Do angry vegans turn you against going vegan?

[8ball]

You said: "...vegans are probably doing a lot of other things, and living in particular situations generally, where they are likely to come out healthier, and disentangling the overall health outcomes and their causes when looking at a single well-correlated variable isn't easy."

... I don't think I misread anything you said. You really do seem to be inordinately negative about people electing to eat a vegan diet, which earlier on you were doing your best to dismiss as being one big fad. Why is that?

I think people less clouded by their agendas might see where you misread what I said.

I’m learning something about the way at least some vegans believe things, at least.

I have no quarrel with anyone’s hobbies, though, and I haven’t been inordinately negative about anyone’s food choices either. I might cut out the meat at some point, there are some arguments for that, but I don’t think I’ll be subscribing to your newsletter.

 

[8ball]

As if pictures of animals on the walls of butchers' shops didn't make the point already?

Last time I was in one they had *actual bits of animals* right there in the shop!

 

[editor]

I think people less clouded by their agendas might see where you misread what I said.

I’m learning something about the way at least some vegans believe things, at least.

I have no quarrel with anyone’s hobbies, though, and I haven’t been inordinately negative about anyone’s food choices either. I might cut out the meat at some point, there are some arguments for that, but I don’t think I’ll be subscribing to your newsletter.

I've no idea what any of that means (what 'newsletter' are you on about?) but I do know that you're doing a very good job of avoiding the points I raised.

And as for 'agendas', your earlier sneery and dismissive attitude rather betray you on that's score.

 

[mojo pixy]

Last time I was in one they had *actual bits of animals* right there in the shop!

I know, butchers shops here are tame aren't they. I've seen shops elsewhere in the world with live animals being slaughtered in the yard out back and brought in piecemeal during business hours. No fridges, meat can't just hang about all day gathering flies. I actually think the fact it's all so sterile here is rubbish, it does separate us from the reality of what's happening. I also think that knowing about all that doesn't necessarily make people want not to be part of it. It's just another brutal aspect to life we easily rationalise or ignore.

 

[ddraig]

As if pictures of animals on the walls of butchers' shops didn't make the point already?

do they have pics of actual cute pigs in butchers then? or maybe just the (clean and non bleeding nicely presented) parts they're selling?

 

[ddraig]

I think people less clouded by their agendas might see where you misread what I said.

I’m learning something about the way at least some vegans believe things, at least.

I have no quarrel with anyone’s hobbies, though, and I haven’t been inordinately negative about anyone’s food choices either. I might cut out the meat at some point, there are some arguments for that, but I don’t think I’ll be subscribing to your newsletter.

"but"
all your caveats are worth nothing, just be like bees, far more honest

 

[8ball]

"but"
all your caveats are worth nothing, just be like bees, far more honest

The Importance of Getting Enough Zinc in a Vegan Diet and How to Do it

 

[ddraig]

As if pictures of animals on the walls of butchers' shops didn't make the point already?

i'll ask again
are you denying it won't make some people think?

 

[mojo pixy]

do they have pics of actual cute pigs in butchers then? or maybe just the (clean and non bleeding nicely presented) parts they're selling?

OK no, I have seen it but it's not everywhere. Still. I think you underestimate how much people are very well aware what meat is, even from quite a young age.

i'll ask again
are you denying it won't make some people think?

I'm not denying that. What it will make them think, is another question.

 

[ddraig]

The Importance of Getting Enough Zinc in a Vegan Diet and How to Do it

your point?

 

[8ball]

your point?

Just trying to be generally helpful.

 

[ddraig]

OK no, I have seen it but it's not everywhere. Still. I think you underestimate how much people are very well aware what meat is, even from quite a young age.

and i think you underestimate (and doth protest toooo much) how much of an effect it can have
see babe the film and it's effect

 

[ddraig]

Just trying to be generally helpful.

how sweet
got it covered thanks ever so

 

[mojo pixy]

and i think you underestimate (and doth protest toooo much) how much of an effect it can have
see babe the film and it's effect

Yeak OK, manipulating kids is easy. A lot of people who go veg as kids don't go on doing it into adulthood.

 

[editor]

The Importance of Getting Enough Zinc in a Vegan Diet and How to Do it

So that article tells me it's piss easy to get zinc in a vegan diet because it's in fucking LOADS of everyday foods. So what was the point of you linking to that page?

 

[ddraig]

Yeak OK, manipulating kids is easy. A lot of people who go veg as kids don't go on doing it into adulthood.

mainpulating?!?!

by showing them the origin of their food?

the meat industry do all the manipulating backed by advertising and loadsa money and "tradition" and "normal" etc etc
even little shapes for the kiddies
should it be hidden from people then? the origin of their food?
jeez

 

[keybored]

should it be hidden from people then? the origin of their food?

I had no idea pork came from pigs, or chicken came from actual chickens. Those vegan campaigns changed that. Thanks.

 

[mojo pixy]

Babe is a film, Films are emotionally manipulative, that's kind of the point. Using Babe as an example of how cutesy animaw stuff makes kids want to stop eating animals is flaunting the manipulation. Fine, manipulating kids is easy, they're kids, but admit it.

I don't think the origin of meat is at all hidden. Personally, I don't remember ever being in doubt what meat was and where it came from, it was animals and we were eating them. Thank you animals! etc. I think you're underestimating the capability kids have for a) understanding where meat comes from and b) not being phased by it.

 

[8ball]

I had no idea pork came from pigs, or chicken came from actual chickens. Those vegan campaigns changed that. Thanks.

It doesn’t just come from pigs. It *is* the pig!

 

[ddraig]

the "arguments" just get weaker by day, quite revealing

do you think the majority of kids know? honestly now

 

[ddraig]

Babe is a film, Films are emotionally manipulative, that's kind of the point. Using Babe as an example of how cutesy animaw stuff makes kids want to stop eating animals is flaunting the manipulation. Fine, manipulating kids is easy, they're kids, but admit it.

I don't think the origin of meat is at all hidden. Personally, I don't remember ever being in doubt what meat was and where it came from, it was animals and we were eating them. Thank you animals! etc. I think you're underestimating the capability kids have for a) understanding where meat comes from and b) not being phased by it.

It's the realisation that that's what it is actually is and where it comes from, the truth
stop being so disingenuous

and again, what is manipulating about it??

 

[keybored]

do you think the majority of kids know? honestly now

Honestly, yes.

 

[mojo pixy]

do you think the majority of kids know? honestly now

I do, and I know quite a few kids so I say this with a reasonable degree of confidence. You feel they should be more horrified than they are, and you reckon the reason they aren't is because they just don't know.

 

[mojo pixy]

i think you underestimate (and doth protest toooo much) how much of an effect it can have
see babe the film and it's effect

and again, what is manipulating about it??

Maybe you'd like to explain, since you brought it up?

 

[ddraig]

no
you mentioned it first about kids being manipulated
what do you mean?

 

[mojo pixy]

OK then, we can do this slowly.

What effect did Babe have, as you said it had an effect?

 

[8ball]

OK then, we can do this slowly.

What effect did Babe have, as you said it had an effect?

I’ve never seen it, but I read they needed over 40 piglets because they grow so fast and filming takes a while.

It probably created some catering economies until the crew grew tired of hog roasts, though.

 

[ddraig]

Yeak OK, manipulating kids is easy. A lot of people who go veg as kids don't go on doing it into adulthood.

this is what you said
how were the kids manipulated?

 

[ddraig]

OK then, we can do this slowly.

What effect did Babe have, as you said it had an effect?

i'll answer your post
it had the effect that a lot of kids realised where the bacon/ham/pork came from and they then spurned it because they empathised with the pig
now answer mine

 

[ddraig]

I’ve never seen it, but I read they needed over 40 piglets because they grow so fast and filming takes a while.

It probably created some catering economies until the crew grew tired of hog roasts, though.

titter, hur hur
pleased with that one i'm guessing