The big Brexit thread - news, updates and discussion

[two sheds]

Not sure how we've got so many French drivers over this side though.

 

[two sheds]

or only have tailers make the ferry journey

Did wonder about that but will be a logistical exercise getting the cabs to and from the loads.

 

[TopCat]

Did wonder about that but will be a logistical exercise getting the cabs to and from the loads.

They are putting the loads on with the cabs and taking a similar one off.

 

[TopCat]

They could have done this from the start but for the French attitudes.

 

[Pickman's model]

Indeed, if you spend 2 hours at party shouting this is shit and I'm leaving, don't be surprised if one of the other party goers calls you a prick, after you've demanded taking everyone else booze, drugs and cake with you too.

Tbh if I saw Boris Johnson at a party I'd shout this is shit and I'm leaving. And then leave

 

[editor]

Let's hear it for Brexit one more time! Cabbage galore!

Could supply chain worries mean we produce more food here?
We could - though there would certainly not be the variety consumers are used to. The National Farmers' Union says the UK imports 45% of its vegetables, the vast majority of which come from the EU.
Britain also buys 84% of its fruit from overseas, although it is less dependent on the EU for these goods.
However, Spain is the biggest supplier of fruit to the UK, accounting for 19% of imports.
There are certain things we can grow here in the UK whatever the weather. For example, the UK produces 70% of cabbage and cauliflower supplies in January, rising to 90% in June.
However, that appears to be more weighted towards cabbage at the moment given that Tesco and Sainsbury's have both warned that cauliflowers could be one of the vegetables affected by the disruption.
Meanwhile, vegetables like rhubarb will always thrive here given that it likes damp cold soil.
But if difficulties continue at the border with France, or a Brexit deal makes some produce more expensive to bring into the UK, then people may find themselves having to eat whatever is seasonal.

How dependent is the UK on the EU for food?

France's ban on freight from Britain caused havoc for lorry drivers, but will it affect shoppers?

www.bbc.co.uk

 

[littlebabyjesus]

Let's hear it for Brexit one more time! Cabbage galore!

View attachment 244909

How dependent is the UK on the EU for food?

France's ban on freight from Britain caused havoc for lorry drivers, but will it affect shoppers?

www.bbc.co.uk

It's almost like the effect of spending decades as a member of a trade area with open borders and the free movement of goods and people has been to integrate various aspects of the economy, creating complex webs of dependency, with specialisations in different areas.

whodathunk?

 

[editor]

It's almost like the effect of spending decades as a member of a trade area with open borders and the free movement of goods and people has been to integrate various aspects of the economy, creating complex webs of dependency, with specialisations in different areas.

whodathunk?

Yes. But the Proud To Be British blue passports have got to be worth the pain of a winter diet of beetroots and cabbage. That'll show those Johnny Foreigners!

 

[littlebabyjesus]

The net effect of any attempt at autarky will be to make the average British person poorer. And that very much includes those tradespeople who voted to leave because they were worried about EU workers coming here and undercutting their prices.

It flies in the face of history to believe different.

 

[Flavour]

To be honest the thought of all nations being more self sufficient in food is environmentally necessary in the long run. Food miles are a huge contributor to co2, not to mention the damage caused by pesticides and so on used to grow them. A massive upswing in organic farming (even using greenhouses to grow hotter weather crops, like the Dutch do so well) would be a good thing long term. Clearly right now the UK does not have very good food security /food sovereignty.

 

[SpookyFrank]

Not sure how we've got so many French drivers over this side though.

Only place they can get a decent cup of tea.

 

[littlebabyjesus]

To be honest the thought of all nations being more self sufficient in food is environmentally necessary in the long run. Food miles are a huge contributor to co2, not to mention the damage caused by pesticides and so on used to grow them. A massive upswing in organic farming (even using greenhouses to grow hotter weather crops, like the Dutch do so well) would be a good thing long term. Clearly right now the UK does not have very good food security /food sovereignty.

All nations? Even Luxembourg? What size does a nation have to be before it should consider closing itself off? Why is something moving from Scotland to southern England, say, less destructive than something moving from France to southern England?

Sharing sovereignty/security isn't necessarily a bad thing. Should the nation state be the unit of self-sufficiency? Why?

I agree with the wider point about changing how we grow, distribute and consume our food, but this is not the way to fix it.

 

[teuchter]

What, the lorry drivers in the car park? Everybody who won’t be able to buy food?

It's unclear why you think his comments are aimed at the lorry drivers, or everyone who won't be able to buy food.
It says "some thought they would remain open with or without the EU".

 

[Flavour]

Obviously the nation state shouldn't be the unit, but in the context of this situation, unfortunately it is. I am in favor of community self-sufficiency down to the lowest practicable level. Households,streets, communities. Even Luxembourgs

 

[teuchter]

Food miles are a huge contributor to co2, not to mention the damage caused by pesticides and so on used to grow them. A massive upswing in organic farming (even using greenhouses to grow hotter weather crops, like the Dutch do so well) would be a good thing long term.

This, as far as I know, is basically not correct. There are food miles and there are food miles. In many cases, it uses less energy to grow the stuff somewhere else, and then transport it, than it would to try and grow it here. Nor is organic farming any kind of magic answer to food production.

 

[littlebabyjesus]

Obviously the nation state shouldn't be the unit, but in the context of this situation, unfortunately it is. I am in favor of community self-sufficiency down to the lowest practicable level. Households,streets, communities. Even Luxembourgs

Most of us live in towns and cities. Food necessarily has to be grown elsewhere. And often there are better places to grow it than right next to the town/city - more efficient places to grow it even with a few more food miles thrown in.

 

[teuchter]

Obviously the nation state shouldn't be the unit, but in the context of this situation, unfortunately it is. I am in favor of community self-sufficiency down to the lowest practicable level. Households,streets, communities. Even Luxembourgs

That level is "global" without massive changes to lifestyle that most people simply aren't going to accept.

 

[The39thStep]

 

[DJWrongspeed]

I think they should sign the deal in Deal! There's that pub near there where you can get a French phone signal, should suit everyone.

 

[not-bono-ever]

Not sure how we've got so many French drivers over this side though.

Not so much french as Central Europeans - these poor fuckers spend weeks on the road at a time, cabotaging their way around Europe and beyond.

 

[Chz]

To be honest the thought of all nations being more self sufficient in food is environmentally necessary in the long run. Food miles are a huge contributor to co2, not to mention the damage caused by pesticides and so on used to grow them. A massive upswing in organic farming (even using greenhouses to grow hotter weather crops, like the Dutch do so well) would be a good thing long term. Clearly right now the UK does not have very good food security /food sovereignty.

Food miles aren't as big a contributor as heating greenhouses and polytunnels is.

Everything you thought about the carbon footprint of imported food is wrong, says top professor

Bananas from Dominican Republic and apples from New Zealand are among the most carbon-friendly foods

www.independent.co.uk

 

[tommers]

I really like cabbage so no worries.

 

[TopCat]

Supermarket was heaving with fresh fruit and lettuce today.

 

[Flavour]

That level is "global" without massive changes to lifestyle that most people simply aren't going to accept.

Tough fucking shit. With the ongoing climate crisis people will have no choice but to accept these changes to their precious lifestyles

 

[tommers]

Supermarket was heaving with fresh fruit and lettuce today.

Yeah it'll be a while yet.

 

[bimble]

Supermarket was heaving with fresh fruit and lettuce today.

Same here. Lemons and everything.

 

[Flavour]

Food miles aren't as big a contributor as heating greenhouses and polytunnels is.

Everything you thought about the carbon footprint of imported food is wrong, says top professor

Bananas from Dominican Republic and apples from New Zealand are among the most carbon-friendly foods

www.independent.co.uk

This is bollocks. And I said nothing about heating said greenhouses, nor polytunnels. Food miles are bad, end of story. People just want to justify it because the thought of relying on what can be grown locally offends their middle class privilege. But that was largely how the world worked until very very recently. We're all spoilt silly by globalization. Growing your own food is one of the most radical things you can do. It's not just about the food as the system which delivers it -in the case of your imported avocados and cashews and so on it is exploitative, environmentally damaging and corporately manged.

 

[TopCat]

There will be loads of Kale available. Remainers love Kale.

 

[teuchter]

Tough fucking shit. With the ongoing climate crisis people will have no choice but to accept these changes to their precious lifestyles

There are plenty of better choices than wrongheaded dogmatic localism.

 

[bimble]

Lufhansa is coming to rescue us ?