is more than just the risk of being killed, it's your life being turned upside down and dumped on its head in a matter of hours.

And, as a woman, she may have darker and greater fears...