The big Brexit thread - news, updates and discussion

[two sheds]

Even if supermarkets are "flooded" with crap US stuff it will still be people's choice whether to buy it or not

Haven't they not labelled GM food as GM in the US because of the negative publicity? I seem to remember the GM companies said it was unfair competition if they had to label it GM. I've found a couple of articles that back that up, although others say they will have to be labelled 'bioengineered'.

I can imagine them importing food into N. Ireland (for example) and relabelling it as from there. Will presumably depend on the trade deal.

 

[stdP]

Italian bakeries are indeed superior to French bakeries. Italian cheese is better too.

No argument here - what astonished me about italian cheeses were how so few of them had any names, I suspect because so many of them are just made in a glorified shed as a practical hobby (like much of the smaller scales of wine). Epithets like "Uncle So-and-So's Half-Sheep, Half-Goat Cheese" seemed to be very common for many of the ones you'll come across grazing through various towns.

Yet another Brexit Bonus™ was an italian friend having their (much delayed) christmas care package of cheese, biscuits, sausages and olive oil from the family smallholding having a huge customs charge slapped on it (more than it would have cost to buy all the items in it in an expensive deli apparently, so it wasn't paid).

 

[Bahnhof Strasse]

Do you understand the issue with chlorinated chicken? It's not that the chicken itself is unsafe, it is that the act of chlorination is deemed necessary due to lower standards further back in the chain. I'd really advise you to look into chicken farming in the US. It's a horror story for both the chickens and the humans working with them.

You have that arse about face. Chlorinated chicken was banned in the EU because it was thought that as chlorine is so good at killing the bugs in chicken it could lead those in chicken killing/plucking places to be more lax with hygiene standards. The EU still permits chlorinated salad and so on.

 

[The39thStep]

What are we looking to sell in US markets if we do a trade deal?

Several posters on here?

 

[Artaxerxes]

What are we looking to sell in US markets if we do a trade deal?

The NHS

 

[littlebabyjesus]

You have that arse about face. Chlorinated chicken was banned in the EU because it was thought that as chlorine is so good at killing the bugs in chicken it could lead those in chicken killing/plucking places to be more lax with hygiene standards. The EU still permits chlorinated salad and so on.

That's a rather nuanced distinction to make tbh. The point is the same - lower standards are enforced further back in the chain in the US due to chlorination.

 

[editor]

No I've read all that sort of stuff, its been posted up on here many times and I really don't have a problem with the idea of chlorinated chicken in itself.

So you're absolutely OK with the lower animal welfare standards associated with chlorinated chicken?

 

[Bahnhof Strasse]

That's a rather nuanced distinction to make tbh. The point is the same - lower standards are enforced further back in the chain in the US due to chlorination.

It's not really nuanced at all, the hard fact is that the EU banned it in case it led to lower standards, whereas you state it is used because of lower standards, which is quite a different thing and just not true.

 

[littlebabyjesus]

It's not really nuanced at all, the hard fact is that the EU banned it in case it led to lower standards, whereas you state it is used because of lower standards, which is quite a different thing and just not true.

Here's the soil association.

High levels of hygiene and animal welfare promote a healthy farm environment, eliminating the need to wash chicken with chlorine.

The practice shouldn’t be necessary. Which raises the question - what lower standards in the production process does chlorine washing aim to patch over?

Keeping chickens in large flocks in dirty conditions makes it much more likely that bacteria will develop and spread.

On farms like this, chickens are often fed antibiotics as a preventative measure to stop infection and chlorine-washed after slaughter to kill bacteria.

However, this doesn’t support a good quality of life for chickens and reliance on antibiotics in farming means these lifesaving drugs are less effective for humans.

Chlorine washing and routine use of antibiotics should not be seen as a way to compensate for cramped or dirty conditions on the farm or in the abattoir.

What is chlorinated chicken?

If the standards are the same, why bother chlorine washing?

 

[The39thStep]

So you're absolutely OK with the lower animal welfare standards associated with chlorinated chicken?

Again this has been discussed many times on here .

 

[two sheds]

I'd have to contest this and say italian biscuits are superb. Indeed, I think much of the everyday italian baking and confectionery is superior to the - usually much better regarded - french equivalents.

Dutch biscuits with cinnamon are lovely too, and the pindakoekjes (peanut biscuits).

 

[editor]

Again this has been discussed many times on here .

Could you just answer the question please? It's really straightforward.

On a related note, it seems that Chlorinated Chicken isn't necessary safe anyway, regardless of the animal welfare standards:

1. Is Chlorinated Chicken safe?
Research from Southampton University found that disease-causing bacteria like listeria and salmonella ‘remain active’ after chlorine washing. Chlorine washing just makes it impossible to detect the bacteria in the lab, giving the false impression that the bacteria have been killed when they haven’t.

This means chlorine washed chicken could still carry salmonella and other bacteria, which is a clear human health risk. In fact, rates of food poisoning have been recorded several times higher in the US than the UK; however, considering this information is notoriously difficult to monitor, it is impossible to say with certainty.

What is chlorinated chicken?

www.soilassociation.org

.

 

[Bahnhof Strasse]

Here's the soil association.



What is chlorinated chicken?

If the standards are the same, why bother chlorine washing?

Yeah? That's exactly what I said, chlorine is the best thing to kill the bugs, but it is feared that it could lead to lower standards, not that it does lead to lower standards. Very much like when at the school I was expelled from they didn't allow us to bring in snacks in case we littered the grounds, rather than punishing those who did litter they punished everyone in case someone did wrong.

 

[two sheds]

Side salads were amazing in some diners in the US I ate at - meal in themselves pretty well.

 

[littlebabyjesus]

Yeah? That's exactly what I said, chlorine is the best thing to kill the bugs, but it is feared that it could lead to lower standards, not that it does lead to lower standards. Very much like when at the school I was expelled from they didn't allow us to bring in snacks in case we littered the grounds, rather than punishing those who did litter they punished everyone in case someone did wrong.

That's incredibly naive. Read up on chicken farming in the US. You're painfully wrong if you think allowing chlorinated chicken doesn't lower standards.

 

[bimble]

The chlorine is used because the chickens in America live their lives stood on piles of shit and dead chickens isn’t it? Because there’s no laws about keeping your chickens clean.

 

[agricola]

The chlorine is used because the chickens in America live their lives stood on piles of shit and dead chickens isn’t it? Because there’s no laws about keeping your chickens clean.

View attachment 254340

TBF the number of times the "main character gets food poisoning" plotline comes up in US TV shows should have been a bit of a giveaway.

 

[littlebabyjesus]

It requires bizarre mental gymnastics to deny that there are issues with this.

 

[brogdale]

Defending the environmental and health damage resulting from US corporate agri-business is where folk find themselves when they've chosen the brand of neoliberalism they prefer and have tied their colours to its mast.

 

[bimble]

Here you go, there are differences, in that chicken farmers in America can pretty much do whatever they like, there are almost no enforced standards at all, keeping costs nice and low.
Great Valentine’s Day this.

https://www.britishpoultry.org.uk/identity-cms/wp-content/uploads/2018/05/2016-ADAS-EU-US-comparison.pdf

 

[two sheds]

And no doubt has been pointed out but if American farmers can produce the cheaper meat because of their lower standards then British farmers will have to follow or go out of business.

 

[bimble]

In response to a question about the current issues with trading with the EU, Mr Raab says that in ten years time we'll be exporting loads of stuff to the indo-pacific, so not to worry.

 

[brogdale]

In response to a question about the current issues with trading with the EU, Mr Raab says that in ten years time we'll be exporting loads of stuff to the indo-pacific, so not to worry.

Brexit BRICshit.

 

[Artaxerxes]

In response to a question about the current issues with trading with the EU, Mr Raab says that in ten years time we'll be exporting loads of stuff to the indo-pacific, so not to worry.

Britain wondering through the desert to the promised sunlit uplands

 

[ATOMIC SUPLEX]

Don't mind the waffles/pancakes they do for breakfast.

Good for you. I hate both those things american style.

I ordered food that was similar to the things I liked or that sounded like I might like them, or was willing to take a chance on. I expect a few misses and a few hits. Usually I am happy for everything inbetween because it is something different, which can be interesting in itself. I'm been to the US a few times but can only remember two meals that were good. Tenpanyaki in a Japanese restaurant and a meal in a Cambodian restaurant. It's not often I can't clear a plate, but it happened often, not because I was full, but because it was horrible.

 

[Flavour]

If they can afford to turn up their nose at cheap food, of course.

Lentils will continue to be cheaper than chicken no matter how chlorinated the latter may be

 

[Pickman's model]

Britain wondering through the desert to the promised sunlit uplands

The desolate Tibetan plateau

 

[philosophical]

Does Lindor ever fail to deliver?
Couldn't find any in America, or decent tea.

 

[extra dry]

Yeah? That's exactly what I said, chlorine is the best thing to kill the bugs, but it is feared that it could lead to lower standards, not that it does lead to lower standards. Very much like when at the school I was expelled from they didn't allow us to bring in snacks in case we littered the grounds, rather than punishing those who did litter they punished everyone in case someone did wrong.

That sounds like something they would do.

 

[sleaterkinney]

It’s not just the low standards in us food, it’s all the hormones they stuff the animals with. I’d be a veggie over there, that’s how bad it is.