Libya - civil unrest & now NATO involvement

[Divisive Cotton]

Can we keep this thread to current events in Libya please

However, this old documentary on Sadat's Egypt which has been uncovered by Adam Curtis is fascinating: http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/adamcurtis/2011/02/sadats_dat.html

 

[dylans]

While I appreciate that he was funding a number of organizations, I thought they viewed him more as a necessary evil than as someone to idolize? More akin to the way that Al Qaeda used to happily accept CIA funding to fight the soviets.

That's probably true of the guerrilla groups but the "trot" groups like the WRP went further than that and openly cheered him

A draft resolution adopted by the WRP Political Committee on July 28, 1980 declared that “the Workers Revolutionary Party salutes the courageous and tireless struggle of Colonel Gaddafi whose Green Book has guided the struggle to introduce workers’ control of factories, government offices and the diplomatic service, and in exposing the reactionary maneuvers of Sadat, Beigin and Carter… We stand ready to mobilize the British workers in defense of the Libyan Jamahiriya and explain the teachings of the Green Book as part of the anti-imperialist struggle.”
On December 12, 1981 the Political Committee of the WRP issued a statement which declared: “When Gaddafi and the Free Unionist Officers seized popular control in 1969, they set Libya on the road of socialist development and expansion…Gadaffi has developed politically in the direction of revolutionary socialism and he has shunned the palaces and harems of some other Arab leaders.”

 

[elbows]

However, this old documentary on Sadat's Egypt which has been uncovered by Adam Curtis is fascinating: http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/adamcurtis/2011/02/sadats_dat.html

Well put it in the Egypt thread then for crying out loud.

Oh well never mind, at least the present mess in this Libya thread is occurring at a time when there is very little useful news coming from Libya.

 

[DrRingDing]

How dare you call me ....a trot.

As for Respect. I must confess I have been away for a long time and so am not up on the details but I liked Respect (what little I know about them) I liked their internationalism. Likewise for WP. I admire their positions of Israel and Gaza and Iraq.

http://www.urban75.net/vbulletin/th...-open-letter?p=9272230&viewfull=1#post9272230

I leave that here. Now kindly desist in spouting bollocks and derailing this thread.

 

[elbows]

#AJEnglish reporter Jamal-El-Shayyal is now at the Egypt-Libya border. Live shot shows aid from #Egypt arriving #Libya

Not watching this myself, have to go to work shortly

 

[frogwoman]

I think dylans' point is that it's hardly the worst thing you can call someone.

Anyway the UN security council have just decided to meet over Gaddafi's actions.

 

[Louis MacNeice]

I don't have the information to make a solid opinion just the same as everyone else on this thread. That includes you btw.

I have the solid information of seeing, hearing and reading example after example of people exercising direct agency over their own lives and at great personal risk; this alone is enough evidence to give the lie to the line that 'this is just the US Government re-arranging their puppets'. Your inability to grasp this basic reality, just reinforces what others have been saying about your myopia on this thread.

Louis MacNeice

p.s. the lack of courage in your convictions, evidenced by your attempted fence sitting, isn't very edifying and sits uncomfortably with your erstwhile revolutionary fervour.

 

[DrRingDing]

I think dylans' point is that it's hardly the worst thing you can call someone.

Which speaks volumes in itself.

 

[dylans]

http://www.urban75.net/vbulletin/th...-open-letter?p=9272230&viewfull=1#post9272230

I leave that here. Now kindly desist in spouting bollocks and derealing this thread.

All true but that doesn't make me a trot you silly boy. While you are scouring the forums for evidence of my "trot" affiliations, perhaps you should take a look at my Kronstadt thread. Or better yet behave yourself and stop trying to apply labels to me that I don't apply to myself

 

[DrRingDing]

I have the solid information of seeing, hearing and reading example after example of people exercising direct agency over their own lives and at great personal risk; this alone is enough evidence to give the lie to the line that 'this is just the US Government re-arranging their puppets'. Your inability to grasp this basic reality, just reinforces what others have been saying about your myopia on this thread.

Louis MacNeice

p.s. the lack of courage in your convictions, evidenced by your attempted fence sitting, isn't very edifying and sits uncomfortably with your erstwhile revolutionary fervour.

Again, you are quoting me as saying 'this is just the US Government re-arranging their puppets'. Where is this post?

 

[ernestolynch]

Maybe in your twisted world, froggie!

 

[elbows]

@AJArabic LIVE FROM BAYDA tune in, family emotional. al jazeera live is now from bayda, it looks like maydan tahrir #Libya #Feb17

Again not got time to tune in myself right now, but can watch AJ Arabic on sites such as:

http://www.aljazeera.net/Channel/Livestreaming

Im not sure what variety of AJ Arabic this is but will post link anyway:

http://www.elahmad.com/tv/

 

[DrRingDing]

Friend of mine is in Turkey and many people he speaks to are of the opinion this is just the US Government re-arranging their puppets.

As you can see what you are quoting me as saying is actually Barking Mad just relaying what someone had said to him.

 

[Lemon Eddy]

Go and quote me personally saying that I find this 'underwhelming'. I was quoting a Sunni Muslim collaegue you. Idiot.

If you didn't fucking find some validity in what he was saying, why the fuck did you feel obliged to post it? And seriously, you don't find the following to be dismissive:

Friend of mine is in Turkey and many people he speaks to are of the opinion this is just the US Government re-arranging their puppets.

My Pakistani colleague is pretty underwhemled too, citing the same reasons.

Or is it ok to be insulting about things if you're just quoting someone else no-one has met? If so, I'd just like to say a someone I know reckons you're a complete bell-end.

 

[DrRingDing]

....and Louis McNeice calls himself a journalist!

 

[frogwoman]

Maybe in your twisted world, froggie!

What would you rather someone shout in the street at you, "trot" or "paedo"? There you go.

 

[phildwyer]

I have the solid information of seeing, hearing and reading example after example of people exercising direct agency over their own lives and at great personal risk; this alone is enough evidence to give the lie to the line that 'this is just the US Government re-arranging their puppets'.

No it isn't. Just because this looks like a revolution, doesn't mean it is one. Ukraine and Georgia looked much the same.

 

[dylans]

....and Louis McNeice calls himself a journalist!

and DrRingDing calls himself a revolutionary!

 

[DrRingDing]

If you didn't fucking find some validity in what he was saying, why the fuck did you feel obliged to post it?

I posted it as it was an opinion from someone with a more interesting perspective than yours

 

[DrRingDing]

and DrRingDing calls himself a revolutionary!

I do no such thing.

 

[butchersapron]

Reports of journos/doctors etc now crossing border from Egypt becoming more frequent.

 

[dylans]

I posted it as it was an opinion from someone with a more interesting perspective than yours

Coward. You posted it because you agree with it but you lack the balls to admit it. Cowardly liberal tosser

 

[Louis MacNeice]

Again, you are quoting me as saying 'this is just the US Government re-arranging their puppets'. Where is this post?

No I'm not you twit; it is the statement you say your colleague agreed with. I'm pointing out why that statement is wrong. To be clear, it is possible that the eventual outcomes of what is happening across significant parts of north Africa and the middle east may be the re-establishment of US interests. However, this is not what is currently happening, which is much more complicated (hence me calling the puppet comment simplistic).

Louis MacNeice

 

[DownwardDog]

I forget, did we ever get any solid info on if there are Russian mercenaries there? This was doing the rounds early yesterday.

There's definitely plenty working as instructors and technicians at Umm Aitiqah/Metiga AFB on the Flogger/Hip/Candid squadrons. I doubt they sober up enough to go on ops though.

 

[dylans]

I do no such thing.

Oh I'm sorry aren't you a supporter of an organisation called class war?

 

[ernestolynch]

All you derailers desist now!

 

[frogwoman]

No it isn't. Just because this looks like a revolution, doesn't mean it is one. Ukraine and Georgia looked much the same.

The US is shitting itself over this - very different from Ukraine and Georgia.

 

[weltweit]

Can anyone report on what Gaddafi actually did on state TV last night. I had gone to bed and I can't see much reference to it on this thread. Is it right that he just appeared and did not say much except something like "you see I am not in Venezuela" ...

 

[DrRingDing]

Coward. You posted it because you agree with it but you lack the balls to admit it. Cowardly liberal tosser

More trot lies.

 

[DrRingDing]

Oh I'm sorry aren't you a supporter of an organisation called class war?

None of your business.