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Hundreds of workers protest against Italians/Foreigners 'taking jobs'...

From the Guardian article

Bobby Buirds, a regional officer for Unite in Scotland, said the workers at Grangemouth were striking to protect British jobs.

"The argument is not against foreign workers, it's against foreign companies discriminating against British labour," he said.

This should be how Galloway and the left should be couching this dispute, but how is it that I'm not holding my breath?

No matter what is being said, this is about nationalism and its shady cousin racism, and the media - owned by the same boss class who have manipulated this, are quite happy to stoke the racist elements.

If this can happen with Europeans, what will happen when similar events occur with Africans, Asians and those from the Middle-East, all who have suffered for years through exploitation from the First World and who work in this country, if they are lucky enough to find jobs?

Despite the fact that it is about race, the mistake that polite, middle-class left always make is to tut tut at the workers's racist attitudes, who have every right to fear for their jobs and livelihood and who are having their worst traits magnified by those who know only too well how to do this.

I do not blame the workers for looking for a scapegoat. They have been manipulated into doing so, as all workers are. Suddenly I feel all Marxist (workers of the world unite etc). The problem is not Italian workers, or the British workers it is Italian and British bosses who are the same as bosses all around the world.

As the economic crisis deepens – and those of us who have studied it know who is to blame – we must remember that the majority of workers haven't the time to work out who did what to whom.

To those who say that the left "causes" the BNP to gain ground, I particularly detest this argument. The BNP will manipulate any sense of injustice to further their vile cause and vapid arguments.

But rather than this being because the left rightly cites racism and petty nationalism as a reason, it is more because the left is so divided, it has little time for the real fight (which MUST be against all bosses everywhere AT THE SAME TIME). And many in the centre-left are so ideologically and intellectually bankrupt and corrupted by the enemy, they cannot point to the real enemy, because they have been feeding off that enemy for years.

This enemy, who not only have led us to this financial and economic crisis, but have continued with bloody wars across the world, destroying communities and creating more anger, and using the media to keep people fighting each other and not the real enemy, has reached a point where their economic fantasy is being laid bare, and they are desperately trying to deflect attention away, anywhere but where it should be directed - at them.

Of course, we could sit around and discuss the politics and ideology and someone could try and sell a few copies of the socialist worker, and an anarchist could come along and say all socialists are scum, and then the People's Front of Judea will explain why the Judean People's Front are splitters, but the main point is that the coming economic depression (let's not piss around with stupid "credit-crunchie" names) will leave many manual, unskilled workers at the mercy of fate and resorting to desperate measures to protect their families, and both the far right and the right-wing Labour Party will seek to avoid blaming those at fault, while the far-left continues to bicker over ideological minutiae.

The far right will say it is about race. The Labour Party won't know what the fuck to say and will make up more spin, which will then be used by the unscrupulous to tar all those who believe in justice and who have a broad acceptance of the politics of Marx without being part of any ideological grouping.

So, it is time that links are forged throughout Europe to begin with. If it is true that Italian unions have spoken in solidarity with British workers (is there a link to that?) this is a good start. I always felt that the pivotal moment that could have stopped the war in Feb 2003 was when that fat cunt union leader (not Bob Crow but another one, forget which) threatened industrial action in front of 2million people and then went back on his word. A general strike would have stopped the war in its tracks, but even many who run the unions are part of the boss class, so the organisation may have to be outside the normal channels.

Nothing can stop the rise of mass action when it is about jobs, food on the plate and security for family. But in order for it to work the enemy must be correctly pointed to. It is not about race, it is not even about class as it is perceived (many who call themselves middle-class are going to be suffering too). It is about the "boss class" those who make and break lives with the flick of a pen, or button pushed to send an email or text.

They are the ones who need to be brought down.

Ok, OK, it's turned into some kind of "power to the people" rant. Maybe it was from the start. But it's what I feel to be the case now.

Workers of the world unite....an stuff...
 
Any worker expecting favours from a private company is kidding themselves. Their obligation is to their shareholders, not their employees. Whether you believe that is morally repugnant is largely irrelevant, time and again private companies have fucked over their "loyal employees", and theyll do it again. Its quite ridiculous to think that that loyalty is returned, it never is. Plenty of Brits benefit from European labour laws and that has to be a two way street.

Do we have any example of the overwhelming "loyalty" displayed by the employees in this case (simply turning up for work during the contracted hours doesn't count)?
 
There might be legislation that says you don't have to hire locals before EU nationals, but that is very different to saying you refuse to hire certain EU nationalities at all.

Barber from the TUC made this point in an interview for PM on R4.

The same piece also claimed that the contract was arranged months ago, when there was thought to be a shortage of available British workers, that the Italian workforce is one hte same pay and conditions as their British counterparts, and that the dispute arose from the potentially unlawful statement from the contractors that they would not employ British workers.
 
The practical upshot was that all the local workers were dumped and the new people were all asylum seekers and assorted east Europeans.
I know this was ages ago in the thread, but asylum seekers aren't allowed to work. They may have been refugees, but hey, why bother to find out the difference? They've only been the target of a sustained hate campaign by right wing newspapers after all :rolleyes:

Okay, back to the thread :)
 
1. TL, you're dealing with a situaiton that's been in existance since 1992 when the European Single Market came into force, meaning that anyone in an EU country could work in any other without a visa

2. There was no uniion push in the 1990s to expand their sphere of influence into other countries, of linking up with European unions to ensure that there was the possibility of EU wide best practice for all workers.

3. The fact that no one in the UK labour movement, nor it seems a huge chunk of people on Urban, have recognised this in nearly 20 years is no ones fault but their own. Here's a simple fact - the bosses have managed to pit workers against workers who exist in the same labour pool. Who's the ultimate winner?

I agree with you. The unions have completely failed to take the opportunities afforded by the EU for pan-European solidarity. And much of the far left in Britain has seen the EU solely as a threat - thus crippling their ability to make connections with other leftists throughout the EU.

However, we're now in the situation we're in. It's not the fault of the workers at these plants that complacent unions took their eye off the ball for decades.

You can understand the anger this has caused a lot of workers, and as long as the anger is directed towards the right targets that's fine. I really fear the intervention of the tabloids in all this though. They are going to *love* stirring up xenophobia over it.
 
Actually, this is all getting extremely interesting.

There's a comment over on CIF about this that makes a startling point.

How is this not against EU law, or at least the spirit of EU law? There might be legislation that says you don't have to hire locals before EU nationals, but that is very different to saying you refuse to hire certain EU nationalities at all.

This is a good point - on the face of it the company appears to have made an incriminating statement by saying they wouldn't hire Brits. If they'd just done it, they would have been breaking the law but no one would have been able to prove it. Now they've actually *said* it the workers should be able to take legal action. A bit weird that the unions haven't been pushing that angle a bit more.
 
Why should UK nationals take precedence over workers from other countries? There's a word for policies like that, and not one that you'd like, I suspect.
IB you show a basic misunderstanding of politics here .. how else then can you organise a bloody union? how else can you organise in the community? how else can we get power if we allow the bosses to take away our strenghth which is in production .. it is NOT racist it is NOT zenophobic it is about creating power
 
Mosty of those who walked out appeared to be wearing flash jackets with slogans like 'british jobs for british workers' rather than 'british rates for all workers' or something like that - i've no idea if they were work provided or union provided, but there was a least one unison steward arguing along the lines of attacking foreign workers rather than employers.
and until a left, or whatever, support workers in these situations this will remain the case and in fact get worse ..
 
SWP line, come out against strikes, not very nuanced, basically, the strikers are deluded or racists..

http://www.socialistworker.co.uk/art.php?id=17004

@cantsin, rude man that you are, that was my point, the Left can not do much about this at all, with some exceptions, the SP, it abdicated from the industrial stage years ago, when the local SWP full timer went to the bus drivers picket line, awhile ago, he was told to fuck off! This is spontaneouus and is an example of workers doing things for themselves..
 
harsh words Snadge, having said that, I've scanned all the left wing blogs, etc, there is absolutely nothing on this two major days of walkouts, all illegal wildcats all one can see is about palestine. There seems to be a blanket refusal to acknowledge what is happening, I am genuinely interested to know why this is, is it too unpalatable?
yet this dispute was festering for many months .. sums up their alienation form ordianry workers/people
 
Housing

I hope this photo isn't too large, but this is where they are housing the folks, I would hardly call this a floatel:

9434bb52-eed3-11dd-bbb5-0000779fd2ac.jpg


Looks pretty fucking grim.
 
I agree with you. The unions have completely failed to take the opportunities afforded by the EU for pan-European solidarity. And much of the far left in Britain has seen the EU solely as a threat - thus crippling their ability to make connections with other leftists throughout the EU.

However, we're now in the situation we're in. It's not the fault of the workers at these plants that complacent unions took their eye off the ball for decades.

You can understand the anger this has caused a lot of workers, and as long as the anger is directed towards the right targets that's fine. I really fear the intervention of the tabloids in all this though. They are going to *love* stirring up xenophobia over it.


:confused: http://www.urban75.net/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=230054
 
IB you show a basic misunderstanding of politics here .. how else then can you organise a bloody union? how else can you organise in the community? how else can we get power if we allow the bosses to take away our strenghth which is in production .. it is NOT racist it is NOT zenophobic it is about creating power
I do see your logic, I really do.

Then I see the phrase 'our strength which is in production' and I think, in that case, our strength got outsourced to East Asia a long time ago. If we were aiming to be locally self-sufficient, then there would be a lot more logic to what you're saying, and I would then be willing to consider seriously the ethical issues around restrictive or open migration policies, but that's not the kind of economy we're in. We're in a European economy and a global economy, and if you carry on ignoring that then you will lose ground with every year that passes.
 
I do see your logic, I really do.

Then I see the phrase 'our strength which is in production' and I think, in that case, our strength got outsourced to East Asia a long time ago. If we were aiming to be locally self-sufficient, then there would be a lot more logic to what you're saying, and I would then be willing to consider seriously the ethical issues around restrictive or open migration policies, but that's not the kind of economy we're in. We're in a European economy and a global economy, and if you carry on ignoring that then you will lose ground with every year that passes.

Change 'production' to 'workplace' then.
 
SWP line, come out against strikes, not very nuanced, basically, the strikers are deluded or racists..
http://www.socialistworker.co.uk/art.php?id=17004

"Those who urge on these strikes are playing with fire. Once the argument is raised it can open the door to racism against individuals. Already in some supermarket warehouses the racists are calling for action against workers from abroad.

Right wing ideas gain a hold among workers when they see their lives being torn apart and the unions offer no lead. No doubt some in Unite think it’s easier to get a fight around a slogan like “British jobs for British workers” which sets people apart than one that brings people together like “Workers should not pay for the bosses’ crisis”. That’s a doomed strategy.

Instead of turning against workers from abroad, everyone should be organising in a united way to pressure the union leaders to fight. And if the union leaders won’t fight then workers will have to organise the resistance themselves.

Let’s demand an end to the system where foreign workers are housed separately from the British workforce. Let’s bring workers from abroad into the unions and link arms against the bosses and their system.

Fight all job cuts
No deals that cut wages or accept lay-offs
Smash privatisation and sub-contracting
Unity against the bosses, no to racism and the BNP."

so 1) the SWP are against these strikes .. fucking disgusting .. anti working class shite .. the workers can only strike if it is socialist?? basic fucking misunderstanding of class or anger etc etc

2) 'lets bring workers from abroad into unions' .. what even if they are being used to undercut wages?? when people see there sons and daughters and wives and husbands on the dole? WHY should communities have the bosses bus people in when there is ANY unemployment???
it is purely to exploit and should be opposed full stop

they do not understand that most foreign workers are here to earn money and have no reason to commit to unions and the long term future of the communities in which they work .. i do NOT blame them in any way .. most people think and act like this .. IF migrant workers can be recruited brilliant .. but that the left think concentrating on temporaray migrnat workers at the expense of people who live work and will die here is insanity .. and the insanity that will breed support for fascism ..

that that these strikes have been expressed zenopobically is a direct fault of the left for failing to be involved with ordianry people ..
 
Change 'production' to 'workplace' then.
But do you really want to test the waters to see exactly how much of our work can be outsourced to lower-labour-cost countries? It doesn't matter whether it's physical production or service industry stuff, if they can find the skills abroad (and they can find a lot in E. Europe) then they'll move. Which leaves international solidarity, and identifying the wage-cutting bosses as the enemy whatever country they are operating in and whatever nationality they are employing, as the only option.
 
That story dated 2007 I note - too little too late springs to mind. I know there are skeleton international networks for trade unions, but from the moment of the unification of the labour market the unions should already have been ready with pan-European mergers/federations to coincide with it.
Anyway, too late for all that now.

What would be the point, companies even hedge funds have rights enshirned by european law, unions don't. That case was to decide if the unions even had the right to protest against a company execising it's legal right.
 
Earlier today Jerry Hicks released a statement reminding us that an emergency meeting of the national construction shop stewards forum took place in London as long ago as the 8th January. The meeting discussed the escalating crisis in construction following a series of protests in November and December of last year, over employment rights and also the proposed exclusion of UK workers by foreign companies on power stations and other major UK contracts.

The meeting was originally called for at Newark on the 3rd December following a series of protests at the gates of Staythope Power Station. At the meeting shop stewards voted overwhelmingly to organise a programme of demonstrations toward targeted construction projects within the UK power generation sector.



this didn't happen just this week its been brewing for ages, The SWP and many others were too busy with their anti-imperialism to notice.
 
piss off wankstain, I got made redundant and was sick of being on the dole, working away from home for months on end has it's own downside, try it, your kids may not recognise you next time they see you and your missus is with the local hard lad.

You are the problem mate, an idiot that thinks we should earn a lot less than we do because they are jealous of our earnings, well don't worry our highly skilled jobs have been farmed out to foreign workers who are now living that dream, minimum wage here we come, paying the bankers bonuses.
you wanna watch your tongue, you fucking twat.

i'm a welder, two of my uncles are welders, some of my cousins are welders. all of us have been on the dole and none of us ever went self employed.

i'm not jealous of your earnings and i don't think you should earn less. i don't think you should have sold yourselves so cheaply.
 
this didn't happen just this week its been brewing for ages, The SWP and many others were too busy with their anti-imperialism to notice.

god, do you really have nothing to say apart from whining about the left?

How about something constructive for once?
 
But do you really want to test the waters to see exactly how much of our work can be outsourced to lower-labour-cost countries? It doesn't matter whether it's physical production or service industry stuff, if they can find the skills abroad (and they can find a lot in E. Europe) then they'll move. Which leaves international solidarity, and identifying the wage-cutting bosses as the enemy whatever country they are operating in and whatever nationality they are employing, as the only option.

That's got nothing at all to do with my post as far as i can see. I don't know what you think i'm arguing.

The phrase (and the tactics that should therefore follow) 'Our strength is in the workplace' (not solely of course) is all i was talking about - and international chains of production, distribution etc are still today (maybe even more than ever) threatened by actions in the workplace, one small walkout can stop a huge global chain in its tracks.
 
Scottish First Minister Alex Salmond said he hoped workers would return to work quickly after making their point.

twat. How about they return to work when they stop being sold out for cheaper workers, you dick salmon.
 
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