Jewish Intellectualism

[Johnny Canuck3]

So show me the heavyweight intellectual (as opposed to artistic) tradition of Irish people? and I don't mean Protestant free-thinkers, I mean catholic ones. .

Irish Protestants aren't Irish now?

 

[J Ed]

what exactly is your problem with those two words together?

have you even read the fuckin article?

What exactly are you trying to achieve here?

 

[LiamO]

Irish Protestants aren't Irish now?

we've done that one, half-wit. Try and keep up.

 

[LiamO]

What exactly are you trying to achieve here?

a discussion. read the fuckin article.

 

[J Ed]

Irish Protestants aren't Irish now?

lol, a LOT of Protestant Irish Nationalists just erased from history there

 

[LiamO]

lol, a LOT of Protestant Irish Nationalists just erased from history there

you are just being silly.

I simply do not find it credible that you are asserting I said anything of the kind. Read the context or fuck off.

Without Protestant free-thinkers (McCracken, Mitchell, Tone etc etc) there would never have been Irish republicanism... which kind of reinforces my point about the conforming/non-questioning of catholicism as imposed in Ireland.

 

[J Ed]

a discussion. read the fuckin article.

Yesterday you posted about why Jews weren't capitalists, now you're posting about Jews and IQ. What's tomorrow? Why do Jews like bagels so much?

 

[DotCommunist]

Yesterday you posted about why Jews weren't capitalists, now you're posting about Jews and IQ. What's tomorrow? Why do Jews like bagels so much?

everyone likes bagels, they are like the savoury cousin to the donut

 

[Johnny Canuck3]

Who is Kelvin? Stop the next 20 Irish people you meet and ask them.

I take it he was/is an Irish scientist from a protestant, free-thinking background? Horray for you.

Now tell me about how every Irish child is taught about him at their grannies knee and how proud we all are of him.

The point about religion is simple enough even for you. 19th Century free-thinking, protestantism was culturally conducive to intellectual vigour, to investigation and analysis. Irish catholicism, based as it was/is on dumb acceptance and non-questioning compliance is not.

Anyways I asked you to make the case for Irish people. You have failed miserably.

This doesn't give the religion I'm afraid.

http://understandingscience.ucc.ie/pages/irishscientists.htm

 

[Johnny Canuck3]

never heard of any of them (was Boole the maths fella?).. Fill me in on some background.

And while you are at it tell me about how venerated/celebrated they are in Irish popular culture.

First you said - there are none.

Now, with the goalposts twenty yards back, it's - show me ones who are venerated.

 

[littlebabyjesus]

a discussion. read the fuckin article.

How about you discuss it? I'll take two points.

1. There are disproportionately more Jewish nobel prize winners. There are also disproportionately more white people winning nobel prizes. And disproportionately more men than women. Where is it sensible to look for the explanation? Is it in 'Jewish' or 'white' culture? Should we be looking for inherent intellectual differences between men and women? Or is the answer rather more prosaic?

2. IQ - is it a measure of innate intelligence? The answer is a resounding no. The article doesn't address this, and most of it is entirely irrelevant once this question has been answered.

 

[Johnny Canuck3]

Look at any anti-Semitic propaganda poster, and the reason is there. It's our hunchbacks (caused by too much cuddling of sacks of money).

It's not the heavy payots and beards?

 

[frogwoman]

oh come on wasn't going to respond to this but if you'd posted a thing about black people's iq do you reckon it would be all right?

i'm so fucking fed up of it, this shit seems to be everywhere on urban at the moment. and i've experienced it in real life as well recently.

load of fucking shit, sort yourself out.

 

[LiamO]

First you said - there are none.

Now, with the goalposts twenty yards back, it's - show me ones who are venerated.

no. I asked for evidence of a culture... not

How about you discuss it? I'll take two points.

1. There are disproportionately more Jewish nobel prize winners. There are also disproportionately more white people winning nobel prizes. And disproportionately more men than women. Where is it sensible to look for the explanation? Is it in Jewish or white culture? Should we be looking for inherent intellectual differences between men and women? Or is the answer rather more prosaic?

2. IQ - is it a measure of innate intelligence? The answer is a resounding no. The article doesn't address this, and most of it is entirely irrelevant once this question has been answered.

so why do I have to defend the article, or the author? I posted it for discussion.

 

[littlebabyjesus]

so why do I have to defend the article, or the author? I posted it for discussion.

Here you are again with the passive aggression. Froggie's right - sort yourself out.

 

[Johnny Canuck3]

we've done that one, half-wit. Try and keep up.

I've read the thread. If you did it, it isn't readily apparent.

 

[Johnny Canuck3]

everyone likes bagels, they are like the savoury cousin to the donut

I'm not big on them: too chewy.

 

[J Ed]

oh come on wasn't going to respond to this but if you'd posted a thing about black people's iq do you reckon it would be all right?

i'm so fucking fed up of it, this shit seems to be everywhere on urban at the moment. and i've experienced it in real life as well recently.

load of fucking shit, sort yourself out.

Not only that but he has the brass neck to insult people when people point out the ridiculousness of this thread

 

[LiamO]

oh come on wasn't going to respond to this but if you'd posted a thing about black people's iq do you reckon it would be all right?

i'm so fucking fed up of it, this shit seems to be everywhere on urban at the moment. and i've experienced it in real life as well recently.

load of fucking shit, sort yourself out.

WTF? If you posted up for discussion something written by a black geezer who was not only noting the historical and current intellectual prowess (nay superiority) of black people, but also putting forward a whole host of 'reasons' for it - some worthy of discussion, some decidedly dodgy - OF COURSE it would be alright.

Why the fuck would it not be?

 

[J Ed]

WTF? If you posted up for discussion something written by a black geezer who was not only noting the historical and current intellectual prowess (nay superiority) of black people, but also putting forward a whole host of 'reasons' for it - some worthy of discussion, some decidedly dodgy - OF COURSE it would be alright.

I think that would be fucking weird too.

 

[littlebabyjesus]

Butchers caught you out on page 1, tbh. I hadn't realised that Charles Murray was one of the authors of that piece of excrement that is the 'Bell Curve'. This article just applies all the same falsehoods to another group. It's wrong. And it's racist. The author of that article is racist.

Liam, I'm going to patronise you a bit here, but you really need to go and read up on the Bell Curve, and the way it was comprehensively debunked. That will provide you with all the answers you need about this article.

 

[J Ed]

I think someone has been reading a bit too much Gilad Atzmon or some shit

 

[LiamO]

Butchers caught you out on page 1, tbh. I hadn't realised that Charles Murray was one of the authors of that piece of excrement that is the 'Bell Curve'. This article just applies all the same falsehoods to another group. It's wrong. And it's racist. The author of that article is racist.

and Jewish I think. And a Zionist if you take his stuff about Israel and the 'clenliness' stuff into account.

 

[littlebabyjesus]

and Jewish I think. And a Zionist if you take his stuff about Israel and the 'clenliness' stuff into account.

Who cares if he's Jewish?

 

[LiamO]

Liam, I'm going to patronise you a bit here, but you really need to go and read up on the Bell Curve, and the way it was comprehensively debunked. That will provide you with all the answers you need about this article.

so enlighten me. Seems to be fairly common currency AFAICS

and I dunno who the fuck Charles Murray is.

 

[littlebabyjesus]

so enlighten me. Seems to be fairly common currency AFAICS

and I dunno who the fuck Charles Murray is.

Do a search on here. It's been discussed before. Alternatively give it a google.

I'm not quite sure what you mean by 'common currency'. Once you have read up on the Bell Curve, you might realise what a fuck-up it is to post an article for discussion that quotes one of its authors as a source of authority.

 

[JHE]

Maybe this thread can be rescued with some interesting content.

Here is an interesting website I came across the other day, it's the website of the linguistic authority of Ladino in Israel. Ladino is basically Judeo-Spanish, the language spoken by the Jews who lived in Spain and were subsequently expelled but continued to speak the language throughout the Mediterranean.

http://www.aki-yerushalayim.co.il/anl/ it's so weird because if you speak a Romance language you can get the jist of most of it! Really cool.

Bugger all to do with the rest of the thread, but...

If you know Spanish, you can do more than get the gist. It's almost the same.

A Venezuelan friend who used to live in Greece liked to go on holiday to Turkey and met some Sephardim in Istambul. She said it was very easy to speak to them since Ladino is basically archaic Spanish. However, though she says it's archaic, the thing that strikes me when I see Ladino, for example on the site you link, is how extraordinarily similar Ladino is to contemporary Spanish. It is surprising that Spanish and Ladino have not diverged more in the last 500 years. (There are obvious differences of orthography. The use of 'k' makes Ladino look a bit like Spanish written by some lefty Spanish graffiti artist, but it doesn't present any obstacle and anyway it's beside the point.)

It's so close that I tempted to deny that Ladino is a separate language. It is much closer to Spanish than any of the other Iberian languages are. Portuguese/Gallego and Catalan/Valencian are both much more different from Spanish than Ladino is.

Mind you, I'm basing this on reading a few bits of Ladino... perhaps if I heard some, I'd alter my view and find other differences, but I suspect not.

Anyway, yeah, this has bugger all to do with the subject of the thread, which seems to be: Who can throw the most unjustified insults at Liam?

 

[cdg]

Irish Protestants aren't Irish now?

Depends if they are from Northern Ireland or not.

 

[LiamO]

Irish Protestants aren't Irish now?

Just realised what you selectively quoted - and you have no excuses as you were party to the discussion at the time...

So show me the heavyweight intellectual (as opposed to artistic) tradition of Irish people? and I don't mean Protestant free-thinkers, I mean catholic ones. You can't, cos there isn't one.

Of course Ireland was once an intellectual beacon for Europe. But that was a long time ago.

There are, of course, many historical and social reasons for this. One of which is undoubtedly the influence of the Catholic Church in promoting a culture of acquiesence over centuries.

I had posited that perhaps there was some mileage in what the author had said about the dialectic nature of debate etc in Judaism vs religious dogma holding back intellectual debate in some other churches... and suggested it was true of the Catholic Church. I would not have thought that was contentious on here.

Therefore, my point was that you simply cannot refute the suggestion by naming Irish Protestant Intellectuals as they were never subject to the restrictions of the Catholic Church

e2a you then deliberately chose to misrepresent what I had written and had the cheek to selectively quote a post making my point. You cad, sir.

 

[LiamO]

Do a search on here. It's been discussed before. Alternatively give it a google.

I'm not quite sure what you mean by 'common currency'.

can't be arsed. not important.

Common currency? Use of the phrase 'Bell curve' is common amongst all social sciences as far as I know. I wasn't aware it was in any way considered dodgy.