chilango
Hypothetical Wanker
Thats a nuance thats easy to lose.
perhaps if phrased like this it would better...
The blame is not directed at the Italian workers, but at the company trying to drive down their overall costs.
Hundreds of workers protest against Italians/Foreigners 'taking jobs'...
- Thread starter treelover
- Start date
Thats a nuance thats easy to lose.
perhaps if phrased like this it would better...
The blame is not directed at the Italian workers, but at the company trying to drive down their overall costs.
kyser_soze
Hawking's Angry Eyebrow
Just wondered cos he's not on this thread, and that seemed a pretty direct response...whatever...
not sure angry workers on a picket line have much time for nuances.
More from Simon Darby blog. This is getting our of hand
"Staff at St Fergus Gas terminal, Aberdeenshire, Mossmoran (North of Edinburgh) and Dounreay (nr Thurso) reported to have now downed tools over foreign workers. "
"Fiddler's Ferry Power Station in Warrington joins the list as BNP truth trucks deployed."
"Staff at St Fergus Gas terminal, Aberdeenshire, Mossmoran (North of Edinburgh) and Dounreay (nr Thurso) reported to have now downed tools over foreign workers. "
"Fiddler's Ferry Power Station in Warrington joins the list as BNP truth trucks deployed."
Fuchs66
Ring a ding
Exactly, how about a bit of unity throughout the whole labour market instead of the "I'm alright Jack" attitude that's existed until now.
chilango
Hypothetical Wanker
Quite. Thats why we have to pretty damn clear.
chilango
Hypothetical Wanker
Talkie Toaster
New Member
The coverage of this is all wrong IMO. It's all talking about "foreigners". Whereas surely the protest isn't about foreigners at all but at the shitty business practices of the employers just to eek out a little bit more "shareholder value". 
Louis MacNeice
Autumn Journalist
The union bods I've heard today have been clear that their beef is with the employer/main contractor; they weren't being nuanced.
Cheers - Louis MacNeice
Fuchs66
Ring a ding
but the company employing the Italian workers is an Italian company that's why they tend to have Italian employees, they competed for and won a contract in the EU, easy as that.
snadge
metal alchemist
But are abusing NAECI agreements to maximise profits and lower their costs, do you really think that they are brought their own "highly trained" workforce?
goldenecitrone
post tenebras lux
Since when was Fiddler's Ferry in Warrington? I grew up 800 yards from it in Widnes.
kyser_soze
Hawking's Angry Eyebrow
Does it thicken? This is the equivalent of a rent-a-quote MP getting upset about a TV show, Galloway pops up first. I mean come on:
Which is why you need international agreements...
It's a fucking joke. This has been happening since 1992, and everyone is treating this as if it's just fucking happened.
Which is why you need international agreements...
It's a fucking joke. This has been happening since 1992, and everyone is treating this as if it's just fucking happened.
Fuchs66
Ring a ding
but if what they've done was as you said "technically correct" its more to do with the weak agreement that was negotiated, if it had been robust and applicable to ALL workers there would have been less of a problem.
I take it
means you doubt the qualifications and/or abilities of those involved, care to back that up with facts?
kyser_soze
Hawking's Angry Eyebrow
Much as I accept your word on this, no one, not even BERR, have seen hard evidence that this is the case, and so far UNITE have been unable to provide any.
chilango
Hypothetical Wanker
Good.
Fuchs66
Ring a ding
because up until now the UK has had it relatively good, now that the bubble has burst, guess who's left holding the shitty end of the stick?
snadge
metal alchemist
I have had to redo enough pipe welding on the snagging lists of jobs I've been on done by foreign welders with a BASIC coding for welding which is a six week course.
danny la rouge
More like *fanny* la rouge!
Not got time to read all this - I'd missed the thread, but just got a PM pointing me to it.
Apologies for repeating stuff if I am, but the action has spread to Grangemouth and Longanet, and Peterhead. 1, 500 out in Scotland, and spreading across the UK.
I'm assuming people on the thread have pointed out that this is about bosses turning workers against each other in order to destabilize unity and undercut wages? I don't know what the unions are saying yet, as the radio only had people in a personal capacity, but their job ought to be to steer the rhetoric away from "British jobs for British workers" towards "fair rates for all workers". Setting the Italians up as the enemy rather than the bosses obviously plays into the bosses hands, and I'd have said representation to the Italian workers ought to be a priority. If (and I'm not saying it'd be easy) they can be persuaded to come out in sympathy, then the way the story is reported would take on a different complexion.
Sorry if I'm repeating, and sorry for brevity, but I've got things to do.
Apologies for repeating stuff if I am, but the action has spread to Grangemouth and Longanet, and Peterhead. 1, 500 out in Scotland, and spreading across the UK.
I'm assuming people on the thread have pointed out that this is about bosses turning workers against each other in order to destabilize unity and undercut wages? I don't know what the unions are saying yet, as the radio only had people in a personal capacity, but their job ought to be to steer the rhetoric away from "British jobs for British workers" towards "fair rates for all workers". Setting the Italians up as the enemy rather than the bosses obviously plays into the bosses hands, and I'd have said representation to the Italian workers ought to be a priority. If (and I'm not saying it'd be easy) they can be persuaded to come out in sympathy, then the way the story is reported would take on a different complexion.
Sorry if I'm repeating, and sorry for brevity, but I've got things to do.
goldenecitrone
post tenebras lux
The old 'foreign workers are shit' argument. I heard that so often in Germany, how rubbish the Brits were at building anything. Shoddy brickwork, not like proper German builders. Pure xenophobia.
chilango
Hypothetical Wanker
Not got time to read all this - I'd missed the thread, but just got a PM pointing me to it.
Apologies for repeating stuff if I am, but the action has spread to Grangemouth and Longanet, and Peterhead. 1, 500 out in Scotland, and spreading across the UK.
I'm assuming people on the thread have pointed out that this is about bosses turning workers against each other in order to destabilize unity and undercut wages? I don't know what the unions are saying yet, as the radio only had people in a personal capacity, but their job ought to be to steer the rhetoric away from "British jobs for British workers" towards "fair rates for all workers". Setting the Italians up as the enemy rather than the bosses obviously plays into the bosses hands, and I'd have said representation to the Italian workers ought to be a priority. If (and I'm not saying it'd be easy) they can be persuaded to come out in sympathy, then the way the story is reported would take on a different complexion.
Sorry if I'm repeating, and sorry for brevity, but I've got things to do.
Not at all. Good post.
Fuchs66
Ring a ding
Well that's more work for you and a system that be in your advantage in the end, no employer wants to pay double for a job.
Fuchs66
Ring a ding
Well said this is "divide and rule" plus "scapegoat politics" and it seems many have fallen for it. I get the impression that representation to the Italian workers is a bit late cosidering the amount of bile thats been directed at them.
belboid
Exasperated, not angry.
Both Unite unions, T&G and Amicus DO have the kind of cross-european deals you are talking about. Both are members of a variety of bodies, not least the European TUC, which work together to stop incidences such as his from taking place. part of the formation of Unite was explicitly on the basis of becoming a union that could go europe wide, which is why there are also talk of merger with unions in germany and the US.
Union officers are also being set up in Eastern Europe as well, and they have been for the last few years. When the Single European Market came in there was a legal right for anyone to move anywhere to work, but it wasn't that widely taken up. Most Euro countries had broadly similar wages and standards of living, so the likelihood of large groups of migrant workers moving cross-borders wasn't likely to happen, and didn't. Portuguese, Greek and Irish workers did have significantly lower incomes, and there was some thought that some workers from those countries might travel, but the first two lots were always likely to go somewhere more Mediterranean than the UK, so 'we' weren't that bothered (and it didn't happen that much anyway), and the Irish had had the right to travel for ever anyway, so that wasn't any change.
It was only when the EU expanded eastwards that it became an issue. I think the number of migrant workers from those countries took everyone by surprise, and the unions weren't ready to deal with it, and hadn't thought strategic plans through enough. That was recognised during the last expansion, so more union work as done in the 'home' countries, including setting up of officers etc.
As to the EU wide union agreement no worker shall undercut a fellow worker in another EU nation, there isn't a formal one because that is a principal of trade unionism, it doesn't require an explicit document or motion saying so. Tho I am also not sure how it is relevant here, as these italian workers haven't been brought in by, or with the support of, any italian (or other) union.
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