Beating the Fascists: The authorised history of Anti-Fascist Action

[malatesta32]

I imagine that you logged out of FB and haven't been back since,

i, like may others here, are not under the illusion that C18 were the 'terror outfit' they were made out to be by certain 'antifascist organisations.' read BTF to find examples of C18 being effective (you wont find any!)

 

[steeplejack]

your humour detector appears to be defective.

 

[tony.c]

(i think the point is that mr charlie is in denial!!!!)

Was he known as 'Charlie' because of his taste for/dealing in Colombian marching powder?

 

[tony.c]

Just seen this on a mate's bookshelf. Is it any good then? Must be controversial if this thread is over 150 pages!

Borrow it from your mate. It's certainly worth reading if you have any interest in ant-fascism. I found it a bit difficult to read because of the small print, and mainly read just the 'action' bits, skipping through the 'political' stuff first time round. But I've recently read the whole book.

 

[Fozzie Bear]

Just seen this on a mate's bookshelf. Is it any good then? Must be controversial if this thread is over 150 pages!

I'd thoroughly recommend reading the book. It's a page turner.

This thread is more like the extra bits you get on DVDs that appeal to the die-hards and spotters. Which is also great, but in a different way.

 

[butchersapron]

Borrow it from your mate. It's certainly worth reading if you have any interest in ant-fascism. I found it a bit difficult to read because of the small print, and mainly read just the 'action' bits, skipping through the 'political' stuff first time round. But I've recently read the whole book.

Did the 'political' stuff become political to you on second read?

 

[tony.c]

I skipped through the accounts of the disagreements and intrigues between Red Action and anarchists, NMP, etc within AFA. I did read them second time, but didn't find them particularly interesting.

 

[butchersapron]

Because they were political or 'political'? Or...

 

[tony.c]

I just didn't find them that interesting. I am interested in politics, and the politics within anti-fascism, and would support the RA line. I understand that BTF is about what happened within AFA, as well as what they did though, and that we need to learn from what has happened in the past.

Edit: I probably didn't find the internal arguments that relevant also because I think RA were the main force within AFA, and the stance of other groups were largely irrelevant. But I realise they would have been of consequence at the time.

 

[audiotech]

As you gear yourself up for what appears to be yet another ill-judged crusade, pause for just a moment to consider why despite intense media scrutiny this individual that 'everything' supposedly 'revolved around' has never been found and is still unidentified nearly two decades later?

Now if that fails to provoke even the tiniest element of doubt, then, by all means, plough on...

No "crusade", just pointing out words from a steward who was there. On reflection, his words about someone wearing "red overalls" whilst he "spurts" a C18 flag does enter into the realm of the bizarre.

 

[audiotech]

Had you been present to witness all this it would doubtless have been passed on as evidence of Millwall being a Fash stronghold. You arse.

Don't be daft.

 

[Red Storm]

i've just asked whether the book's true. your reluctance to give a straight answer to a straight question doesn't fill me with confidence in the book's accuracy. yeh there's things in there that *could* have happened - all the stuff about bugging fash meetings, for example - but everyone knows that intelligence officers don't give away their tactics, techniques or procedures. if you do then the enemy gets wise to them. take for example the time when harry's place had a bit about how they tracked down the location of a pub the bnp used. since then the number of photos of socials and so on on bnp websites and blogs has delined significantly. so to me what's in nr doesn't ring true. is it true? or is it cobblers?

I can vouch for the bugging of fash meetings. I have heard the originals and have a number of copies of bugged Manchester and Salford BNP meetings from around the late 80s to the mid 90s.

I should really put them on the Anti-Fascist Archive

They are now on the Anti-Fascist Archive:

http://antifascistarchive.com/2013/08/31/intelligence-gathering-bugged-bnp-meetings/


Trying to put up the last remaining material I have.

 

[Pickman's model]

i, like may others here, are not under the illusion that C18 were the 'terror outfit' they were made out to be by certain 'antifascist organisations.' read BTF to find examples of C18 being effective (you wont find any!)

they or their mates did a lot of graffiti, i recall kentish town station being covered in c18 graff back in 92, 93. this would be round the time the fash met at the assembly rooms. there was also a lot of fash graffiti round the west kentish town estate in those days

 

[bignose1]

They are now on the Anti-Fascist Archive:

http://antifascistarchive.com/2013/08/31/intelligence-gathering-bugged-bnp-meetings/


Trying to put up the last remaining material I have.

Ive just had a quick glimpse before I had to go out. The last recording i'snt an interview with Holocaust denier, cemetery desecrator, Mark Jones of the BNP, its actually a taped interview with a suspected War Criminal from one of the Baltic States( auxillary police battallion). His name escapes me at the moment but he was one of a not insignificant number we( Searchlight/All Party WCG) were investigating around the time. This character was living in Nottingham.

 

[Red Storm]

Ive just had a quick glimpse before I have to go out. The last recording i'snt an interview with Holocaust denier, cemetery desecrator and Mark Jones of the its actually a taped interview with a suspected War Criminal from one of the Baltic States( auxillary police battallion). His name escapes me at the moment but he was one of a not insignificant number we( Searchlight/All Party WCG) were investigating around the time. This character was living in Nottingham.

Ah okay.

Let me know if the name comes back to you.

 

[bignose1]

Ah okay.

Let me know if the name comes back to you.

Antas Derzinksas (amended)

 

[framed]

Who could forget that name?

 

[bignose1]

Who could forget that name?

I went to a stag do over there...where?..that'd be tallin..

 

[DaveCinzano]

I went to a stag do over there...where?..that'd be tallin..

Where there's a Vilnius there's a way.

 

[JTG]

Where there's a Vilnius there's a way.

I find this post lacking in intellectual Riga

 

[Fedayn]

Where there's a Vilnius there's a way.

Lett that be a lesson to you.

 

[DaveCinzano]

Eesti does it.

 

[Pickman's model]

these baltick puns are trakai

 

[Pickman's model]

as long as we're not cutting kaunas then we can continue in this vein

i just like to see it done properly

 

[FNG]

There was a flag at the lansdowne road match that was misidentified as C18 in some of the media.The Eastern Daily Press( a norwich based paper) looked into it as it was a cross of st george with the legend norwich across the central bar and a vaguely militaristic graphic in the left hand corner.turned out it was the west ham crest and belonged to a west ham fan that resided in norwich at the time. By all acounts he was a bit of a billy no mates.

E2a this one

the Norwich ident is barely prominent in this one, moreso in the ones with fans chucking things off the upper stand if memory serves

 

[bignose1]

You make me feel like danzig....................Lechs Gdansk.....

....come on....songs and Baltic region theme.

 

[Spanky Longhorn]

we're gonna Rostock down to Electric Avenue

 

[bignose1]

Ah okay.

Let me know if the name comes back to you.

Amongst others there's two that stick out. Antanas Gecevicius and Antas Derzinskas....... with the former living in Edinburgh and the other Nottingham.

( amended post)

 

[bignose1]

I beg your pardon...I never promised you a Puttgarden

 

[bignose1]

The Derzinskas character lived for quite a while in Oldham after coming to the UK after the war. He later moved to Notts where (from memory) another alleged war criminal (whose name came up after our initial investigations - late 80's) had/was working as a bus driver