Do angry vegans turn you against going vegan?

[UnderOpenSky]

Did you not read it?

It seemed to me her main bones of contention were
1. Promoters using vegan to mean healthy
2. The notion of pledging / signing up, which she characterized as hard sell
3. The risk that a vegan diet as promoted to people with eating disorders may end up exacerbating the disorder
4. That veganism is promoted as something to adopt wholesale and this may put people off. She feels it's presented as all-or-nothing, when many people would be happy to make some effort this is considered hypocritical or insufficient.
5. Graphic adverts are unnecessary and counter productive.

I didn't consider point 5 to be her main argument. And none of the above are my arguments.

That's a very good summery. Even as a meat eater I thought most of it was bollocks.

 

[Spymaster]

Did you not read it?

It seemed to me her main bones of contention were
1. Promoters using vegan to mean healthy
2. The notion of pledging / signing up, which she characterized as hard sell
3. The risk that a vegan diet as promoted to people with eating disorders may end up exacerbating the disorder
4. That veganism is promoted as something to adopt wholesale and this may put people off. She feels it's presented as all-or-nothing, when many people would be happy to make some effort this is considered hypocritical or insufficient.
5. Graphic adverts are unnecessary and counter productive.

I didn't consider point 5 to be her main argument. And none of the above are my arguments.

Cheers. I was just about to do the same, point by point.

 

[Spymaster]

That's a very good summery. Even as a meat eater I thought most of it was bollocks.

And this is why the subject is untenably polarised!

 

[mojo pixy]

That's a very good summery. Even as a meat eater I thought most of it was bollocks.

It is, and so is "veganuary", as already mentioned, promoting a 100% veg diet in the middle of winter when almost nothing is in season looks a bit dim.

 

[ddraig]

Did you not read it?

It seemed to me her main bones of contention were
1. Promoters using vegan to mean healthy
2. The notion of pledging / signing up, which she characterized as hard sell
3. The risk that a vegan diet as promoted to people with eating disorders may end up exacerbating the disorder
4. That veganism is promoted as something to adopt wholesale and this may put people off. She feels it's presented as all-or-nothing, when many people would be happy to make some effort this is considered hypocritical or insufficient.
5. Graphic adverts are unnecessary and counter productive.

I didn't consider point 5 to be her main argument. And none of the above are my arguments.

thanks
1. of course promoters are going to use the best bits, you can be an unhealthy vegan of course but the vast majority agree it is a healthy thing to do, even they and people on this thread do
2. so what? just don't sign up, some posters in a tube station or on buses is not hard sell, people stopping you in the street to sign you up or phoning you is 'hard sell'
3. errr then that is a risk with anything then, people with eating disorders need to be careful with any change in their diet, nothing to do with veganism. And is there any actual evidence of this other than "it could so shouldn't be promoted"?
4. How is getting people to try it for a month, ONE MONTH making people adopt it "wholesale", if it was all or nothing it would be "go vegan" and not encouraging people to do it for just a month. And again why the fuck do people care what the campaign says if it's not for them ignore it.
5. do Veganuary do any graphic adverts then?? or is this the lumping of every vegan org into one thing to point and sneer at, hypocrisy hunt and catch out??

lots of people have done it in the past and felt benefits, lots of people have continued to be vegan after the month, some have gone back to eating meat and everything they used to do in December or before, whoopee

 

[ddraig]

It is, and so is "veganuary", as already mentioned, promoting a 100% veg diet in the middle of winter when almost nothing is in season looks a bit dim.

ffs we've already covered this
do meat eaters just eat seasonal meat in January then? nothing imported at all? no veg, nothing??
it may look dim to those looking to demonise veganism but it's clearly a thing that is working to expand veganism and a way of getting more people clued up on it and giving them an experience of it.

It's not just adverts and "DO IT NOW YOU FUCKING CARNIST OR YOU'RE A CUNT" it's backed up with many recipes, advice and even mentors

 

[UnderOpenSky]

It is, and so is "veganuary", as already mentioned, promoting a 100% veg diet in the middle of winter when almost nothing is in season looks a bit dim.

Yeah, that's a fair point, but how many people buy all their food from farmers markets and eat seasonly? My partner runs a small veg box scheme and even I don't mange that.

 

[mojo pixy]

ffs we've already covered this
do meat eaters just eat seasonal meat in January then? nothing imported at all? no veg, nothing??
it may look dim to those looking to demonise veganism but it's clearly a thing that is working to expand veganism and a way of getting more people clued up on it and giving them an experience of it.

It's not just adverts and "DO IT NOW YOU FUCKING CARNIST OR YOU'RE A CUNT" it's backed up with many recipes, advice and even mentors

Why not July then? Why January? It's a marketing scam like all diets are, promoted in January cos people feel fat and will spend extra money then to slim down. Yay marketing.

 

[8ball]

It is, and so is "veganuary", as already mentioned, promoting a 100% veg diet in the middle of winter when almost nothing is in season looks a bit dim.

It also distracts from “Fanuary” (the women’s version of “Movember”).

 

[ddraig]

Why not July then? Why January? It's a marketing scam like all diets are, promoted in January cos people feel fat and will spend extra money then to slim down. Yay marketing.

or people are looking to maybe try something new and change something in their life so why not? maybe like lots of people, including here, some are looking to reduce their meat eating and this is a way for them to try it

I'd not seen it as a diet thing, more of a health thing, reduction of cruelty thing and an environmental thing
do you have a go at gyms who advertise in January? slimfast and other companies?

who is it scamming and who is benefiting from this scam?
i've only seen good reports from people who have done it, do you have any bad ones to counter?

 

[Jeff Robinson]

Why not July then? Why January? It's a marketing scam like all diets are, promoted in January cos people feel fat and will spend extra money then to slim down. Yay marketing.

Or maybe because January is just after people make New Year’s Resolutions and is seen by many as the perfect time to make a fresh start in life?

 

[mojo pixy]

do you have a go at gyms who advertise in January? slimfast and other companies?

Yes.

who is it scamming and who is benefiting from this scam?

Companies benefit, unhappy people pay. Usual fad/diet mechanics.

 

[Jeff Robinson]

or people are looking to maybe try something new and change something in their life so why not? maybe like lots of people, including here, some are looking to reduce their meat eating and this is a way for them to try it

I'd not seen it as a diet thing, more of a health thing, reduction of cruelty thing and an environmental thing
do you have a go at gyms who advertise in January? slimfast and other companies?

who is it scamming and who is benefiting from this scam?
i've only seen good reports from people who have done it, do you have any bad ones to counter?

Yeah but sneering cycnism is so much more fun than doing anything positive or constructive.

 

[ddraig]

Yes.



Companies benefit, unhappy people pay. Usual fad/diet mechanics.

what company is behind veganuary then? or what companies will benefit?

 

[mojo pixy]

Or maybe because January is just after people make New Year’s Resolutions and is seen by many as the perfect time to make a fresh start in life?

Yes, exploitation of good will for profit, happens every year the same.

 

[Jeff Robinson]

what company is behind veganuary then? or what companies will benefit?

The broccoli industry of course.

 

[ddraig]

The broccoli industry of course.

and Gary, they benefit loads!

 

[mojo pixy]

I'm one of those crazy people who does what I want and need to do without an advertising campaign to keep me feeling fresh.

 

[mojo pixy]

Who will profit? Those ever so bourgeois little startups promoting lifestyle consumption. Just what we need more of.

 

[ddraig]

I'm one of those crazy people who does what I want and need to do without an advertising campaign to keep me feeling fresh.

well done you
let's sneer at those not as strong and sensible than you, those that need a bit of encouragement or help along their way

 

[ddraig]

Who will profit? Those ever so bourgeois little startups promoting lifestyle consumption. Just what we need more of.

such as? and how are they connected?

 

[purenarcotic]

The ED stuff comes from the ‘clean eating’ shite - believe the term now coined for it is orthorexia. I know there has been concern from BEAT about how the obsession with clean eating from lifestyle folk on social media was affecting those with and at risk of developing eating disorders and they are watching things quite carefully. I don’t think veganism is really the same thing - my vegan friends don’t moan on about ‘refined’ sugar whilst hoofing maple syrup down without a hint of irony.

 

[Jeff Robinson]

I'm one of those crazy people who does what I want and need to do without an advertising campaign to keep me feeling fresh.

Next time you accuse a vegan of being self-righteous or up themselves please remember that you wrote that. ^^^

 

[ddraig]

The ED stuff comes from the ‘clean eating’ shite - believe the term now coined for it is orthorexia. I know there has been concern from BEAT about how the obsession with clean eating from lifestyle folk on social media was affecting those with and at risk of developing eating disorders and they are watching things quite carefully. I don’t think veganism is really the same thing - my vegan friends don’t moan on about ‘refined’ sugar whilst hoofing maple syrup down without a hint of irony.

indeed

a quote from a young woman elsewhere that story was posted

i HATE it when people (namely people who aren't vegan) make connections between the lifestyle and 'restrictive' eating. there's nothing restrictive about it! i see it as absolute abundance, coming from a past of restrictive eating and calorie counting i love vegan food because i don't have to count the cals cause god damn a full belly on veggies & grains is a lot less damaging to the waistline than that of steak!

 

[beesonthewhatnow]

Yep, there’s definitely nothing restrictive about a vegan diet. Apart from it hugely restricting the the things you can eat

 

[mojo pixy]

Next time you accuse a vegan of being self-righteous or up themselves please remember that you wrote that. ^^^

I sure will, as long as you remember that one bit of self-righteousness doesn't excuse another

 

[8ball]

Yep, there’s definitely nothing restrictive about a vegan diet. Apart from it hugely restricting the the things you can eat

Then again, if you start planning before Christmas I guess going vegan for Jan might mean finding some things you like that you might not otherwise try.

 

[ddraig]

Yep, there’s definitely nothing restrictive about a vegan diet. Apart from it hugely restricting the the things you can eat

round of applause for bees, knew someone would jump on that part! take a bow for getting in first

restricting clearly by restricting the cruelty and flesh on your plate but how is it "hugely" restricting?

 

[mojo pixy]

well done you
let's sneer at those not as strong and sensible than you, those that need a bit of encouragement or help along their way

Let's sneer at people who need encouragement themselves but who in turn sneer at people who didn't make the same dietary choice as them.

Sneering, eh? Who mentioned that then? Takes one to know one, I reckon.

 

[ddraig]

oh dear, scraping the barrel now

where is the sneering at people who don't make the same dietary choices as them here?