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Liverpool 2013-14

I can't see Suarez being sold for anything thwn what Madrid paid for Bale.
At the end of the day Suarez was given a contract to put and shut up.
 
I don't care where he goes, I just want him out of the Prem. The way pundits have brushed aside his racism due to his footballing excellence this season has been disgraceful.
 
Corax said:
I don't care where he goes, I just want him out of the Prem. The way pundits have brushed aside his racism due to his footballing excellence this season has been disgraceful.
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I think he might have been using a plausible deniabilty strategy or he might have been using the word "negro" the way that people in Latin America use it to each other. Maybe he really was being racist, but maybe not. I'm a bit tired of people being so sure about it though. It's not clear-cut at all.The FA report was totally inconclusive in its evidence and then just found him guilty at the end anyway.

I think he's sneaky, he'd sell his grandma and he might be capable of stooping to all sorts. His "racism" is unproven though. You've fallen for the circus around it.
 
Favelado said:
I think he might have been using a plausible deniabilty strategy or he might have been using the word "negro" the way that people in Latin America use it to each other. Maybe he really was being racist, but maybe not. I'm a bit tired of people being so sure about it though. It's not clear-cut at all.The FA report was totally inconclusive in its evidence and then just found him guilty at the end anyway.

I think he's sneaky, he'd sell his grandma and he might be capable of stooping to all sorts. His "racism" is unproven though. You've fallen for the circus around it.
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Not again...
 
Lo Siento. said:
Not again...
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Yeah I know.

Look, I'm not saying he's not guilty - the accusations could be largely true - but I just invite anyone to read the FA report in full. Evra and Suárez both come across as awful bullshitters and there's loads of stuff that's inconclusive, plenty more that's ambiguous and I think all we can really say is we don't know.
 
Favelado said:
Yeah I know.

Look, I'm not saying he's not guilty - the accusations could be largely true - but I just invite anyone to read the FA report in full. Evra and Suárez both come across as awful bullshitters and there's loads of stuff that's inconclusive, plenty more that's ambiguous and I think all we can really say is we don't know.
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Even if Suarez said exactly what he claims to have said, it's still racist to address someone as "negro", especially in the context of an argument with someone with a stranger. Even within Uruguayan cultural norms it's racist. (& as an aside, cultural norms that permit people to be casually addressed as nothing more than their ethnicity are racist, however friendly the intent)
 
Favelado said:
I think he might have been using a plausible deniabilty strategy or he might have been using the word "negro" the way that people in Latin America use it to each other. Maybe he really was being racist, but maybe not. I'm a bit tired of people being so sure about it though. It's not clear-cut at all.The FA report was totally inconclusive in its evidence and then just found him guilty at the end anyway.

I think he's sneaky, he'd sell his grandma and he might be capable of stooping to all sorts. His "racism" is unproven though. You've fallen for the circus around it.
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"I kicked you because you're black "

That bit went weirdly under-reported for some reason, with all the focus being on the use of "negrito". Which I still find pretty inexplicable tbh.

So yeah, that's why I want him gone. And I can honestly promise I'd feel just the same (probably *more*, in fact) if he had a chicken badge on his shirt.
 
Lo Siento. said:
Even if Suarez said exactly what he claims to have said, it's still racist to address someone as "negro", especially in the context of an argument with someone with a stranger. Even within Uruguayan cultural norms it's racist. (& as an aside, cultural norms that permit people to be casually addressed as nothing more than their ethnicity are racist, however friendly the intent)
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In the middle of an argument yes, not necessarily as your opening gambit.

I agree that the cultural norms that have lead to this situation are racist. I absolutely agree with that and think it's an important societal point. Maybe an exception in Brazil where people are identified and self-identify as "white" in a way they aren't in Spanish speaking countries (hair-colour being used instead of skin colour which gives a real insight into the racist evolution of it).
 
Corax said:
"I kicked you because you're black "

That bit went weirdly under-reported for some reason, with all the focus being on the use of "negrito". Which I still find pretty inexplicable tbh.

So yeah, that's why I want him gone. And I can honestly promise I'd feel just the same (probably *more*, in fact) if he had a chicken badge on his shirt.
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That quote is unconfirmed I believe. It was in Evra's testimony and not confirmed by video evidence, and was contradicted by Suárez.
 
Favelado said:
In the middle of an argument yes, not necessarily as your opening gambit.

I agree that the cultural norms that have lead to this situation are racist. I absolutely agree with that and think it's an important societal point. Maybe an exception in Brazil where people are identified and self-identify as "white" in a way they aren't in Spanish speaking countries (hair-colour being used instead of skin colour which gives a real insight into the racist evolution of it).
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To a guy he doesn't know that he's having an off the ball tussle with? Nah, not having that.

Still racist, even if we accept his version of events (which I don't)
 
Lo Siento. said:
To a guy he doesn't know that he's having an off the ball tussle with? Nah, not having that.

Still racist, even if we accept his version of events (which I don't)
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I think "¿Qué te pasa negro/negrito?" could be used in a genuinely conciliatory manner, or equally as likely, in a plausbily deniable racist one. I have a shade of disagreement with you there.

Suárez's testimony appears to be full of lies, as does Evra's.
 
Anyway Corax can go back to shouting perfectly acceptable racist language on the terraces of his club* and we can talk about NEXT season when we're DEFINITELY winning the league.


Form is temporary (since 1990). Class is permanent.



*I know I know
 
Favelado said:
I think "¿Qué te pasa negro/negrito?" could be used in a genuinely conciliatory manner, or equally as likely, in a plausbily deniable racist one. I have a shade of disagreement with you there.

Suárez's testimony appears to be full of lies, as does Evra's.
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Not in that context it couldn't. In any case, it's not Suarez's place to define what Evra is allowed to be offended by (and he clearly was instantly offended) and Suarez never offered an apology to Evra.
 
In other up to date football based debate, should John Terry be stripped of the England captaincy after the Wayne Bridge 'affair'?
 
Not too suprising really, bareing in mind the owners sre willing to market the club any way they can re: that documentary that FOX did last season.
Not mention a lot of liverpool games have been on BT this season
 
Lo Siento. said:
Not in that context it couldn't. In any case, it's not Suarez's place to define what Evra is allowed to be offended by (and he clearly was instantly offended) and Suarez never offered an apology to Evra.
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Well, Evra voted for him as player of the year the past two seasons running so he doesn't hold a grudge.
 
sleaterkinney said:
Well, Evra voted for him as player of the year the past two seasons running so he doesn't hold a grudge.
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IMO that *proves* nothing about how Evra regards him as a person. The voting is on skill at kicking a ball around, not ability to be a worthwhile human being. It's perfectly possible that Evra's attitude is that of many - that Suarez is a horrible cunt but a very good footballer. All due respect to Evra if that's the case too; I doubt I'd be able to be so objective if I were him.
 
Corax said:
IMO that *proves* nothing about how Evra regards him as a person. The voting is on skill at kicking a ball around, not ability to be a worthwhile human being. It's perfectly possible that Evra's attitude is that of many - that Suarez is a horrible cunt but a very good footballer. All due respect to Evra if that's the case too; I doubt I'd be able to be so objective if I were him.
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And what do you make of Sterling and Sturridge getting on with him and vice-versa?
 
Rogers is looking to offload

Lago Aspas, Luis Alberto, José Reina, Fabio Borini, Oussama Assaidi, Suso, Sebastián Coates and Martin Kelly's. Perhaps Agger as he doesn't seem to get a game when fit.

Also Victor Moses and Aly Cissokho will not be retained after their respective loan spells from Chelsea and Valencia,

Ten players. I suppose they don't get a game but the squad is thin now. This could be a dangerous game with the CL on the horizon.
 
Sunray said:
Rogers is looking to offload

Lago Aspas, Luis Alberto, José Reina, Fabio Borini, Oussama Assaidi, Suso, Sebastián Coates and Martin Kelly's. Perhaps Agger as he doesn't seem to get a game when fit.

Also Victor Moses and Aly Cissokho will not be retained after their respective loan spells from Chelsea and Valencia,

Ten players. I suppose they don't get a game but the squad is thin now. This could be a dangerous game with the CL on the horizon.
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It's understandable. I'd swap all ten for five world class players.
 
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