bellaozzydog
rolling turds in glitter
How do you explain you are vegan but for health reasons rather than moral/ethical reasons without offending everybody
Just keep Schtum ?
Just keep Schtum ?
Do angry vegans turn you against going vegan?
- Thread starter Watermelon Man
- Start date
ViolentPanda
Hardly getting over it.
Nope. definitely thinking of the Spanner trial!
ViolentPanda
Hardly getting over it.
"I am a vegan because I have a bowel disorder that results in explosive projectile defecation if I eat meat" should work.
Then that is at the very mild end of what they were up to.
coley
Well-Known Member
Why bother telling anyone? Unless you are in the habit of going to 'dinner parties'
And if so, possibly you are on the wrong forum /site?
I've been a vegetarian for donkeys and by and large I haven't had to explain/inform my choices to any bugger.
coley
Well-Known Member
You've hit the nail on the head with one of the more common myths that it is hard to go vegan. Even without the processed vegan alternatives to meat and dairy, there's an abundance of fruit, veg, grains, nuts, seeds, herbs and spices that are available. I think it's the societal norms that makes it a lot easier and a lot less hassle to just eat anything going so as not to be seen as an oddball fussy eater and to fit in with everyone else especially at social functions. (btw, congrats on going vegan, hope you are able to stay the course)
Some people do get a bit hung up and nit picky on the fine details regarding what is and isn't vegan. I try to do my best to make purchasing decisions that minimise the amount of harm caused to both human and animal as is practicable. It is impossible to live 100% completely harm free in a non vegan world. Unfortunately you will always find somebody who will try to pick holes in your choices with silly arguments like, "you eat bread, the flour from that bread might have bits of insects in it, therefore you can't call yourself a vegan".(Is being fully vegan possible – 1:01:04)
It's probably best to ignore the naysayers and haters and do whatever you're comfortable with.
I've been a vegan for nearly 20 years and a vegetarian for 15 years before that, and I can honestly say that I haven't met a dogmatic angry vegan. I've been told mainly by non vegans that they do exist and there are supposed to be loads of them around,, so they must be out there somewhere, perhaps I haven't been looking hard enough, lol.
Rest assured they do exist, but "loads of them"? Naw, not really.
Think of the quote "there is no prude so great as a reformed whore" and you have your vegan 'warrior' in a nutshell.
Always worried about 'falling off the wagon'
coley
Well-Known Member
Silly bugger, she should just have a couple of tags stapled onto her lugs.
coley
Well-Known Member
My downstairs neighbour's invited me to thanksgiving lunch and all the moral issues added together don't make it smell any less amazing as it wafts up the stairs.
Thanksgiving? .That's when the white colonials give thanks to their imagined sky pixie for firearms, smallpox and alcohol and the other tools said 'Sky pixie' supplied them with to get rid of those bothersome indigenous types?
Sorry for the derail, but a tad annoyed that that 'Black Friday' coincides with 'indigenous Native American day''
coley
Well-Known Member
"I am a vegan because I have a bowel disorder that results in explosive projectile defecation if I eat meat" should work.
Take your problems to their next conference, why don't you
ViolentPanda
Hardly getting over it.
Take your problems to their next conference, why don't you
Not my problem. I have explosive projectile defecation whatever I eat!
PaoloSanchez
Well-Known Member
The only thing dodgy is the elaborate and seemingly disingenuous attempts to try and create some sort of artificial outrage as if the suggestion is some kind of crime against humanity. As I said earlier but perhaps you were not listening, the comparison was with the style of advocacy. Passive vs militant. The activism STYLE of Yourfosky was compared to the STYLE of Malcolm X, and not who (or what) they happen to be representing.
...and? What's your point? Some concerned, compassionate and ethical white people were willing and able to empathise with and in some cases help black people. Yes that actually happened and it doesn't demean or diminish the role of the black people involved so I'm not sure why you're still labouring that moot point.
Well for a start, I am not "vegans" and have never claimed to represent the opinions of all vegans. Secondly I can express any opinion I want. If you disagree with my opinion that's perfectly ok, that's your prerogative and it's not really any of my business.
Some concerned, compassionate and ethical animal rights folk are willing and able to empathise with and in some cases help the interests of animals. Some of them choose to do that in a quiet way and some a bit more noisily and that was the point.
Just out of interest, seeing as you appear to be blowing this irrelevant side issue way out of proportion, would you happen to be a white person trying to school me on how I should be interpret black history. Now that would be ironic.
PaoloSanchez
Well-Known Member
Oh yes they did. Yes, yes and yes. You better go and get your eyes checked.
Or how about you get your head around that the idea claiming to love animals and yet being ok with them being killed unnecessarily is as ridiculous as a rapist claiming that he loves the women/men that he rapes. Animals lives are clearly viewed by the majority as being of less value and less importance than our own. It's called speciesism, go look it up.
That didn't even make any sense. It's not about presuming what others think, it is what their actions and beliefs demonstrate. In my opinion, you cannot claim to love animals and also be ok with killing them. Those things are IN MY OPINION not compatible and doesn't make sense. Ok, some other people have a different opinion. That''s up to them. What you won't find me doing is relentlessly stalking, harassing and abusing people just because they disagree with me, which is precisely what you've done and are doing now.
I've long since accepted that you believe that killing animals is ok. Of course I disagree with that view and believe it to be wrong, and I have no problem saying so. The fact that I disagree with you appears to raise your heckles and you appear to be unable to control yourself. I've tried to say it nicely several times now, but the message clearly isn't penetrating that thick skull of yours. GO AWAY. I'm not interested, don't quote me, don't butt into my conversations with others and don't include me in yours. You've had your opportunity and you've blown it. GO AWAY. I might have to get an ASBO or restraining order because you are clearly not getting it.
Spymaster
Plastic Paddy
Define “love” as in this supposed love for animals.
I love my wife and family. I like most animals, they are nice to have around, to look at, sometimes to pet, but I’ll still eat most of them with fava beans and a nice Chianti. There’s no contradiction there. This is just made up nonsense isn’t it?
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PaoloSanchez
Well-Known Member
That's a good question. It will depend on what situation you are in and what relationship you have with those around you. It is not something that I usually openly declare when I meet people out and about and usually comes up in passing. I don't think you should be scared to share any of your beliefs for fear of offending others, in the same way that a gay person should not be scared to share their sexual orientation for fear of offending Christians or Muslims who may believe homosexuality to be wrong.
It will also depend on what you believe being a vegan is. My own interpretation of being a vegan includes morals and ethics, health, environment, economics, so for me simply eating like a vegan doesn't necessarily make you a vegan. It is more than "just a fad diet" imo. Others may have a different outlook.
PaoloSanchez
Well-Known Member
In the absence or reliable demography, and based on the fact that I haven't personally met any, I can't really take it as read that they exist based on other peoples anecdotes and nice sounding parables, but like Shaw Taylor used to say, I'll keep 'em peeled.
Not really sure what that meant tbh Who's always worried about falling off the wagon?Always worried about 'falling off the wagon'
beesonthewhatnow
going deaf for a living
Correct. I would gladly slaughter a million cows if it would save but one human life.
Jeff Robinson
Marxist-Lentilist: Jackboots and Jackfruit
Gosh, that it principled. Seeing as most humans aren't even prepared to give a little extra of their money to, say, a malaria net charity that could actually save human lives at no notable cost to themselves, the fact that you'd devote yourself to the arduous task of massacring a million gentle females to save a single human is surely praiseworthy (any human I note: Assad, Trump, Mugabe... all human life is valuable). Apparently the UK kills about 2.6 million cattle a year. Given that about half of them will be calves and bulls, we can estimate that about 1.3 million cows are killed per annum to satisfy the British publics cow flesh/milk consumption preferences.
And you'd take on the task of single-handedly killing almost as many all by yourself? You dedication is truly outstanding. And you wouldn't just do it, but you'd *gladly* do it? Wow such steadfastness. Especially given the documented high rates of PTSD and other serious mental health problems found amongst people who's job it is to take the lives of large numbers of innocent, defenceless individuals in a ruthless, machine like manner. That you'd risk these sort of long term physical and mental health problems to save the life of but one human... well... sir I take my hat off to you.
Just as no doubt you would slaughter a million female non-human mammals to save one human, I take it you would also abstain from killing cows and other animals if you could save human lives by so doing? If, to take a purely hypothetical and fanciful example, say the UN Food and Agriculture Organisation and numerous UN special rapporteurs on the right to food had been arguing for years out that the mass consumption of meat in the West is 'entirely unsustainable' and 'diverts food away from poor people who are unable to afford anything but cereals'. No doubt you would encourage, at the least, a reduction in the number of animals killed in help prevent the global poor from staving. Or, maybe you are only prepared to save human lives when doing so - though some strange, unspecified causal mechanism - involves killing animals? bessonthewhatnow works in mysterious ways.
Apologies if I have taken your statement at face value. It's just that I don't think of you as the sort of poster who would make a cheap, glib, ill-thought-out and insincere post is all.
beesonthewhatnow
going deaf for a living
Jeff Robinson
Marxist-Lentilist: Jackboots and Jackfruit
More flawless logic. You are a true sage <3
beesonthewhatnow
going deaf for a living
I’d rather hope you’d manage to take my post as an indicator of how I view human life over that of other animals, but if you really must be so literal, carry on.
NoXion
Craicy the Squirrel
Why not then just use "passive vs militant"? Why the name-dropping? It's not like the end result of the process of animal liberation will involve their meaningful participation in the political processes of society, will it? I think you're brushing over a very fundamental and thus important difference between humans and other animals. One which you implicitly acknowledge, unless you think the other animals should get a vote on things.
Spymaster
Plastic Paddy
I think Sanchez is probably the worst poster that’s ever discussed the subject here. He’s arguing random points that he’s comfortable with and completely ignoring the substantive bits of the thread. Then, when he’s getting his arse handed to him he makes stuff up (animal loving?) and pretends to be aggrieved. He thinks he’s clever but he’s just cheap and evasive. Everyone should just stick him on ignore.
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Jeff Robinson
Marxist-Lentilist: Jackboots and Jackfruit
Your post is an indicator of you using empty rhetorical bluster instead of thinking critically or reflectively on this subject. If you can't be bothered to write anything remotely intelligent or interesting on these animal rights/veganism threads, why do you keep bothering to post on them? It's quite bizarre.
beesonthewhatnow
going deaf for a living
*sigh*
I’ve clearly stated in the past that I’m happy to discuss veganism if framed in terms of environmental impact, sustainability, food supplies etc. From that POV, yep, probably a good idea to cut back on the meat a bit.
But the moment you try to do it in moral terms, take the line that killing animals for food is wrong, well, I’m out. We exist as a species far above anything else on this planet. I have no problem whatsoever with us using animals for food or for anything that can save human lives. So yeah, while I’m being kinda flippant with that million deaths statement, it pretty much encapsulates my position.
Jeff Robinson
Marxist-Lentilist: Jackboots and Jackfruit
And yet again, not a single argument and a totally useless post.
You’re happy to discuss veganism - an ethical commitment against animal exploitation - if it’s redefined on your own terms to not mean veganism at all? How magnanimous of you!
Nobody is forcing you to discuss anything. Again if you can’t be bothered to think about this issue seriously, then why waste your and everybody else’s time on these vegan/animal rights threads posting such illiterate, incoherent bollocks?
beesonthewhatnow
going deaf for a living
Sigh. Again. OK, I’m happy to discuss “not eating animals or products derived from them”, that better? Is the term so - to use a word being banded rounded here a lot lately - fragile? 
Interesting that you you seem to think coming to the conclusion that humans rank way above any other species somehow can’t have involved any serious thought though. You’re slipping towards the religious dogma end of the debate here, of all the usual suspects on these threads you’re usually better than that.
Interesting that you you seem to think coming to the conclusion that humans rank way above any other species somehow can’t have involved any serious thought though. You’re slipping towards the religious dogma end of the debate here, of all the usual suspects on these threads you’re usually better than that.
Spymaster
Plastic Paddy
Oh come on, Jeff. His posts have at least been on topic. You’re trying to limit the discussion to what suits you. We've Got that Sanchez dickhead comparing meat eating with the slave trade, ffs, which puts Bees’ posts completely into context.
I can’t believe people are still at this. Of course the vegans here aren’t going to argue for a reduction in meat consumption as a moral good. It’s all wrong to them. So why people keep bringing up the environment. Misses the point. Us meat eaters should eat less meat and be more choosy about that which we do. Yeah fine. Idea logically committed vegans would see that as arguing it’s okay to murder just a little bit.
See you next month.
See you next month.
beesonthewhatnow
going deaf for a living
Well, they’re gonna be forever disappointed then, aren’t they?
Meanwhile, maybe it’s possible to have a sensible debate about farming methods, consumption and environmental impact that may convince even the staunchest of carnivores to reduce their intake?
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