Do angry vegans turn you against going vegan?
- Thread starter Watermelon Man
- Start date
kebabking
Not a Girly Swot, but I like them....
i note the definition of exploitation you've given hinges on the word unfair - which definition of unfair are we going for?
It's a selective definition too.
Exploit = the action of making use of and benefiting from resources, is just as common a usage.
editor
hiraethified
Quit the pendant, and keep on enjoying your maltreated animal food product.
Slimy fuckers.
kebabking
Not a Girly Swot, but I like them....
Is it animal cruelty to set up a trawling net for urbanites?
i suppose it depends on what the experience of those Urbanites will be once they've been caught...
editor
hiraethified
The OP lost all claim to be a King Troller after he ended up contributing so much. A real master troller just makes one post and sits back to watch the fun. As it happens, quite a good discussion has come out of it, so it's been a good threadIs it animal cruelty to set up a trawling net for urbanites?
Veal cages.
kebabking
Not a Girly Swot, but I like them....
i'm not being a pedant, i'm slightly interested in whether you believe that any use/exploitation/whatever of any animal is by definition cruelty.
Yuwipi Woman
Whack-A-Mole Queen
I thought that was Morrissey.
5t3IIa
Registered User
But do they have a central nervous system?
editor
hiraethified
I would have thought that the common definition of 'exploitation' makes it clear that it's never a good thing to be on the receiving end of it, and in some cases cruelty of some kind will be involved. HTH. HAND.
kebabking
Not a Girly Swot, but I like them....
i would not have had you down as being a 14yo girl. every days a school day...
DotCommunist
So many particulars. So many questions.
i rely on distributed ganglial nodesBut do they have a central nervous system?
veganomics
Active Member
My prediction is that as humans become more civilised and less savage, the dodgy practices that are currently widespread and that many people take for granted will gradually become unacceptable and slowly fade away. In the transition period there will be hardcore carnists that will desperately cling on to these unethical practices and as is evident in this thread, will resort to all sorts of ridiculous and nonsense arguments in order to try and justify what they do. "I once heard a vegan say something bad and have since concluded that all vegans are terrible and I will continue to eat meat...so there...that'll learn 'em...stupid fuckin' vegans". For those that didn't know this, vegans come in all shapes and sizes, just like people in other groups, which kinda makes the OP question a bit silly. I'm willing to bet that there are more proper dodgy meatheads on the planet than all of the vegans combined.
The various civil rights movements over the last 100+ years have resulted in better attitudes and more evolved and ethical behaviour in the more civilised countries where things like slavery, racicm, sexism, child labour, homophobia are no longer widely accepted as "normal". In order to change the attitudes of the majority, it would often take the actions and words of some brave individuals to wake up the rest of the population, sometimes at the cost of their own lives. There is no doubt that as with all groups of people, there are some amongst that group who are passionate advocates for their cause, and that their passion may occaisionally overstep the mark. Although I haven't met any myself, perhaps there are "angry vegans" that are willing to fight their corner and speak out against the widely accepted "unethical" norms. Good luck to them. Even if there do happen to be a few "bad apples" amongst vegans, I think the underlying principles of veganism are fairly sound, and the carnist counter arguments are for the most part a bit of a joke. (the apex predator "argument" being a prime example).
The various civil rights movements over the last 100+ years have resulted in better attitudes and more evolved and ethical behaviour in the more civilised countries where things like slavery, racicm, sexism, child labour, homophobia are no longer widely accepted as "normal". In order to change the attitudes of the majority, it would often take the actions and words of some brave individuals to wake up the rest of the population, sometimes at the cost of their own lives. There is no doubt that as with all groups of people, there are some amongst that group who are passionate advocates for their cause, and that their passion may occaisionally overstep the mark. Although I haven't met any myself, perhaps there are "angry vegans" that are willing to fight their corner and speak out against the widely accepted "unethical" norms. Good luck to them. Even if there do happen to be a few "bad apples" amongst vegans, I think the underlying principles of veganism are fairly sound, and the carnist counter arguments are for the most part a bit of a joke. (the apex predator "argument" being a prime example).
editor
hiraethified
Good grief. If you act like a dull pedant, I'll treat you like one, and now that you're turning into sexist buffoon, I'll leave you to it.
littlebabyjesus
one of Maxwell's demons
Always makes me uneasy when I hear equivalences drawn between human civil rights issues and the ethics of eating meat.
DotCommunist
So many particulars. So many questions.
I was just looking for morisey quotes because he's the only high profile angry vegan I can think of and found this:
2009: Morrissey leaves the stage at Coachella, explaining "The smell of burning animals is making me sick. I can smell burning flesh . . . and I hope to God it's human."
which is funny but then theres that time he called chinese people a subspecies cos of their animal treatment, which is not funny. Also saying the Utoya massacre was nothing compared to what happens daily in KFC
literally never met someone like that, I struggle to believe he exists
2009: Morrissey leaves the stage at Coachella, explaining "The smell of burning animals is making me sick. I can smell burning flesh . . . and I hope to God it's human."
which is funny but then theres that time he called chinese people a subspecies cos of their animal treatment, which is not funny. Also saying the Utoya massacre was nothing compared to what happens daily in KFC
literally never met someone like that, I struggle to believe he exists
littlebabyjesus
one of Maxwell's demons
Years ago I knew one or two vegan policemen. They exist.
cupid_stunt
Chief seagull hater & farmerbarleymow's nemesis.
Vegan pigs, whatever next.
littlebabyjesus
one of Maxwell's demons
We always end up talking past each other on threads like this ime. The idea that you can be fine with eating meat and also be concerned about animal welfare is one that some struggle to accept.
ddraig
kicking against the pricks...
carnist fragility!
ddraig
kicking against the pricks...
but why eat meat at all if that's your concern? it's your choice after all
cue more hysterics and the usual "vegan food costs more" "how dare you tell people what to eat" "you killed 3 gnats when you were out cycling the other day so ner" blah blah boring shite
littlebabyjesus
one of Maxwell's demons
Not in the slightest. I don't draw an equivalence between all sentient life forms, and I think it is extremely dodgy to do so.
littlebabyjesus
one of Maxwell's demons
See.
ddraig
kicking against the pricks...
think what you like doesn't make it so
not going round with you again on this as you're proper stuck in your ways and "justifications"
veganomics
Active Member
Well I suppose everybody has different sensitivities and tolerance levels. I think there are many similarities between the mistreatment of humans and the mistreatment of animals. Of course those that don't want to feel any sort of guilt when they bite into their McNuggets, T-Bone or foie gras, would prefer it if the animals that they regularly munch are seen as "lesser" beings and therefore we don't need to be as concerned for their welfare.
Killing animals for food when we don't really need to do so doesn't appear to have much to do with welfare imo. Reminds me of that oxymorinic phrase, "humane slaughter".
littlebabyjesus
one of Maxwell's demons
It's the difference between intraspecific competition and interspecific competition. We as a species have made strides to curb the former and see its elimination, or at least strict regulation, as something both morally good and achievable. The latter is simply unachievable. Denying that is a form of self-hatred.
They are indeed, cetaceans can show a whole range of behaviours some vicious, puts me in mind of that land mammal, what are they called? oh yeah humans.
Similar threads
