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French Presidential elections

Mr Moose said:
Not everyone is tho. Plenty on here felt not voting was the better choice. Now they are glad someone else did?
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its not incompatible to be glad- relieved in fact- that the fash candidate did not win while still having been unable to bring yourself to endorse macron or the whole system. And still worry about what it bodes for the future. (not that any of us in this thread had a say in the election but ykwim).
 
ferrelhadley said:
I think some people get very confused about who the real enemy is. They get so sucked into a world of hating "liberals" (a meaningless term) so sucked into spouting bollox on the internet they have long since lost any sense of perspective.

For a lot of people on this forum politics is a game or a life style accessory. I almost never say anything about myself as a person. Folk here attack me as being "middle class" and other pish. I spent most of my late teens and twentys as a manual labourer. I grew up for some of my life in some of the most deprived parts of Scotland. I heard what peoples politics were, what their worries were what their daily chat was.

Much of the bollox on Urban sounds like what my middle class friends spout on Facebook, not what I will hear in a pub back up visiting my family.

For the pickmans and company on here its all a a fucking game. Poking "liberal" in the eye. "Look how radical I am". "I am going to pretend to be planning a revolution while on an internet forum"

And while "the left" is pishing around with their world of warcraft rollplaying being all radical online Shettleston voted a fucking tory.

The defeat of an outright race baiting scum bag is an unquestioned victory. When that monster is let loose out the box folk will have a bit of a different view to the differences between the French left and right, or the British one for that matter. "Blame that dark skinned person", "blame the weirdo who prays different", "your problems are all the Polish guys fault". So easy.

The Left's (aka left of Labour) complete disconnect with working peoples daily lives is abundantly reflected in their virtual non existence in elections, the right have a very fucking seductive alternative. I am pleased from the very top of my hair to the toe nails on my feet that these cunts are rejected. I have unalloyed joy the monster is not yet out the box. You can make argument for more re-distributive societies, fairer taxation and more common ownership of common assets when the arguments are between right and left on economic points. That all tends to get drowned out when arguing who is racially allowed to be part of society.
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Pickman's and company? Dk what you do offline, but some of us have walked the walk against fascists, while you're just cheering on some centre right victor. Tonight's vote is no victory if next time round it's Le Pen or similar again in the second round, and we're reduced to hoping people will vote for a lesser shit again. It's what happens between elections that counts, where the hard work's done. Fwiw thank you for ascribing me a leadership role, but it's entirely unjustified.
 
ferrelhadley said:
For a lot of people on this forum politics is a game or a life style accessory. I almost never say anything about myself as a person. Folk here attack me as being "middle class" and other pish. I spent most of my late teens and twentys as a manual labourer. I grew up for some of my life in some of the most deprived parts of Scotland. I heard what peoples politics were, what their worries were what their daily chat was.
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so what? Think your the only one whose ever done a hard days work for shit pay while living on the deprived estates? lol. Its you thats lost perspective.
 
DotCommunist said:
so what? Think your the only one whose ever done a hard days work for shit pay while living on the deprived estates? lol. Its you thats lost perspective.
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Manual work and manual workers are always a bit of an adventure for those who don't actually have to do it permanently.
 
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Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk
 
Pickman's model said:
Pickman's and company? Dk what you do offline, but some of us have walked the walk against fascists,
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So you have produced an electorally popular platform that working people have rallied behind as an alternative to the Tories and the far right right. I mean that is how you defeat fascism and the right. You win the voting public over with a popular set of polices they endorse.
 
ferrelhadley said:
So you have produced an electorally popular platform that working people have rallied behind as an alternative to the Tories and the far right right. I mean that is how you defeat fascism and the right. You win the voting public over with a popular set of polices they endorse.
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And the never-ending retreat into lesser-evilism only impedes that project. Hardly difficult to comprehend.
 
ferrelhadley said:
So you have produced an electorally popular platform that working people have rallied behind as an alternative to the Tories and the far right right. I mean that is how you defeat fascism and the right. You win the voting public over with a popular set of polices they endorse.
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hey it worked in spain and germany didn't it? oh wait...
 
RD2003 said:
And the never-ending retreat into lesser-evilism only impedes that project.
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So no then.
You played your games. Had your fun.
And yet the working people with their fears of the modern world, their wants of a materially better world for their children was abandoned in favour of rucks with some fat racists.
You had fun.
Tories won elections.

Its almost as if there was some kind of metaphor about knocking on doors, listening to people and building a platform that the people in the country feel will help them. That has addressed what they feel are their needs.


But lets ditch that and all go Green Street\Football Factory. Thats where the real action is. Hey I am on the internet. Look how hard I pretend to be. :D


:facepalm:
 
ferrelhadley said:
So no then.
You played your games. Had your fun.
And yet the working people with their fears of the modern world, their wants of a materially better world for their children was abandoned in favour of rucks with some fat racists.
You had fun.
Tories won elections.

Its almost as if there was some kind of metaphor about knocking on doors, listening to people and building a platform that the people in the country feel will help them. That has addressed what they feel are their needs.


But lets ditch that and all go Green Street\Football Factory. Thats where the real action is. Hey I am on the internet. Look how hard I pretend to be. :D


:facepalm:
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Like I said, go sober up.
 
RD2003 said:
But what have you got to say about the fact-yes, fact-that Macron will only continue along the road that sees Le Pen's support base (which would once, in large part, have been a large part of the support base of socialism etc etc) grow further?
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dp
 
RD2003 said:
But what have you got to say about the fact-yes, fact-that Macron will only continue along the road that sees Le Pen's support base (which would once have been a large part of the support base of socialism etc etc) grow further?
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The last two times I can remember someone describing an assumption-laden prediction as a fact were (1) The makeup of the electoral college means it is impossible for Donald Trump to win the White House and (2) If the UK votes for Brexit, it will bring about the immediate and irreparable implosion of the Conservative party.
 
ferrelhadley said:
So you have produced an electorally popular platform that working people have rallied behind as an alternative to the Tories and the far right right. I mean that is how you defeat fascism and the right. You win the voting public over with a popular set of polices they endorse.
Click to expand...
No, the way you defeat fascism is to do it before it has to be electorally defeated.
 

I have difficulty with the lesser-evilists. I can't understand if they genuinely think that constantly voting for more of the same will eventually result in things evening themselves out and all the things they deplore magically going away, or if they just enjoy fooling themselves. Obviously, some of them think that, materially, they're untouchable. But that's despite 2008 and its seemingly unlearned lessons...
 
So after all that we now know that anyone who is critical of Macron is actually middle-class* and that by supporting telegenic Tim Farron ferrel is a proletarian champion but we still don't know just who it is who actually wanted Le Pen to win.

*well except for the working-class voters who abstained or voted Le Pen, presumably.
 
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The DM comments are outdoing themselves to cast scorn on the stupid French for not voting as hoped, saying how they'll struggle to feel any sympathy when the next attack happens etc.
It's a weird thing this international nationalism.
 
This surprises me. It says that Le Pen was far more attractive to young voters than older ones.
'Some 44 per cent of 18 to 24-year-olds backed the Front National leader, compared with 56 per cent who voted for centrist Emmanuel Macron, according to projections.The far-right Ms Le Pen secured more support among young voters than any other age group. By contrast, she was backed by just 20 per cent of over 65s.."
 
bimble said:
The DM comments are outdoing themselves to cast scorn on the stupid French for not voting as hoped, saying how they'll struggle to feel any sympathy when the next attack happens etc.
It's a weird thing this international nationalism.
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My favourite type of comment has been the American far-right going on about how their grandfathers had fought to liberate France from Germany and that it was obviously a waste of their time since they've just capitulated to Germany. I think they might be overlooking exactly what they were fighting in France, and whose side Le Pen snr was on, but hey, facts are tiresome.
 
bimble said:
This surprises me. It says that Le Pen was far more attractive to young voters than older ones.
'Some 44 per cent of 18 to 24-year-olds backed the Front National leader, compared with 56 per cent who voted for centrist Emmanuel Macron, according to projections.The far-right Ms Le Pen secured more support among young voters than any other age group. By contrast, she was backed by just 20 per cent of over 65s.."
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"Le Pen" isn't such a tainted brand for young voters, who don't remember Jean-Marie. And youth unemployment rate is just under 24%. There's probably other reasons too, but these will be factors.
 
bluescreen said:
"Le Pen" isn't such a tainted brand for young voters, who don't remember Jean-Marie. And youth unemployment rate is just under 24%. There's probably other reasons too, but these will be factors.
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Agree, but would add that youth unemployment has been high for a long time. I think what has changed is that the Sarkozy-Hollande era has brought about a serious decline in confidence in the two main parties to offer any improvement, and the PS in particular.

Important to take abstention into account, though. I don't know what the figures are by age, but the proportion of young people who voted for Le Pen will actually be lower than 44%.
 
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