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SWP expulsions and squabbles

I think it is fair to say the SWP was very badly damaged by L'affaire Delta - the loss of student members is a real problem that will probably get worse over time as members continue ageing. But they still have a cadre, a presence in some unions, campaigns, localities - they won't fade away - only a serious challenge by a rival group to take over their 'duties' would have a dramatic effect , I think . Which doesn't look that likely. Incidentally, looks like they have recovered slightly (tho certainly not back to their heights) in terms of speakers for next Maxism.
 
In lots of areas they have simply faded away...there used to be a regular presence in se london...sales in woolwich, greenwich, deptford, plumstead, thamesmead, lewisham, bromley and bexley on saturdays, there was a big presence in greenwich council, greenwich nut, lewisham council, and regular sales at post offices and bus garages across the area...now I never see a swp seller in se london , especially wherei live and work in the borough of greenwich.
They may have lots of older members whose personal and social lives are intertwined in the swp, but imo any members with a real life have drifted or walked away...that dont add up to a cadre imo, it kind of adds up to a group of sad individuals who
 
comrade spurski said:
They may have lots of older members whose personal and social lives are intertwined in the swp, but imo any members with a real life have drifted or walked away...that dont add up to a cadre imo, it kind of adds up to a group of sad individuals who
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Your explanation of how political loyalty is cemented in the SWP is true, I think. The same thing happens in umpteen other sects and also in bigger more important political groups. On the other hand, I'm not sure why you have to be so contemptuous of the individuals and their personal loyalties. I despise the SWP. It's a daft deluded slogan-spewing Islamophile cult run by dishonest third-rate Trot bossy-boots. But I don't doubt that the lives and personal relationships of the people foolish enough to be long-term members are just as real as yours or mine or anyone else's.
 
JHE said:
Your explanation of how political loyalty is cemented in the SWP is true, I think. The same thing happens in umpteen other sects and also in bigger more important political groups. On the other hand, I'm not sure why you have to be so contemptuous of the individuals and their personal loyalties. I despise the SWP. It's a daft deluded slogan-spewing Islamophile cult run by dishonest third-rate Trot bossy-boots. But I don't doubt that the lives and personal relationships of the people foolish enough to be long-term members are just as real as yours or mine or anyone else's.
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Before the delta issue I would not have been so contemptuous or rude about swp members as a whole but I can not find any other reason for some one who claims to be a socialist to remain a member...imho any socialist with a life outside the swp would have realised what a terrible injustice it inflicted on the women involved and how unsocialist the swp behaved...therefore any one who remained an swp member has no life outside the swp ... or they think rape is ok which I dont think they do. But it is just my personal opinion
 
Scribbling S said:
I think it is fair to say the SWP was very badly damaged by L'affaire Delta - the loss of student members is a real problem that will probably get worse over time as members continue ageing. But they still have a cadre, a presence in some unions, campaigns, localities - they won't fade away - only a serious challenge by a rival group to take over their 'duties' would have a dramatic effect , I think . Which doesn't look that likely. Incidentally, looks like they have recovered slightly (tho certainly not back to their heights) in terms of speakers for next Maxism.
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Birchall speaking i see. And Sheridan. Hmmm. What a good tactical move.
 
There was an evening paperssale at Dalston a month or so back with 4 older members. Plus a very old member a little way down the street asking people to sign a petition "against racism".

And they had a presence at the Duggan vigil outside Tottenham police station.

So they are still about in North London. But nowhere near as ubiquitous as they were.
 
Oisin123 said:
Once, when Andy Wilson and I wanted to make sure we got to speak in a Marxism meeting - and also because we knew it would have a head-wrecking effect - we came early and sat in the front row, slightly to the right seats that the CC invariably occupied. We had a gentle request to move, I think, but no serious force was applied. And as the CC members came in, it was amusing to see them halt, decide they didn't want to sit next to us and look around for alternatives. It's hard now to capture how defiant this act was and how liberating, because it's hard to remember a time when I was intimidated at the prospect of incurring the wrath of the party apparatus.
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Someone less generous spirited than me (!) might think you only found it so liberating because you were both previously so conscious of your relative positions in the pecking order and perhaps a little jealous. Those of us without a hint of careerism were never that bothered by people who'd earned a position of leadership having a seat at the front to be honest.
 
bolshiebhoy said:
Someone less generous spirited than me (!) might think you only found it so liberating because you were both previously so conscious of your relative positions in the pecking order and perhaps a little jealous. Those of us without a hint of careerism were never that bothered by people who'd earned a position of leadership having a seat at the front to be honest.
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cheers for the giggles. :D
 
bolshiebhoy said:
Someone less generous spirited than me (!) might think you only found it so liberating because you were both previously so conscious of your relative positions in the pecking order and perhaps a little jealous. Those of us without a hint of careerism were never that bothered by people who'd earned a position of leadership having a seat at the front to be honest.
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The swp is the place for those who know their place
 
tony.c said:
The Central Committee and some full timers also got a flat each to themselves at the Easter rally in the Skegness miners' holiday camp. The ordinary rank and file members were three to a room.
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To save BB the bother, I've just paraphrased part of his answer above in reply to this:
"never that bothered by people who'd earned a position of leadership having flats to themselves."

They earned it comrades. Quit complaining.
 
tony.c said:
The Central Committee and some full timers also got a flat each to themselves at the Easter rally in the Skegness miners' holiday camp. The ordinary rank and file members were three to a room.
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“The creatures outside looked from pig to man, and from man to pig, and from pig to man again; but already it was impossible to say which was which.”
 
treelover said:
“The creatures outside looked from pig to man, and from man to pig, and from pig to man again; but already it was impossible to say which was which.”
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That one is a pig and that one is a man. Simple. Doesn't say much of their/his expectations of the w/c if they're so thick they can't tell man from pig.
 
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