Manchester City 22/23
- Thread starter twistedAM
- Start date
Zapp Brannigan
Built like a steakhouse, handles like a bistro
I don't like the owners. I strongly suspect that the 115 charges are accurate and the books have been cooked for a decade plus.
But it is possible to compartmentalise all that and marvel at the quality of the side put together and how they play. Guardiola over the course of a few short years has evolved the team to the point where the midfield 4 completely outnumber and overrun the opposition 2 or 3, with seemingly endless passing lanes to move the ball forward, playing around almost any pressing system. Yet somehow those numbers in the middle don't seem to result in spaces left in behind anywhere else.
Last night's match was something else. Madrid's midfield has long been close to the benchmark but they were absolutely taken apart.
But it is possible to compartmentalise all that and marvel at the quality of the side put together and how they play. Guardiola over the course of a few short years has evolved the team to the point where the midfield 4 completely outnumber and overrun the opposition 2 or 3, with seemingly endless passing lanes to move the ball forward, playing around almost any pressing system. Yet somehow those numbers in the middle don't seem to result in spaces left in behind anywhere else.
Last night's match was something else. Madrid's midfield has long been close to the benchmark but they were absolutely taken apart.
RD2003
Got a really fucking shitty attitude
There are not 115 charges. That's the total number of supposed infringements. Apparently the actual charges can be boiled down to four or five different categories, some of which are minor.
Neither is it a case of 'cooking the books.' The charges are mostly for allegedly circumventing FFP-something that didn't even exist when other clubs were spending big and dominating, and blatantly designed, mostly through pressure from the former 'Big Four,' to keep what remained of the closed shop nature of the PL (and with UEFA FFP the CL.) Support City, West Ham, Everton, Newcastle etc etc? Fine, have a pat on the head but forget about ever challenging for major honours. And carry on selling us your best players.
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sorry, but that's a ridiculously biased assessment and the idea that it's about protecting the top 4 is just conspiraloon stuff.
it's exactly about cooking the books, and about a nation state circumventing the rules designed to protect some form of 'fair play'. city can challenge the rules if they like but can't pretend it's nothing.
and yes - no doubt the side now is one of the best. can accept that.
Zapp Brannigan
Built like a steakhouse, handles like a bistro
It is exactly "cooking the books". The simplistic version is that companies called variants of "Definitely Not The Owners of Manchester City Ltd" just happened to sponsor the club for 76 kajillion pounds over the going rate, artificially inflating income and therefore allowing far greater spend than would otherwise be allowed.
RD2003
Got a really fucking shitty attitude
No it isn't. You can easily find, for instance, the articles where Platini talks about how the G14 or whatever they were calling themselves at the time, hijacked the FFP rules, which were supposed to be primarily about debt and not about preventing investment and thus the potential for a club to advance beyond its current level.
How is it fair play to prevent a club being able to compete with the existing elite, thus guaranteeing that the elite is never challenged, not least by being the only clubs with the ability to pay for the top talent?
Circumventing the rules is not 'cooking the books' and it goes on in all forms of business. And it's a business war we're talking about here, in that if a 'newcomer' is able to challenge the existing elite then one of that elite has to lose out. This is particularly galling to those clubs built on the US model primarily designed to draw a dividend from a club, and which sees nothing bad about sporting closed shops. Hence their fear of serious investment in rival clubs and their desperation to push the idea of a European Super League.
If you look up all the legal stuff, you will find that City are owned by Sheikh Mansour as a private individual and not Abu Dhabi.
Abu Dhabi is not, in any case, a nation state.
RD2003
Got a really fucking shitty attitude
Except that CAS found that this hadn't happened. We will have to wait and see what the PL panel's findings will be.
And again, where is the 'fair play' in restricting investment when no such restriction existed during the quite recent periods of dominance by other clubs?
belboid
Exasperated, not angry.
they didn't find 'this hadn't happened', that is simply untrue. They found the claims were 'unproven' - ie there wasn't enough evidence, not that it was wrong. And that the claims were out of time. They've now collected a load more evidence and the time factor isn't an issue.
OK well now at least I know you can't have a sensible conversation about it
RD2003
Got a really fucking shitty attitude
Only some of the claims-a minority-were judged to be out of time.
If there was extra evidence then it was up to those bringing charges to provide it. They couldn't despite City's books being examined in detail.
As it's never been disclosed anywhere what the supposed evidence is, it's impossible to assume that extra evidence has been 'collected.' It isn't even the same body pressing the charges: the charges stem from the same time as the UEFA investigation was launched, and, as far as anybody knows, are laid on the same basis as those that were dismissed at CAS.
It seems that the time factor is going to be an issue, as the PL is apparently trying to apply new rules retrospectively, which is never normally done in business and thus open to a legal challenge.
RD2003
Got a really fucking shitty attitude
Says the man who previously used the reasoning of an infant.OK well now at least I know you can't have a sensible conversation about it
shambler
Well-Known Member
Is their style of play really that interesting though? Last night it seemed to be constant moves down the wing, the occasional overlap, always looking for a cross or pulled back pass. The majority of these moves were fairly frustrating to watch, and the goals seemed to come from rebounds after unsuccessful attempts (I switched off before the 4th so can't comment on that one).
I thought their dominance mostly came from industry - energy and a crazy amount of pressing. I didn't find their monopoly of passing that interesting, as it seemed the passes themselves were never particularly incisive.
Zapp Brannigan
Built like a steakhouse, handles like a bistro
I do find it tactically fascinating. Numerical supremacy in the middle of the park makes pressing to win the ball easier, and gives extra passing options to the man on the ball. The last 30 years of football has pretty much landed on the near universal theory that 3 in the middle is the optimum, in that it leaves enough defensive solidity behind it and enough firepower up front to finish things off.
Pep's latest incarnation, with Stones pushing up, is to have 4, but without leaving holes anywhere else based on players in 'hybrid' roles compared to the traditional. Ake, Akanji, Walker (whichever 2 are playing either side of Dias on any given day) aren't playing as traditional fullbacks but neither are they centre backs in the sense of a "normal" back 3 - this would usually have wingbacks with defensive responsibility up against opposition wingers, but it definitely wasn't Bernardo up against Vinicius Jr or Grealish vs Rodrygo.
It works because of the fluidity of it. The team functions as a unit, constantly shifting but all with an understanding of where holes could appear and when to fill in. Basically it's the complete antithesis of the "man in the pub" school of management where tactics consists of 11 names written on a piece of paper, where one little part of the pitch is each player's individual domain.
Fairweather
Well-Known Member
My twelve year old son made me laugh this morning. ‘Dad, if Man City beat Real Madrid 4-0 and only put three past the Blades does that mean we’re better than Real Madrid?’
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Lord Camomile
Yipchaa!
Grealish once again having to remind Silva to be more careful about where he puts the third arm he had grafted onto his back.
RD2003
Got a really fucking shitty attitude
Noticed the media didn't seem too keen on West Ham reaching a European final. You're ten times richer than AC Milan, and it's apparently your fault for being in the richest league in the world.
You need to know your place as also-rans.
tommers
Fuck it, it's fine.
Sorry, we're what now?
RD2003
Got a really fucking shitty attitude
Apologies. You're merely richer than AC Milan, and ten times richer than another European club.
'With the general pluckiness vibe worth bearing in mind West Ham are richer than AC Milan and ten times as rich as AZ Alkmaar. They’re not exactly the ewoks here.'
That's a quote from the public schoolboy* Barney Ronay of the Guardian's Twitter.
*I don't know if he did actually go to public school, but he comes across as that kind of supercilious twat.
RD2003
Got a really fucking shitty attitude
Oh, the rules that get made up as they go along.
The39thStep
Urban critical thinker
congrats CityCHAMPIONS
Ted Striker
Foot's on the other hand
Hopefully they will be able to get over the failure of winning the league and respond by throwing money at another world great and eek out 50 goals next season that might save them from further crushing disappointment.
They do of course, play great football, but that's like saying Buckingham Palace has nice decor
They do of course, play great football, but that's like saying Buckingham Palace has nice decor
RD2003
Got a really fucking shitty attitude
How many 'world greats' have City signed since the takeover? Certain players might have become so, but were merely very good players with great potential when signed.
Haven't spent as much as all our main competitors for several seasons now.
Did previous serial champions spend nothing? I seem to remember transfer records being broken quite a few times.
two sheds
Least noticed poster 2007
Pep Guardiola calls for quick verdicts on Manchester City charges
Pep Guardiola has called on the Premier League to speed up action on the financial charges against Manchester City
Fourteen point penalty - sorted
But they’re good capitalists
