P&O Ferries sacks workers and docks ships
- Thread starter wemakeyousoundb
- Start date
teuchter
je suis teuchter
What's happened is that Lexit and its proponents have failed these workers, and the EU has saved them.
Brexit was sold to people with the idea that it would stop foreigners coming and taking their jobs. Of course that was nonsense, but Lexiteers were happy to go along with it anyway.
Predictably enough, post Brexit there were some attempts to reduce workers' rights and the only reason these couldn't go through is the deal the UK had to make with the EU that this wasn't allowed.
Hope that clarifies everything, and urban75's brexit fantasists are proud of what they've done, or rather, what they've failed to do, whatever nonsense it was that they claimed was going to be possible.
Louis MacNeice
Autumn Journalist
It is P&O that is responsible; they are taking advantage of more than four decades of assertive anti-working class activity in this country.
Cheers - Louis MacNeice
MickiQ
In My Defence I was left Unsupervised
Yes the whole Lexit thing was a delusional fantasy at best. But saying "Something that didn't happen and never could have happened is responsible for Something that has actually happened"is a bit of a stretch even for you.
teuchter
je suis teuchter
Maybe that's why I didn't say it.
The39thStep
Urban critical thinker
A great pity that Urban doesn't have a Children's Section that we could put this post in.
The39thStep
Urban critical thinker
Hope you are recovering or better now MrSki
DaveCinzano
WATCH OUT, GEORGE, HE'S GOT A SCREWDRIVER!
Dulwich Hamlet FC
Unofficial forum for Dulwich Hamlet FC, with the latest news stories, results and fixtures, photos, chat and general banter
www.urban75.net
Smokeandsteam
Working Class First
A thank you to Brexiteers.
A thank you to all the Brexiteers on the boards for not rubbing my nose in all the benefits that Brexit has achieved. It is very kind of you not to gloat in all that you won.
www.urban75.net
MrSki
Who am I to say you're wrong
Well I feel a lot better & have stopped vomiting blood but am still having a load of tests to try and work out exactly what is wrong.
Certainly feel a lot more positive than this time last week when I was on a drip & Nil by Mouth. Thought I was a goner.
Thanks The39thStep
Smokeandsteam
Working Class First
Latest from the RMT…£1.80 per hour for the new P&O workers….
not-bono-ever
meh
Fucking hell
Smokeandsteam
Working Class First
The thing that really boils my piss is that had P&O sent an HR1 form to BEIS and 'consulted' the unions respectable opinion wouldn't have batted an eyelid at this..
Pickman's model
Starry Wisdom
onwards and upwards
Pickman's model
Starry Wisdom
no self-respecting child would publish such shite
Pickman's model
Starry Wisdom
once again he reaches down the toilet bowl that is his mind and fetches up an auld shit
Chz
Stark Raving Sane
They were told this isn't the time or place and they politely went away as requested, I believe.
But you've baited out teuchter now, and that's just mean to him.More relevant to the discussion, the official line from HM Gov right now is "Okay, we knew about it the day before". Now how long do you think they actually knew before it happened? It seems improbable that someone, somewhere didn't know well in advance and decided not to share. Or maybe they did share, knowing this lot, and they didn't care. Will there be any investigation at all? And if there is, will Chris Grayling somehow return to be a scapegoat again?
hitmouse
music obfuscation technology
A second bus from Glasgow to Cairnryan is now being organised, for any urban weegies/weegie-knowers:
The39thStep
Urban critical thinker
To be perfectly frank I'm more interested on the tactics of the RMT and how solidarity can be built than wondering about whether there will be an investigation.They were told this isn't the time or place and they politely went away as requested, I believe.
More relevant to the discussion, the official line from HM Gov right now is "Okay, we knew about it the day before". Now how long do you think they actually knew before it happened? It seems improbable that someone, somewhere didn't know well in advance and decided not to share. Or maybe they did share, knowing this lot, and they didn't care. Will there be any investigation at all? And if there is, will Chris Grayling somehow return to be a scapegoat again?
Smokeandsteam
Working Class First
The Labour motion, which I’ll try to find and post, has passed in the HoC by 211 votes to 0.
Text is in the story in the link. Very, very significant that the Tories didn’t feel able to vote against, especially given that the motion calls on the government to “suspend the contracts and licences of DP World and remove them from the government’s transport advisory group; and further calls on the government to bring forward a bill urgently to outlaw fire and rehire and strengthen workers’ rights.”
labourlist.org
Text is in the story in the link. Very, very significant that the Tories didn’t feel able to vote against, especially given that the motion calls on the government to “suspend the contracts and licences of DP World and remove them from the government’s transport advisory group; and further calls on the government to bring forward a bill urgently to outlaw fire and rehire and strengthen workers’ rights.”
Labour motion demanding action against P&O passes as Tories abstain - LabourList
MPs have passed a Labour motion calling on the government to take action against P&O Ferries’ parent company…
labourlist.org
Bingoman
Well-Known Member
Using slave labour now?
P&O Ferries: welcome to Johnson’s low-tax, low-regulation, union-free economy - Yorkshire Bylines
Right-wing outrage at P&O Ferries highlights the contradictions at the heart of Tory policies towards workers' and trade union rights
yorkshirebylines.co.uk
Tl;dr... Tories voted against protecting against this in October. Indeed, low regulation is the post-Brexit goal, so expect it to become commonplace.
Bahnhof Strasse
Met up with Hannah Courtoy a week next Tuesday
^^^P&O Ferries: welcome to Johnson’s low-tax, low-regulation, union-free economy - Yorkshire Bylines
Right-wing outrage at P&O Ferries highlights the contradictions at the heart of Tory policies towards workers' and trade union rights
Tl;dr... Tories voted against protecting against this in October. Indeed, low regulation is the post-Brexit goal, so expect it to become commonplace.
More rubbish from people with appalling politics.
State broadcaster: New P&O crew on less than £2 an hour, union claims
Their ferries run from the UK to France, Ireland and Holland (all in the EU), they are registered in Cyprus (also in the EU). They should not be allowed to give terms based on where the ship is registered when all it ever does is go between two countries, (or even domestically from Scotland to NI). e.g. Dover-Calais must be either UK or French law. That is what needs to change.
Cunts leaping on 800 workers being sacked in the most dubious manner to push their anti-Brexit agenda really need to have a fucking word with themselves.
I wasn't sure whether you'd reply with a "Whoops-a-daisy! Silly me for enabling Tory wet dreams" or double down with faux righteousness and bluster, so thanks for clearing that up.
Smokeandsteam
Working Class First
So, in the here and now the issue is what can be done to fight for the reinstatement of the 800 jobs, and what can be done to widen and deepen the fight against the anti trade union laws pressuring Labour in particular to make commitments. The article you’ve posted has nothing to say about either issue.
I can’t be certain what point you think your making but it’s almost certainly not one that adds anything
Bahnhof Strasse
Met up with Hannah Courtoy a week next Tuesday
800 people sacked and it would have happened regardless of Brexit.
You have gleefully jumped on these 800 family’s nightmare to peddle lies to support your political agenda.
Scummy cunt.
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not-bono-ever
meh
experienced filipeno seamen / non officers, get about 3 quid an hour or did a few years ago. All qualified and well experienced. when i heard about this, i assume they were Philippeners as its pretty normal these days. Im sure the masters would be kept on if they wanted, if only for the experience- but with the channel lot, you dont see much of the professional crew as they are a bit busy. its a bit of a saving for the owners if it pans out with indian crews- but would mean long long hours, as there is no way they can do the existing 2 week on/ 2 weeks off arrangement and go home for the fortnight like the UK and french crews do- the whole ship would be self contained for possibly months at a time.
MickiQ
In My Defence I was left Unsupervised
Realistically I think the possibility of those 800 people simply being re-instated is virtually nil, P&O Ferries are a private business concern and even if it wanted (and it doesn't no matter what it might say to the contrary) the Govt has no power to compel P&O to rehire. Nationalisation is simply not going to happen in the current political and financial environment no matter how much the RMT call for it.
It is possible that public pressure might persuade P&O to change or partially change it's mind but tbh why would anyone really want to work for such an employer after this? (beyond the short term consideration of paying the bills whilst desperately looking for a better job). morale is not going to be high.
The best thing for the redundant staff is for the RMT to take P&O Ferries to court and screw as much compo as possible out of them, again public pressure probably will help here.
Longer term 2 things needs to happen.
Firstly P&O Ferries need to go bust and allow other ferry companies to hoover up their assets at a discount price, hopefully the management of those have taken note of what's happening and are denying knowledge of any similar plans.
I'm in 2 minds about whether this will happen, they're currently losing extra money on top of the money they were losing that caused them to come up with this barmpot scheme in the first place so they will want to get ferries sailing as soon as possible.
If they're operating with all Indian crews on low wages then every time someone uses them then it will be a reminder but P&O Ferries will be able to lower prices which might very well undermine any long term support for the sacked workers.
One thing that might yet change everything is how the French and Irish especially the first react, I can well imagine French dock workers making life very difficult for P&O in a way that UK ones can't.
Secondly the law needs to be changed, Fire and Rehire needs to be outlawed and whilst we can't change International Maritime Law we can certainly impose restrictions on ships entering UK Ports and operating in UK waters. Ships that do nothing but sail back and forth between Scotland/Ireland or England/France being registered in the Bahamas is just plain ridiculous and I am sure restrictions can be imposed on Cross Channel ferries that won't impact on international trade.
However let's be realistic the laws aren't going to be changed without a more employee (as opposed to an employer) friendly Govt and that isn't likely for the best part of a decade yet.
It is possible that public pressure might persuade P&O to change or partially change it's mind but tbh why would anyone really want to work for such an employer after this? (beyond the short term consideration of paying the bills whilst desperately looking for a better job). morale is not going to be high.
The best thing for the redundant staff is for the RMT to take P&O Ferries to court and screw as much compo as possible out of them, again public pressure probably will help here.
Longer term 2 things needs to happen.
Firstly P&O Ferries need to go bust and allow other ferry companies to hoover up their assets at a discount price, hopefully the management of those have taken note of what's happening and are denying knowledge of any similar plans.
I'm in 2 minds about whether this will happen, they're currently losing extra money on top of the money they were losing that caused them to come up with this barmpot scheme in the first place so they will want to get ferries sailing as soon as possible.
If they're operating with all Indian crews on low wages then every time someone uses them then it will be a reminder but P&O Ferries will be able to lower prices which might very well undermine any long term support for the sacked workers.
One thing that might yet change everything is how the French and Irish especially the first react, I can well imagine French dock workers making life very difficult for P&O in a way that UK ones can't.
Secondly the law needs to be changed, Fire and Rehire needs to be outlawed and whilst we can't change International Maritime Law we can certainly impose restrictions on ships entering UK Ports and operating in UK waters. Ships that do nothing but sail back and forth between Scotland/Ireland or England/France being registered in the Bahamas is just plain ridiculous and I am sure restrictions can be imposed on Cross Channel ferries that won't impact on international trade.
However let's be realistic the laws aren't going to be changed without a more employee (as opposed to an employer) friendly Govt and that isn't likely for the best part of a decade yet.
not-bono-ever
meh
does seem a curiously brutal event- maybe DP are angling for them to be taken over and and compensated by UKG
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