' I Was Wrong ' .....

[J Ed]

Not strictly within remit of thread, but think a few of these will do no harm :

He called for a Lib Dem vote too the stupid fucker.

 

[Casually Red]

Just remember they can't stab him in the back unless they get close to him first .

 

[cantsin]

He called for a Lib Dem vote too the stupid fucker.

the standard 'prominent media liberal' life path of Private School > Oxbridge > Radio4 / Guardian seems to have worked the old magic on Ben G , fo sure

 

[J Ed]

Imagine the level of entitlement it takes to scold people for the perceived electability of a leader of their party who they have loyally supported and then turn around and vote for another party.

 

[cantsin]

and sorry to drag up the obvious, but :



to a very short, but sweet :

 

[mather]

He called for a Lib Dem vote too the stupid fucker.

Beware of the twats who call for 'evidence based politics'.

 

[J Ed]

Beware of the twats who call for 'evidence based politics'.

'Consensus politics' is another one to watch out for.

 

[killer b]

I'm loving all the Mr logic 'but you lost for the third election in a row' comments all over the place from traumatised Tories desperately trying to find something good to take away from this week's clusterfuck

 

[mather]

'Consensus politics' is another one to watch out for.

Agreed!

It's one of the reasons I can't stand Caroline Lucas (and the Green Party in general).

 

[cantsin]

and sorry to drag up the obvious, but :



to a very short, but sweet :

but to be fair to Catmo, her dumping of Corbo seemed to coincide almost exactly with the announcement of possible VAT on Private School fees to be introed by Labour, and with two already in private school, must be putting quite a strain on her / PP's finances .

(Though I notice revolutionary firebrand Bobby Gillespie's reputedly enthusiastic embrace of the private school parent lifestyle - PTA's etc , or whatever the feck it is - didnt prove an ideological barrier to him getting a squeeze for the final Islington Corbo rally last week )

 

[MochaSoul]

Jess Phillips' sorry not sorry is in

We all of us need to eat a slice of that humble pie

One Andy Platt had a good translation of this btl:

Jess Philips writes,

"The ability to start an article with a trite truism is a powerful one. I teach my children this so I can then mention them in comment pieces in order to imply extra moral authority for the garbage I'm peddling. This was clearly not a lesson learned by Theresa May; using trite truisms gives you that woman of the people aura which I obviously have and she doesn't.

Politicians all act like they're somehow invincible, except me of course. I know that writing an article with words like 'humble pie' and 'mea culpa' makes it look like I listen to people and accept my own fallibility, rather than being a shouty old windbag who clearly called it wrong from day one. Let me just mention my children again, alluding to some cute little domestic mishap to remind you that I'm a parent and therefore a better, more important person than you.

I have talked to Jeremy on a couple of occasions. I tell him what the word on the street is. Cos I know the street me, I'm street tough, a bit gangsta, I tell it like it is, know worri mean? He responds to this well, I like to imagine. I've never stuck around long enough to hear what he says.

The next couple of paragraphs will be tricky; I have to somehow rationalise being utterly wrong about Jeremy Corbyn with still being all sensible and correct now that the dust has settled. I'll do that by implying that lots of other Labour MPs will simply follow Corbyn like little poodles, unlike sensible independent me (can one of the interns insert another mention of my kids here, you know the sort of shit people fall for). Another group will still remain a thorn in his side, blindly rejecting the positives, not dissimilar to the group Corbyn was part of in the Blair years, in a completely different way that I've blindly rejected Corbyn and his team's positives obv. I know that Corbyn turned out to be right in the end but personally, I really don't think that's the point, do you?

For example, my slagging off of Corbyn was entirely personal, whereas Corbyn disagreed with Blair on policy. I can learn from that. I just need to learn some policy first, rather than say, being completely deluded about the influence I've had over Labour's response to welfare reform when Kate Green did all the heavy lifting. I'll just end this by only admitting I got anything wrong in the sense that absolutely everybody else got it wrong too, even though that's clearly bollocks. So come on Jeremy, let's all grow up and you can give me a job."

 

[Vintage Paw]

Helen Lewis in happier, more assured times : needs to be read in full, a beaut :

The echo chamber of social media is luring the left into cosy delusion and dangerous insularity

Here's what people like her don't understand: online isn't just online. Certainly for younger people, online is just a part of the public sphere more generally. For those of us who didn't grow up already online we can never quite understand just how fluid the movement between online and offline is now. It's all part of the same space.

And what they don't understand about social media echo chambers is that while a lot of traditional voters may not be on twitter (which is the main platform of consternation), all the people who work in the media are - from the op ed writers to the Sky reporters to the Sun cunt journos. They lap up everything that happens on social media, and that has a knock-on effect to what they write about. So what happens on twitter - the left, the right, the squabbles, the trends, the controversies, the general mood - happens in meat space too. What happens on twitter filters through to the print pages of the Mail and the Guardian and to the talking heads on ITV. It's not a like-for-like 1:1 translation, but rather it informs. But because the majority of those working in print and broadcast media grew up before online was simply a part of public life, they don't quite get it and continue to disparage the effects it has. Plus, of course, greater online involvement means the continued rise of less traditional, alternative news media, and that puts all their jobs at risk - and puts their authority at risk.

 

[MochaSoul]

I think it might be fair to at least take a Owen Jones view - Corbyn pre-makeover made things very difficult.

He changed. He softened (for example) the Nuclear issue (quite brilliantly/admirably to maintain his integrity) and worked on his delivery. Something changed with him.

(One thing I'll be keen to see is PMQ's. He was getting bullied week in week out. No one wants to see that from their leader)

There's a fair few revisionists sneering at the non-believers (not the politicians - hang the PLP traitors ofc), taking the view "I knew all along he would come good and perform one of the biggest upsets in modern political polling". With many, at best it was a refusal to criticise him because he was the best of a bad bunch (and not a Blairite) and "fuck voting, the government always wins" so the hypothesized annihilation of Labour was almost welcome (with the added benefit of pining it on some revenge for the Blair years/Influence).

What I have against people like Owen Jones is not the fact they are humanly fallible. It's that they should have known better than to collude with an establishment they decry in books and columns even if they, like me, sometimes lose their faith in human nature. For someone who wrote about the demonisation of chavs, he should have known better than to stand by and let that same establishment he so criticises put delivery and appearance over content and intention. For someone who gained from books railing against the establishment, he should have given himself pause before giving them half of his own privileged pulpit to attacks on what he says he believes. For someone who knows the media is most of the time on the side of the wealthy and the powerful, he shouldn't have added his space to give credence to faux witch-hunts and manufactured lies tarnishing a whole swathe of Corbyn supporters with everything from mysogyny, to bullying to a hard-leftism that is nothing of the kind. I do think his apology is one of the sincere ones but I'm not as forgiving of his last two years. For someone who must be aware of the ties to big capital a lot of blairites have, he should have known better.

Oh and btw, I didn't walk my miles knocking on doors and handing leaflets believing this would be it. My beacons are the black civil rights movements and the backwards and forwards steps in their histories tell me "Avante!" (forward) and "a luta continua" (the fight continues), to borrow also from Portuguese commies ( ;-) ). Owen Jones should have known better.

 

[Raheem]

What I have against people like Owen Jones is not the fact they are humanly fallible. It's that they should have known better than to collude with an establishment they decry in books and columns even if they, like me, sometimes lose their faith in human nature. For someone who wrote about the demonisation of chavs, he should have known better than to stand by and let that same establishment he so criticises put delivery and appearance over content and intention. For someone who gained from books railing against the establishment, he should have given himself pause before giving them half of his own privileged pulpit to attacks on what he says he believes. For someone who knows the media is most of the time on the side of the wealthy and the powerful, he shouldn't have added his space to give credence to faux witch-hunts and manufactured lies tarnishing a whole swathe of Corbyn supporters with everything from mysogyny, to bullying to a hard-leftism that is nothing of the kind. I do think his apology is one of the sincere ones but I'm not as forgiving of his last two years. For someone who must be aware of the ties to big capital a lot of blairites have, he should have known better.

Oh and btw, I didn't walk my miles knocking on doors and handing leaflets believing this would be it. My beacons are the black civil rights movements and the backwards and forwards steps in their histories tell me "Avante!" (forward) and "a luta continua" (the fight continues), to borrow also from Portuguese commies ( ;-) ). Owen Jones should have known better.

So you can forgive human failings except in people who ought to know better? Sure, you don't have to instantaneously forgive and forget, but if someone gives an accurate diagnosis of where they went wrong, surely that's as good a starting point as you can ask for.

Maybe we should come back to OJ in couple of years when, having learned from his mistake, he will be backing Corbyn to the hilt as he uses drone strikes to deal with a resurgent IRA.

 

[cantsin]

must admit, had forgotten about Macron cheerleader Penny Red for a while - now, supported by Helen Lewis, she's accusing "the left" of bullying her over lack of support for Corbyn ( which would be out of order - but as so often in these kind of situations, can only see robust critique at worst - may be missing stuff ) - looking back on her twitter, its v weird how she seems to say NOTHING relating to Corbyn, for weeks and weeks...obvs, she was busy at her mate Milo's gigs etc, but unless she's been furiously deleting, after the years of talking the talk, seems our fave lifestyle anarchist just wasn't feeling the Corb.. .

 

[MochaSoul]

So you can forgive human failings except in people who ought to know better?

You can pretend I said nothing else, if you want.

Sure, you don't have to instantaneously forgive and forget, but if someone gives an accurate diagnosis of where they went wrong, surely that's as good a starting point as you can ask for.

If you think of his apology as his starting point. I don't and I obviously failed to put that across. I have my own doubts whether it'll all have been just another monumental waste of my time and effort. Some because I don't think the movement has sufficient legs to stand on and develop further. But my highest doubts relate to the likes of OJ. At the slightest importunity, it may well be people in pulpits such as Owen Jones', who can muster much better words than mine and reach an awful lot of other people, and who, although having a foot in there and another within the movement, as he puts it, will fail it and probably at most crucial of junctures as was the case with OJ... and because they have so much exposure and polpularity they'll end up sticking whatever knife inflicted further in.
It's more than mere forgiving/forgetting. It's a question of trust in him as a friendly ally.

Give me Gary Younge any time over Owen Jones.

 

[Treacle Toes]

...what did LP say about JC then? This tweet smacks of self interest, as is her way.

 

[Steel Icarus]

"
The British Labour Party, re-imagined as a once and future workers’ party under the leadership of principled former backbencher Jeremy Corbyn, has spent two years tugging defeat from the jaws of populist victory. Jeremy Corbyn is, by all accounts, a very nice man with a beard with a very strong commitment to his own set of beliefs, a sort of weaponized geography teacher, and for a long time I truly wanted to believe that this would be enough to stand up to the public-school bullies in power. His coterie started out with a reasonable amount of goodwill. They faced unrelenting attacks from the beginning both from the right-wing press and from centrists within their own party, who clung from the start to the belief that Corbyn was unelectable despite the fact that he kept beating them in elections.

All of this might have been surmountable if Corbyn or anyone on his team were able to strategize their way out of a wet paper bag. "

 

[Steel Icarus]

^^^ from The coming British bloodbath: Theresa May’s “snap election” will be an epic disaster for the left. But why?

 

[cantsin]

...what did LP say about JC then? This tweet smacks of self interest, as is her way.

she's claiming that she said virtually nothing ( literally, for 2 months + ), and seems to be nowt on her Twitter feed

 

[Plumdaff]

Here's what people like her don't understand: online isn't just online. Certainly for younger people, online is just a part of the public sphere more generally. For those of us who didn't grow up already online we can never quite understand just how fluid the movement between online and offline is now. It's all part of the same space.

There's also the fact that the commentariat only talk to one another online. The idea that someone without a tick might be there to do anything but praise them or be told off for disagreeing is beyond them. That they might use it as a tool to break beyond what a small group of people in London are saying mystifies them. It's to compliment each other on their brilliant opinions.

 

[cantsin]

wealthy feminist Claudia C is barely even bothering trying to try + backtrack 2 yrs of this garbage, just throwing the usual misogyny cards around at hard to see perps :

 

[cantsin]

Yeuch



Try + imagine the front needed to post this after 2 yrs of incessant attacks on Corbyn /. Supporters ( and as a proud member of Institute of Directors )

am starting to wonder if this is some sly parody account :

 

[RD2003]

Not sure why people worry so much about jumped-up (permanent) schoolkids like Laurie and Owen. The electorate doesn't-they've never even heard of 'em.

 

[taffboy gwyrdd]

In her acceptance / victory speech early on Friday Morning, Lucy Powell (Mcr Central) cited the role of Corbyn in positive tone. I noted this is a tweet to her (she had resigned as Shadow Education Sec in the coup co-ordinated with the BBC last year).

She replied saying that she was glad she was wrong.

at some level, i think a de facto amnesty for true repenters may be good and necessary, but how true repentance is evaluated I aint so sure.

 

[cantsin]

seems only right to finish off with the 2nd biggest entitled anti Corbo wasteman called Joyon on the interweb - we cld quote the attacks all night, but this was a surprise from Friday ( no irony detected )



(the rest is the usual : )

 

[RD2003]

Have I confused Owen Jones with Owen Smith? Don't suppose it matters much.

 

[Raheem]

Have I confused Owen Jones with Owen Smith? Don't suppose it matters much.

No, I don't suppose many people are going to care what you get confused about.

 

[RD2003]

No, I don't suppose many people are going to care what you get confused about.

I don't even care.

 

[cantsin]

^^^ from The coming British bloodbath: Theresa May’s “snap election” will be an epic disaster for the left. But why?

Ah... so now we see what Laurie P getting stick for ... ffs