Should there be a second referendum? New question.

[Athos]

The only referendum I could see working would involve voting on a specific deal, and look something like:

Q1 Should we...
Accept the deal
Reject the deal

Q2 Regardless of how you voted in Q1, if the deal is rejected, should we...
Cancel Brexit
Renegotiate
Go out without one

 

[mojo pixy]

Should the people of the UK
a) have a mass brawl
b) block each other

 

[A380]

We should go back to plucky wessex taking on the danelaw

No Hard Border on the River Lea/A5 corridor!

Bedford would be choked with lorries on the County Bridge customs post.

 

[A380]

The only way to start to heal the rifts in our society is to have a second vote but allow each side to write the others’ question:

In relation to the EU:

“Please indicate by marking one box.

I am a remoner traitor who spits on the grave of Churchill and wants us to be in thrall to the EUSSR as long as avocados and quinoa are available in my long haired homosexual metropolitan enclaves.

Or

I hate black people and Poles.”

That should do it.

 

[cupid_stunt]

Q2 Regardless of how you voted in Q1, if the deal is rejected, should we...
Cancel Brexit
Renegotiate
Go out without one

I can't see any question having one remain answer and two leave options, it would be a right pickle if the remain option got less than 50%, but had the largest single result.

 

[Athos]

I can't see any question having one remain answer and two leave options, it would be a right pickle if the remain option got less than 50%, but had the largest single result.

There aren't two leave options. There's one leave (go without a deal), one remain (cancel Brexit), and a middle ground - renegotiate. Whether those renegotiations would ultimately result in leave or remain would depend upon the terms of any renegotiated deal. That new proposed deal would be bought back to the public in the same terms.

Eventually the public would decide to accept the terms of a particular deal, to leave without a deal, or to cancel Brexit. But everyone would know the specifics of what they were voting on.

 

[cupid_stunt]

There aren't two leave options. There's one leave (go without a deal), one remain (cancel Brexit), and a middle ground - renegotiate. Whether those renegotiations would ultimately result in leave or remain would depend upon the terms of any renegotiated deal.

It's an implied leave option, as any renegotiation would be concerning leaving, and as such would split the leave vote.

 

[Idris2002]

Maybe if there's a no-deal crash-out - "England" will revert to Wessex and Mercia, or is that going back too far even for brexit enthusiasts?

We should go back to plucky wessex taking on the danelaw

If the situation is a febrile, and the atmosphere as charged, as this link suggests, you may yet get your wish:

‘I witnessed the collapse of the Soviet Union and Brexit Britain’s situation is just as precarious’

 

[xenon]

Again some of you are still clinging to this idea that no deal can't happen.

It's the default.

Oh but parlament will call for a vote blah blah.
you seriously trust there's enough coordination, competence and collective sense of responsibility amongst that lot to stop no deal. We must be in different timelines...

Even if I had a higher opinion of the collective talent and conscientiousness of the HoC, stupendous things can and do happen as a result of collective paralisys, errors of perspective.

 

[Athos]

It's an implied leave option, as any renegotiation would be concerning leaving, and as such would split the leave vote.

No, it's not. It would be require a further vote on any renegotiated deal. That could go either way. It's a 'wait and see what leaving will mean before we decide' option.

I'm any event, there can't be a single, homogeneous leave vote, as the conditions of leaving are very different.

But, maybe a solution would be for Q2 to be:

If we reject...
a) reject the deal and cancel Brexit
b) reject and don't cancel Brexit

With a third question:

In the event of b...
i) leave with no deal
ii) renegotiate.

 

[cupid_stunt]

 

[A380]

Gosh, who knew referenda on complex multifaceted issues would be hard?

Oh yes, just about any fucker who’d given it more than 20 seconds thought.

 

[cupid_stunt]

I've only just spotted Athos' edit in the above post, so their proposal is now 3 fucking questions.

Q1 Should we...
a) Accept the deal
b) Reject the deal

Q2 If we reject...
a) reject the deal and cancel Brexit
b) reject and don't cancel Brexit

Q3 In the event of b...
a) leave with no deal
i) renegotiate.

Q1 - all remainers & a large number of leavers will reject the deal, so we know the answer to that question, and therefore it's totally pointless.

Q2 - is basically 'in' or [try to get] 'out'.

Q3 - all remainers & a large number of leavers will go for renegotiate, so we know the answer to that question, and therefore it's totally pointless.

We may as well go for the Official Monster Raving Loony Party suggestion of:
a) in
b) out
c) shake it all about

 

[Kaka Tim]

No, it's not. It would be require a further vote on any renegotiated deal. That could go either way. It's a 'wait and see what leaving will mean before we decide' option.

I'm any event, there can't be a single, homogeneous leave vote, as the conditions of leaving are very different.

But, maybe a solution would be for Q2 to be:

If we reject...
a) reject the deal and cancel Brexit
b) reject and don't cancel Brexit

With a third question:

In the event of b...
i) leave with no deal
ii) renegotiate.

fuck me - its less of a referendum and more of a "choose your own adventure" book.

 

[Athos]

I've only just spotted Athos' edit in the above post, so their proposal is now 3 fucking questions.

Q1 Should we...
a) Accept the deal
b) Reject the deal

Q2 If we reject...
a) reject the deal and cancel Brexit
b) reject and don't cancel Brexit

Q3 In the event of b...
a) leave with no deal
i) renegotiate.

Q1 - all remainers & a large number of leavers will reject the deal, so we know the answer to that question, and therefore it's totally pointless.

Q2 - is basically 'in' or [try to get] 'out'.

Q3 - all remainers & a large number of leavers will go for renegotiate, so we know the answer to that question, and therefore it's totally pointless.

We may as well go for the Official Monster Raving Loony Party suggestion of:
a) in
b) out
c) shake it all about

I don't think three questions would overly-tax most people.

Nobody knows what the answers will be.

But, the point is it's an iterative process, such that the same three questions are asked for each proposed deal. It would mean that people know what they're actually voting on.

Eventually, there'l be a deal most people prefer to the alternatives, or they'll realise there's no chance or reaching such a deal and either leave without a deal or stay in.

It may not be perfect, but, given the starting point I can't see any less bad alternatives. can you?

 

[littlebabyjesus]

I've only just spotted Athos' edit in the above post, so their proposal is now 3 fucking questions.

Q1 Should we...
a) Accept the deal
b) Reject the deal

Q2 If we reject...
a) reject the deal and cancel Brexit
b) reject and don't cancel Brexit

Q3 In the event of b...
a) leave with no deal
i) renegotiate.

Q1 - all remainers & a large number of leavers will reject the deal, so we know the answer to that question, and therefore it's totally pointless.

Q2 - is basically 'in' or [try to get] 'out'.

Q3 - all remainers & a large number of leavers will go for renegotiate, so we know the answer to that question, and therefore it's totally pointless.

We may as well go for the Official Monster Raving Loony Party suggestion of:
a) in
b) out
c) shake it all about

So we just have a version of question 2: cancel or renegotiate.

If it's 'renegotiate', you get another shit deal that's rejected by parliament and you have a third ref: cancel or renegotiate. And so on, ad infinitum. It could become an annual thing, like Strictly.

 

[killer b]

Gosh, who knew referenda on complex multifaceted issues would be hard?

Oh yes, just about any fucker who’d given it more than 20 seconds thought.

Isn't this the same for any public vote?

 

[Yossarian]

The only way to start to heal the rifts in our society is to have a second vote but allow each side to write the others’ question:

In relation to the EU:

“Please indicate by marking one box.

I am a remoner traitor who spits on the grave of Churchill and wants us to be in thrall to the EUSSR as long as avocados and quinoa are available in my long haired homosexual metropolitan enclaves.

Or

I hate black people and Poles.”

That should do it.

Or they could tack on extra issues to mix it up a little.

"Should Britain

A) Remain in the European Union and reintroduce the death penalty for murderers

or

B) Leave the European Union and legalise marijuana for recreational usage"

 

[sleaterkinney]

Surely:

A) Full Communism
B) May's deal
C) Remain

 

[A380]

Isn't this the same for any public vote?

Careful, you’ll get people coming along saying that by writing this it shows you hate the working class...

 

[killer b]

Careful, you’ll get people coming along saying that by writing this it shows you hate the working class...

What?

 

[A380]

What?

Just wait and see. I did try to warn you.

 

[A380]

fuck me - its less of a referendum and more of a "choose your own adventure" book.

Now that would be fucking awesome.

The Brexit of Firetop Mountain.

Page 1:

“After a long climb you enter a room where a strange ritual is taking place. The severed head of a pig forms the centepiece.”

If you fuck the pig head go to page...

 

[killer b]

I don't get why a referendum on something like this is any more complex than a general election is all. Unless you're arguing for no elections ever and technocratic governance, you have to accept that some (actually, all) electors won't have a complete understanding of the issues at play.

 

[littlebabyjesus]

Now that would be fucking awesome.

The Brexit of Firetop Mountain.

Page 1:

“After a long climb you enter a room where a strange ritual is taking place. The severed head of a pig forms the centepiece.”

If you fuck the pig head go to page...

Great way to get young people to participate as well.

 

[A380]

Great way to get young people to participate as well.

One orc one vote.

 

[andysays]

No, it's not. It would be require a further vote on any renegotiated deal. That could go either way. It's a 'wait and see what leaving will mean before we decide' option.

I'm any event, there can't be a single, homogeneous leave vote, as the conditions of leaving are very different.

But, maybe a solution would be for Q2 to be:

If we reject...
a) reject the deal and cancel Brexit
b) reject and don't cancel Brexit

With a third question:

In the event of b...
i) leave with no deal
ii) renegotiate.

This is why the answer to the original question is 'no', at this point a single referendum wouldn't solve anything, we'd need a whole series to sort things out and even then some people would complain that the questions were wrong or there should have been a ranking system rather than a serious of binary questions or some other nonsense...

 

[A380]

This is why the answer to the original question is 'no', at this point a single referendum wouldn't solve anything, we'd need a whole series to sort things out and even then some people would complain that the questions were wrong or there should have been a ranking system rather than a serious of binary questions or some other nonsense...

How about a sorting it all out with a giant version of Run Around.

We could tarmac over the entire Isle of Wight and get a neutral - probably a Canadian, they are good at that kind of thing, I’d go for Chris Hadfield or Pamela Anderson - to climb up a really tall crane and shout out different options along a decision tree. We, the Entire UK population that is, could then dose up on Happy Shopper Orangeaid and cheap amphetamine and run to the relevant zones of the island when a klaxon sounded till the true will of the majority was known.

I reckon we could have the while thing done and dusted over the Whitsun bank holiday weekend.

 

[sleaterkinney]

Or

A) sMASH the neoliberal bourgeois
B) Hang all the immigrants
C) Remain

 

[Pickman's model]

How about a sorting it all out with a giant version of Run Around.

We could tarmac over the entire Isle of Wight and get a neutral - probably a Canadian, they are good at that kind of thing, I’d go for Chris Hadfield or Pamela Anderson - to climb up a really tall crane and shout out different options along a decision tree. We, the Entire UK population that is, could then dose up on Happy Shopper Orangeaid and cheap amphetamine and run to the relevant zones of the island when a klaxon sounded till the true will of the majority was known.

I reckon we could have the while thing done nd dusted over the Whitsun bank holiday weekend.

william shatner