Israeli forces storm Gaza aid ship, and beat people on board. Fatalities reported.

[danny la rouge]

I am also shocked by the blatant anti-Semitism on this thread.

Please quote some examples of anti-Semitism on this thread.

 

[dessiato]

http://www.indymediascotland.org/node/19583

This morning Israeli Defense Forces boarded boats carrying prohibited humanitarian aid to Gaza and killed at least 10 people on board. Protests have been called for this evening in Scotland. Israeli Arabs have called for a general strike there on Tuesday, while in Turkey the Israeli embassy has been the target of fierce protests.

Edinburgh
- Assemble 5pm at the Foot of the Mound, Princes Street

Glasgow
- Assemble 5pm at George Square

Dundee
- Assemble 5pm at City Square

Aberdeen
- Assemble 5pm at St Nicholas Square

Moffat
- Assemble 5pm at 2 Holm Street

Inverness
- Assemble 5pm at the Townhouse

Banff
- Assemble 5pm at Low Street, Council Buildings

It was not prohibited humanitarian aid.

The organisers had been offered two alternative routes to deliver the aid. One through Israel and one through Egypt. By their own admission they chose to ignore this and chose to ignore the blockade, the spokesperson saying that, as I keep repeating, that 'humanitarian aid was not (their) priority, breaking the blockade' was.

This loss of life was completely avoidable if the flotilla had gone through a different route. This, of course, is not to say that the actions of wither side were right.

 

[tommers]

I feel sickened by this.

And I rarely dip my toes into the politics forum. Is Sas always like this? Some proper horrible shit there mate.

 

[Blagsta]

they were in international waters

 

[e19896]

Israel is a disgusting racist nation.

Agreed and read on:

1) both based on supposed purity of blood.

2) both based on supposedly reuniting some religioethnic diaspora under one expansive state.

3) both attempting to revive some supposedly "glorious ancient kingdom" -- a "glorious ancient Teutonic kingdom" for the NAZIs; a "glorious ancient Judaic kingdom" for the Nationalist Zionists.

4) both established a state that was culturally, legally, economically and religiously based to exclusively benefit one ethnic/racial group.

5) both based on violent racist exclusion and a highly intricate complex of racial exclusion laws (like Israel's racial 'Nuremberg laws').

6) both based on creating a founding mythology -- like, for Zionist Jews, "a land without a people"

7) both invented their own race: Aryans, by the NAZIs; Jews, constructed as a unique/genetic race, by the Nationalist Zionists.

8) both based on eliminating some other unwanted and supposedly inferior races -- ethnic cleansing -- and, in the case of Zionism, removing those unwanted people who supposedly didn't exist.

9) both engaged in collective punishment and widespread torture (even inventing new sadistic torture methods),

10) both engaged in the mass imprisonment -- without trials -- of unwanted populations/races.

11) both enclosed unwanted races in walled-in ghettos and concentration camps -- only the Nationalist Zionists made the walls many times higher and the concentration camps many times larger (like Gaza, in effect the world's largest open-air prison/concentration camp).

12) both tried out new weapons on civilian populations (and Israel has engaged in the internationally illegal use of anti-personal weapons of mass destruction, like the widespread use of cluster bombs, on civilian populations).

13) both sought to erase existing countries -- like the Nazis wanting to wipe Poland off the map and parts of other countries; the Nationialist Zionists wanting to wipe Palestine off the map and parts of other countries.

14) both used pseudo-archeology to claim that it had exclusive right to the land.

15) the Nazis obsessed about "too many Jews" in Germany; Nationalist Zionists/Israel obsesses about "too many Palestinians" and the re-emergence of a Palestinian majority in historic Palestine (once an overhwhelmingly Arab land).

16) both were violently and militarily expansionist.

17) both engaged in blitzkrieg fighter aircraft and tank warfare against civilian populations and civilian targets.

18) Nationalist Zionist Israeli Jews even studied the original NAZI methods for urban warfare and clearing Palestinians out of their ghettos. Exclaimed one Israeli commander, "Let's be Judeo-Nazis!" (Reference: www.seruv.org.il -- the website for Israeli Refuniks in the "Occupied Territories"; see "Letter to American Jews"; "The Nazification of Israel" -- both online.)

19) both claimed to be based on "God's will".

20) and, finally (for Israel's 'final solution'), most recently (Feb 29, 2008), Israeli deputy defence minister threatens a "Holocaust" for the Palestinians.

Enough Said other than Israel is a disgusting racist nation, just stating the facts before us how is this Jew Baiting?

 

[krtek a houby]

I am also shocked by the blatant anti-Semitism on this thread. I thought U75 was better than this. Where is the balanced discussion that should be automatic on a site of this quality?

Where is the anti-semitism? All I see is a few people on both "sides" making excuses for violence but that's not anti-semitism, just the beating of chests.

 

[Bernie Gunther]

they were in international waters

I can't figure out from online maritime law sources whether that means they were entitled legally to defend themselves against a state sanctioned boarding though. Can anyone clarify?

Apparently to be piracy it's got to be non-state forces intent on nicking stuff etc.

 

[Fedayn]

I am also shocked by the blatant anti-Semitism on this thread. I thought U75 was better than this. Where is the balanced discussion that should be automatic on a site of this quality?

Right, you, put up or fucking shut up. Where is the 'blatant anti-semitism' on this thread? Where is it? More of the smae snide nasty shite that Sas likes to use, denounce critics of Israel as anti-semitic and try to shut down debate or argument. You're a smear artist, a nasty shit stirring smear artist.

 

[One_Stop_Shop]

This incident could have been avoided by the so-called humanitarians going to the places that where offered as safe passage. The woman interviewed claiming to represent them said that 'humanitarian aid was not (their) priority here'. I cannot help but believe that this incident was deliberately provoked by the so-called humanitarians.

I do not believe that people had to be attacked, by either side, nor do I believe that this incident had to happen. All that needed to happen was that the flotilla sailed to the safe passage. This way people would not have been injured or killed.

Are you a moron? Israel has a boycott on all but a handful of goods going into Gaza. If they'd done what Israel said then any items they deemed illegal (including wood, cement, glass, books etc) would have been taken out and not delivered. Any aid that did go through would have counted towards the daily quota that is allowed in. So basically it would have done nothing at all.

Provoked eh? Like the massacres carried out by apartheid South Africa were provoked?

By the way are you another anti-semite who supports zionist Israel?

 

[One_Stop_Shop]

The organisers had been offered two alternative routes to deliver the aid. One through Israel and one through Egypt. By their own admission they chose to ignore this and chose to ignore the blockade, the spokesperson saying that, as I keep repeating, that 'humanitarian aid was not (their) priority, breaking the blockade' was.

Are you an idiot? Those alternative routes would have meant the aid would have been looked through and any items Israel deems illegal (almost everything), would have been taken out. That's why breaking the blockade is crucial.

 

[Bernie Gunther]

I feel sickened by this.

And I rarely dip my toes into the politics forum. Is Sas always like this? Some proper horrible shit there mate.

A particularly repellent performance this time, but yes, generally in keeping with the way he carries on when Israel is being criticised for e.g. killing a bunch of civilians.

 

[treelover]

no one knows yet what happend on the ship, i have some doubts obviously that quakers, ISM people, would have weapons, but one doesn't know who else was on the ship, there might have been Hamas though I doubt it, there could easily have been some 'handy' volunteers though , who secretly had stockpiled, a few clubs, etc maybe a gun.


just don't know the facts yet, but if it proven the IDF SF's murdered people in cold blood, they should be brought to the Hague and prosecuted.

 

[quimcunx]

Quick question. Is Hamas the elected government of Palestine?

 

[rioted]

Jackboots

Jackboots they are on the march
The eagle's on the wing
The fascists raise their ugly heads
And uber alles sing
Through the streets of Stuttgart
Hitlerites they prance
An insult to the memory
Of my brother killed in France

Called up for the army
In nineteen thirty nine
A khaki suit and rifle
Go fight the fascist swine
Til one day in Normandy
Nineteen forty five
Died on a bloody battlefield
But Hitler's still alive.

When the war was over
At Nuremburg the cry
To justify the millions dead
Build the gallows high
The persecution of the Jews
The tale goes on and on
Yet we find in Israel
Jews with jackboots on.

You'll find that politicians
For a nickel or a dime
Pull on a pair of jackboots
Start legalising crime
Their mouths are full of promises
For the peasants paradise
And when the war is over
They promise you more lies

So all you workers on the march
Let nout get out your sight
Look and see what lies ahead
But don't forget the fight
While lackies lick the jackboots
And hail the master race*
When you ask them for your rights
The jackboot's in your face

jock purdon


*master race, chosen people; sometimes I wonder what the fucking difference is.

 

[One_Stop_Shop]

I can't think this will do Israel any good at all, hopefully it will spur on the boycott of Israel.

no one knows yet what happend on the ship, i have some doubts obviously that quakers, ISM people, would have weapons, but one doesn't know who else was on the ship, there might have been Hamas though I doubt it, there could easily have been some 'handy' volunteers though , who secretly had stockpiled, a few clubs, etc maybe a gun.

I wouldn't be surprised if they plant a gun. I find it very hard to believe anyone would have brought a gun aboard. Also they killed at least 10 people and wounded at least 30 more, totally disproportionate whatever happened. Plus they shouldn't have boarded a ship in international waters.

Apparently Israel is now saying that the actions the IDF took were with restraint!!

 

[rioted]

Quick question. Is Hamas the elected government of Palestine?

Yes. America/Israel demanded elections. The Palestinians held them and Hamas won easily. The BBC portrays this as Hamas "seizing" power.

 

[quimcunx]

Yes. America/Israel demanded elections. The Palestinians held them and Hamas won easily. The BBC portrays this as Hamas "seizing" power.

I'm getting really really fucked off every time the BBC say ''Hamas, who control Gaza''. WTF. What other elected government in the world would they describe in such a way.

I can feel a letter coming on.

 

[Open Sauce]

Have a look at Dessatios post. That bears out the BBC report.

I must say that the rank anti-Semitism on here today disgusts me. It doesn't shock or surprise me, because there is previous form. A hell of a lot of you should be utterly ashamed of yourselves, if you are capable of shame.

Israel a rogue state? And the rocket fire from Gaza? How do you classify that?

Ah, those rockets

Causing massive explosions like

Oh, sorry, that was the revenge attack

http://stopthewarnow.net/Gaza2009/

 

[treelover]

Rioted, whethere you think it or not, Gaza is not the Warsaw Ghetto and Israel is not Nazi Germany, by making these frankly dodgy comparisons you actually let Israel off the hook for the obscene acts it does carry out.

btw, on Guardian CIf there are over 1000 posts on one article on the alleged atrocity, what happened is appalling, but these things are happening say in S/America all the time, it does show the obsession the UK left has with IP

 

[frogwoman]

Ugh.

 

[frogwoman]

, but these things are happening say in S/America all the time,

No they're not. Sorry.

 

[treelover]

expand Froggie

 

[e19896]

no one knows yet what happend on the ship, i have some doubts obviously that quakers, ISM people, would have weapons, but one doesn't know who else was on the ship, there might have been Hamas though I doubt it, there could easily have been some 'handy' volunteers though , who secretly had stockpiled, a few clubs, etc maybe a gun.


just don't know the facts yet, but if it proven the IDF SF's murdered people in cold blood, they should be brought to the Hague and prosecuted.

No one knows what world are you in then? FUCK SAYING SORY FOR MURDING SCUM the IDF aim was to maim hurt and KILL up to 16 dead, there is no side other than the side of humans in a prison being killed by racist Nazi state that is Israel, the people of Gaza need acts of humanity not fucking apologist for The IDF..

 

[danny la rouge]

It was not prohibited humanitarian aid.

Wullie Hague seems to disagree:

The Foreign Secretary William Hague has called on the Government of Israel to open all crossings for aid to enter Gaza and deplored the loss of life during the interception of the Gaza Flotilla.

"‪‪I deplore the loss of life during the interception of the Gaza Flotilla. Our Embassy is in urgent contact with the Israeli Government. We are asking for more information and urgent access to any UK nationals involved.‪ "

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/blog/2010/may/31/israel-troops-gaza-ships

 

[treelover]

indeed, they are, death squads kill Trade Unionists and dress them as Farc, etc

 

[DotCommunist]

Wullie Hague seems to disagree:

When an arch-tory is condemning it we can assume that it has past beyond even a conservatives tolerance for 'terrible necessities'

 

[treelover]

just don't know the facts yet, but if it proven the IDF SF's murdered people in cold blood, they should be brought to the Hague and prosecuted.

@E

read my post properly please

 

[butchersapron]

Fucking hell, Kevin Ovenden was on board.

 

[One_Stop_Shop]

Gaza is not the Warsaw Ghetto

Why can't comparisons be made? The whole population of Gaza is being kept in a prison camp, is frequently attacked and bombed, faces massacres on a regular basis and is currently suffering mass malnutrition and poverty because of the boycott.

As a whole Israel can be put in the same bracket as apartheid South Africa.

btw, on Guardian CIf there are over 1000 posts on one article on the alleged atrocity, what happened is appalling, but these things are happening say in S/America all the time, it does show the obsession the UK left has with IP

For a start I doubt most people making comments are the "UK left". Secondly would you say that the UK left (and UK population for that matter) had an "obsession" with South African apartheid in the 1980s? Get off your obsession and if you think something else should be done, do it yourself. The UK left is irrelevant and unknown to most people. The only obsession round here is yours.

Also when was the last time a South American government massacred a humanitarian fleet in international waters? Examples please.

 

[Random]

Fucking hell, Kevin Ovenden was on board.

who?