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How much evidence is there of long term high level UK paedophile ring?

Also see this December 14th Exaro article about the police investigating why the police previously twice closed down the guest house investigation. Includes the police successfully requesting Exaro delay reporting on this aspect, the suggestion that the IPCC's role is being investigated, and the idea that police have already concluded that the 1982 investigation was not closed down for proper reasons.

http://www.exaronews.com/articles/4765/police-twice-failed-to-probe-paedophile-ring-at-guest-house
 
Given that Exaro are one of the only sources that give us information which will be of great use in the event of further cover-ups and failure to prosecute, I have no particular reason to doubt the quality of their info and the motives of their sources.

Sounds like the most recent stuff will get some more attention tomorrow:

@ExaroNews26m
It seems that at least two Sunday newspapers will tmrw follow up on our reports (one murder, one on spooks) re #Fernbridge and #Fairbank.
Click to expand...
 
elbows said:
Given that Exaro are one of the only sources that give us information which will be of great use in the event of further cover-ups and failure to prosecute, I have no particular reason to doubt the quality of their info and the motives of their sources.

Sounds like the most recent stuff will get some more attention tomorrow:
Click to expand...

I really hope that you're right.

Just taking so long for this to come to fruition that I'm suspicious that the sppoks are still on top of this.
 
I have less faith in the investigation proceeding properly than I did. I'm just confused as to why you think the Exaro reporting may be part of the problem rather than the opposite. They are the ones who are telling us about CPS decisions being changed, spook involvement, etc. Without them, and directly related Sunday People/Mirror articles, we'd have no clue as to what was going on with the investigation at all.
 
elbows said:
I have less faith in the investigation proceeding properly than I did. I'm just confused as to why you think the Exaro reporting may be part of the problem rather than the opposite. They are the ones who are telling us about CPS decisions being changed, spook involvement, etc. Without them, and directly related Sunday People/Mirror articles, we'd have no clue as to what was going on with the investigation at all.
Click to expand...

I've no problem at all with exaro; they're certainly the good guys. I just got a nasty feeling when I saw that same phrase ("a sourse close to the investigation"), in both the Herald and exaro pieces. It was the good faith of the source I was worrying about, not the journos.
 
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The impression they've given in the past is that investigation sources have briefed them in an attempt to make stuff public that makes it harder for investigations to quietly be closed down or sidetracked. Given the stuff that such sources come out with, I have trouble working out how it could play into the hands of those who would rather this stuff went away quietly.
 
elbows said:
The impression they've given in the past is that investigation sources have briefed them in an attempt to make stuff public that makes it harder for investigations to quietly be closed down or sidetracked. Given the stuff that such sources come out with, I have trouble working out how it could play into the hands of those who would rather this stuff went away quietly.
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Again, I really hope you're right; maybe i was just 'having a moment'?

It's just been such a 'jam tomorrow' story....and all the time it remains unresolved I'm suspicious......nothing solid; you know just a nasty feeling. Nothing more.
 
brogdale said:
Again, I really hope you're right; maybe i was just 'having a moment'?

It's just been such a 'jam tomorrow' story....and all the time it remains unresolved I'm suspicious......nothing solid; you know just a nasty feeling. Nothing more.
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I do agree. But I think that, as with Savile (and the rash of other high-profile celebs who've found their activities under the microscope since Savile), the wind is now blowing in the right direction. Whether they were actively complicit or not in the past, the police, and "authorities" are increasingly realising that there is no public appetite any more for "nothing to see here, move along now". In many ways, I think that's been the most significant outcome of the Savile business: for decades, most of us have been quite happy to be reassured that something we thought was too awful to contemplate wasn't really happening, and those doing the reassuring have been able with our tacit approval to carry on maintaining that situation, including failing to investigate allegations and in some cases actively discouraging people from making allegations.

That's no longer the case, and I think a lot more people (though by no means all) are sceptical about such reassurances. The police acted with uncharacteristic speed in turning things around and actually being prepared to listen to allegations (as I know from personal experience), and that, along with the publicity surrounding the high-profile abusers like Savile and Hall, has resulted in many more people coming forward. I think there is a general recognition now that the problem of child sexual abuse was far, far worse than anyone thought. There's work to be done: I think there is still a perception that it's a problem of the past, rather than a current ongoing one, and I suspect that there is still a belief in certain quarters that Very Senior People can still be protected by the same stonewalling and cover-ups that kept the likes of Savile safe for so long.

But I think that belief is a mistaken one, and I think that it can only be a matter of time before these claims are out in the open, and the lid truly off the can of worms. And I imagine that anyone, even at the highest echelons of society, who is in the child sexual abuse game right now is going to be feeling extremely uncomfortable and very worried.

Good.
 
existentialist said:
I do agree. But I think that, as with Savile (and the rash of other high-profile celebs who've found their activities under the microscope since Savile), the wind is now blowing in the right direction. Whether they were actively complicit or not in the past, the police, and "authorities" are increasingly realising that there is no public appetite any more for "nothing to see here, move along now". In many ways, I think that's been the most significant outcome of the Savile business: for decades, most of us have been quite happy to be reassured that something we thought was too awful to contemplate wasn't really happening, and those doing the reassuring have been able with our tacit approval to carry on maintaining that situation, including failing to investigate allegations and in some cases actively discouraging people from making allegations.

That's no longer the case, and I think a lot more people (though by no means all) are sceptical about such reassurances. The police acted with uncharacteristic speed in turning things around and actually being prepared to listen to allegations (as I know from personal experience), and that, along with the publicity surrounding the high-profile abusers like Savile and Hall, has resulted in many more people coming forward. I think there is a general recognition now that the problem of child sexual abuse was far, far worse than anyone thought. There's work to be done: I think there is still a perception that it's a problem of the past, rather than a current ongoing one, and I suspect that there is still a belief in certain quarters that Very Senior People can still be protected by the same stonewalling and cover-ups that kept the likes of Savile safe for so long.

But I think that belief is a mistaken one, and I think that it can only be a matter of time before these claims are out in the open, and the lid truly off the can of worms. And I imagine that anyone, even at the highest echelons of society, who is in the child sexual abuse game right now is going to be feeling extremely uncomfortable and very worried.

Good.
Click to expand...

Thanks for that considered and insightful post.

I hope you're right too.:)
 
butchersapron said:
May be a good time to link to The Boy Business as a number of people who seem well informed are making a public show of mentioning it this weekend.
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And here an earlier Nick Davies piece from 1997 which covers in detail that program. For those that don't/can't watch the program, I think reading this is just as informative (I just did both).

http://www.nickdavies.net/1997/03/01/a-paedophile-ring-in-amsterdam/

By the way I think Warwick Spinks is back in prison at the moment, though will probably be let out later this year. He broke his original terms of early release by leaving the country many years ago, and was finally caught again at Heathrow airport in November 2012.

I haven't seen any links between any of the people mentioned in these stories and any of the VIP investigations, since the Exaro death angles revolve around Sidney Cooke. Really unclear where these aspects are going.
 
The Sunday Express appear to have a front page headline 'Female MP abused boy in care'.

I don't have any other details yet, other than that she is described as a 'former MP'.
 
elbows said:
The Sunday Express appear to have a front page headline 'Female MP abused boy in care'.

I don't have any other details yet, other than that she is described as a 'former MP'.
Click to expand...

Odd?

Certainly not to do with the former minister stuff, then?
 
timthumb.php
 
I can't say its odd without being able to read their full story. Exaro didn't claim that sunday followups of their stories would be front-page either.

On another theme that I've talked about before, the Sunday Times has a story on its front page about '20 private schools face ruinous child sex abuse claims'. It appears to relate to compensation claims for abuse already documented and/or dealt with by the legal system, rather than new stuff.
 
elbows said:
I can't say its odd without being able to read their full story. Exaro didn't claim that sunday followups of their stories would be front-page either.

On another theme that I've talked about before, the Sunday Times has a story on its front page about '20 private schools face ruinous child sex abuse claims'. It appears to relate to compensation claims for abuse already documented and/or dealt with by the legal system, rather than new stuff.
Click to expand...

It's difficult to read, but it appears to say "...was involved in a paedophile network at the heart of government..."

I wonder if this is anything to do with Watson's claims and the Peter Morrison stuff?

e2a : the BBC site says this under the frontpage...

The Sunday Express carries a claim by a man who says he was abused while in care by two unnamed MPs in the 1980s.
Click to expand...
 
Its possible the Express has interviewed the same victim that some of the Exaro stories relates to, but went with a different angle for its headline.
 
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