Did Rumsfield and Chums want and allow 9/11 to happen? The Poll!

[pk]

One up to the fela fan??



One in the eye you mean. All this irrelevant talk of rock descriptives - avoiding the real issues just like the other nutjobs...

Before we arrive at the conclusion that those phone calls were real or fake, we need to know if such calls can be made 20,000 foot up in the air while travelling at at least 30 mph.

Coz they can't be made 2000 foot up on the ground, nor can they be made... ahem, 'deep' below the 'surface'.

YOU say calls cannot be made 2000 feet up on the ground.

But you base your evidence on YOUR experience - up a random fucking Thai mountain, not in the cellular phone mast saturated USA.

What's the weather like on your planet fela fan??

Are you really this stupid or are you just being annoying for the sake of it?

 

[fela fan]

Pedantry? How have I fucked up exactly? Sorry but you seem to be one deluded individual. I was responding to your statement "And how come nowhere on the london undeground gets a signal." and I gave my answer. And you seemed determined to argue the toss.

You haven't fucked up, you were just being pedantic.

And i'm not going to be, in trying to point out to you how you were being so.

But i do find it funny how you accidentally contradicted editor. And all the back-pedalling since then.

by the both of you.

 

[editor]

oh, and there's me thinking that this thread was on about: Did Rumsfield and Chums want and allow 9/11 to happen?

Indeed it is. But if you'd actually read back through the thread you'd see that we're discussing one of DrJ's bizarre 'theories' about how this cover up might have been achieved.

If you're looking for threads that never deviate one inch from the thread title, I fear you're in the wrong place (see fela's mobile phone excursion above)

 

[pk]

I see you have started a new thread.

You went on about bigfish and drjazzz running away from you.

You told me you'd debate with me. I accepted your criteria, and yet you've apparantly run away from the debate.

Hypocrisy, or are you coming back to deal with my points?

What points?

I'm addressing a seperate issue on that thread.

You have agreed with me that calls were perfectly possible from Flight 93, therefore the notion that "actors" or whatever were used to fake loved one's final calls to their partners is utter, utter bullshit if they could have picked up the phone on the plane and called home.

You made a point somewhere??
Makes a change.
What point would you like me to address then?

 

[Loki]

You haven't fucked up, you were just being pedantic.

And i'm not going to be, in trying to point out to you how you were being so.

But i do find it funny how you accidentally contradicted editor. And all the back-pedalling since then.

by the both of you.

I don't recieve reports from the editor on what to post - I am actually an independant human being. And once more yet again, I was responding to your post "And how come nowhere on the london undeground gets a signal."

This is boring me to tears.

 

[fela fan]

One up to the fela fan??



One in the eye you mean. All this irrelevant talk of rock descriptives - avoiding the real issues just like the other nutjobs...



YOU say calls cannot be made 2000 feet up on the ground.

But you base your evidence on YOUR experience - up a random fucking Thai mountain, not in the cellular phone mast saturated USA.

What's the weather like on your planet fela fan??

Are you really this stupid or are you just being annoying for the sake of it?

You keep ignoring the australian mountain I've talked about. That is a western country pk. Nicely developed eh. And nicely avoided by the denigration tactic. You're too transparent mate.

My experience is more real to me than any fucking expert in a paper. I originally asked on this thread for any urbanite to share their experiences of making mobile calls when thousands of feet up in the air on a plane, coz i trust real people rather than experts or journos working for murdoch.

The level of opprobrium and insult i've garnered since is most instructive.

 

[bendeus]

Indeed it is. But if you'd actually read back through the thread you'd see that we're discussing one of DrJ's bizarre 'theories' about how this cover up might have been achieved.

If you're looking for threads that never deviate one inch from the thread title, I fear you're in the wrong place (see fela's mobile phone excursion above)

Quite. I did however my first make my first post less about the subject but more about the entire tone - from start to finish. I don't give a hoot about DrJ's theory and put even less credence in it but I do give a hoot about the subject being constantly derailed, and about 'conspiracy theorists' always getting the blame, which I don't consider to be fair. Anyway....

 

[pk]

For the record - I agree with Bendeus, to a degree... I do believe there was a PNAC/neocon objective to allow this to happen in order for Bush to implement a war strategy and secure his oil pipelines.
Though I doubt even PNAC and the Neocons could have predicted the towers collapsing, or just how many planes/people would be involved.

I do NOT believe that passenger calls were faked, that missiles were used, or holograms, or bombs planted under the WTC towers to assist their collapse, or any of the other David Icke lizard bullshit that seems to be touted here by deluded fuckwits like CaroleK, Dr Jazzz, or Bigfish.

Questioning the official line is a little bit different to accepting the offensive bollocks we are fed as "fact!" here by the muppet squad as listed above.

 

[snadge]

You keep ignoring the australian mountain I've talked about. That is a western country pk. Nicely developed eh. And nicely avoided by the denigration tactic. You're too transparent mate.

My experience is more real to me than any fucking expert in a paper. I originally asked on this thread for any urbanite to share their experiences of making mobile calls when thousands of feet up in the air on a plane, coz i trust real people rather than experts or journos working for murdoch.

The level of opprobrium and insult i've garnered since is most instructive.

where was the nearest town and how far was it from this Australian mountain?

 

[fela fan]

Indeed it is. But if you'd actually read back through the thread you'd see that we're discussing one of DrJ's bizarre 'theories' about how this cover up might have been achieved.

If you're looking for threads that never deviate one inch from the thread title, I fear you're in the wrong place (see fela's mobile phone excursion above)

This post provides one with a bit of a cackle.

Firstly, drj's theories eh? For 33 pages?

And your most common derailing tactic on 911 threads is to bring up the phone calls aspect of things.

I respond to it for once, and you tell the forum that i have embarked upon an excursion.

I really shake my head in wonder sometimes...

 

[pk]

You keep ignoring the australian mountain I've talked about.

No - I keep laughing about it.

Where is it?

How many phone masts does it have per square mile?

I'm happy to make you look stupid again.

 

[fela fan]

Questioning the official line is a little bit different to accepting the offensive bollocks we are fed as "fact!" here by the muppet squad as listed above.

Whoever the muppet squad are, i think you need to realise that all i've ever done is the first part of your sentence.

 

[bendeus]

For the record - I agree with Bendeus, to a degree... I do believe there was a PNAC/neocon objective to allow this to happen in order for Bush to implement a war strategy and secure his oil pipelines.
Though I doubt even PNAC and the Neocons could have predicted the towers collapsing, or just how many planes/people would be involved.

I do NOT believe that passenger calls were faked, that missiles were used, or holograms, or bombs planted under the WTC towers to assist their collapse, or any of the other David Icke lizard bullshit that seems to be touted here by deluded fuckwits like CaroleK, Dr Jazzz, or Bigfish.

Questioning the official line is a little bit different to accepting the offensive bollocks we are fed as "fact!" here by the muppet squad as listed above.

So you and I are on similar ground, then. Why do you feel the need to call people deluded fuckwits, though? It just turns everything into bile.

I'm still interested to see whether editor would view my slightly-divergent-from-the-mainstream views as tinfoil hattery, too.

 

[fela fan]

where was the nearest town and how far was it from this Australian mountain?

I was on the mountain. The nearest town (at the same altitude) is about 30 minutes drive away. About five kms before the town, signals appear on the mobile. You know, coz it beeps with a message.

 

[editor]

Quite. I did however my first make my first post less about the subject but more about the entire tone - from start to finish. I don't give a hoot about DrJ's theory and put even less credence in it but I do give a hoot about the subject being constantly derailed, and about 'conspiracy theorists' always getting the blame, which I don't consider to be fair. Anyway....

And that'll be because you haven't endured nearly three years of the same evidence-free garbage being posted up here, week in and week out.

During this time, I've even been accused of being in the employ of both this government and the USG by conspiracy fruitcakes!

This site wasn't set up for a tiny handful of conspiracy obsessives to endlessly repeat the same evidence-free bollocks scooped up from hopelessy dodgy homepages, adn I don't want this site associated with their beliefs either.

If anyone's to blame for the lack of decent debate about 9/11, it'll be the conspiracy fans who insist on posting up such fantastical claims that the threads insistently get sidetracked by people - quite rightly - demanding proof and then never getting a straight answer.

 

[bendeus]

This post provides one with a bit of a cackle.

Firstly, drj's theories eh? For 33 pages?

And your most common derailing tactic on 911 threads is to bring up the phone calls aspect of things.

I respond to it for once, and you tell the forum that i have embarked upon an excursion.

I really shake my head in wonder sometimes...

That's kind of what I was trying to get at. The whole thread follows the same pattern throughout, and ditto for all other posts vaguely relating to the subject. Citizen 66, who started the thread, seemed perfectly rational to me, but he was goaded, baited and mocked until his argument was forced down a level, and thus became easy to shoot down. I maintain that most of the provocation and aggression comes from the don't want to hear it camp.

 

[snadge]

I was on the mountain. The nearest town (at the same altitude) is about 30 minutes drive away. About five kms before the town, signals appear on the mobile. You know, coz it beeps with a message.

that's the reason you will not get a signal up the mountain, you are too far away from the antenna, being 2000 ft up will only make you further away

 

[fela fan]

I'm happy to make you look stupid again.

That's a matter of peception dear boy.

You can certainly speak for yourself, and editor, but not for anyone else.

You should learn to stick to debating what the message is, instead of attacking the messenger.

But there again, maybe you don't want to. Fair enough, just carry on boyo.

 

[editor]

I'm still interested to see whether editor would view my slightly-divergent-from-the-mainstream views as tinfoil hattery, too.

You seem awfully bothered about what I think about.

Post up your argument, supported by well-researched argument and credible sources, and I'l be delighted to offer an opinion.

 

[pk]

Name of the town please Fela Fan.

And Bendeus - you haven't been here to witness the offensive bollocks spouted by the muppet squad month after month - suggesting all types of deluded bollocks.

If we are to discuss the topic properly then we are to dismiss the shallow and frankly hysterical claims made by the minority, that have no basis in fact whatsoever.

Read the entire thread and you'll get some idea of the level of bollocks talked by Dr Jazzz and his motley crew of shit-talkers.

This is why I get annoyed.

The language, well, it's part of it for me. I try to be civil, but I get nowhere.

 

[editor]

Citizen 66, who started the thread, seemed perfectly rational to me, but he was goaded, baited and mocked until his argument was forced down a level, and thus became easy to shoot down. I maintain that most of the provocation and aggression comes from the don't want to hear it camp.

You're entitled to your opinion, just as I'm entitled to say that I think you're talking total bollocks, with my opinion being based on running these boards for years.

Have you actually read all of citizen's posts here and elsewhere? Why do you think he was recently threatened with a ban?

 

[pk]

I maintain that most of the provocation and aggression comes from the don't want to hear it camp.

Bendeus - I do want to hear it - but every time the topic is raised here it gets swamped by conspiranoids eager to push the agendas of nutjobs like David Icke or anti-Semitic fuckwads like Joe Vialls.

And we get nowhere.

If we banned the bollocks-talkers we could have a discussion.

 

[fela fan]

Name of the town please Fela Fan.

The language, well, it's part of it for me. I try to be civil, but I get nowhere.

Mount Molloy and Mareeba pk. Look! Two for the price of one!

Fair enough on that score. But don't expect me, the part of me, to accept your descriptive language towards my good self. I am here to post my opinions, and if i get shat on, i ain't lying fucking down man.

 

[pk]

So lets check cellular availability with that of the Flight 93 crash area shall we?

 

[bendeus]

I've been here long enough to see sufficient threads to have made up my mind about things. Why don't you and editor police the politics and protest sites in a similar manner in order to stop the likes of PBman spreading his bigotry and chauvenism around the boards? Are you not worried that he'll create a breeding ground for NRA neocon fruitloops to demean the good name of these boards?

Editor: I'm interested to know your opinion because you are frequently the first and often the most irritated of the anti CT crew, and wished to see whether I fell into that category by suggesting that things may not be as they seem regarding the whole 9/11 shebang

 

[editor]

and the presence of a conspiracy forum doesnt seem to have dragged uk420 down one bit.

That'll be because the boards are populated primarily by mellow stoners and they boards are nowhere near as popular as urban75.

Conspiracy fans like to showboat on popular boards, you see....

 

[fela fan]

That's kind of what I was trying to get at. The whole thread follows the same pattern throughout, and ditto for all other posts vaguely relating to the subject. Citizen 66, who started the thread, seemed perfectly rational to me, but he was goaded, baited and mocked until his argument was forced down a level, and thus became easy to shoot down. I maintain that most of the provocation and aggression comes from the don't want to hear it camp.

That's the way of these threads on urban mate. I've been involved in them for over two years now, and it's a constant battle.

But my line of work makes these threads a most interesting and informative piece of action research.

I learn a lot. And maybe that's why i stick around. Plus a sense of justice....

 

[fela fan]

That'll be because the boards are populated primarily by mellow stoners and they boards are nowhere near as popular as urban75.

Conspiracy fans like to showboat on popular boards, you see....

imeego.

 

[bendeus]

Bendeus - I do want to hear it - but every time the topic is raised here it gets swamped by conspiranoids eager to push the agendas of nutjobs like David Icke or anti-Semitic fuckwads like Joe Vialls.

And we get nowhere.

If we banned the bollocks-talkers we could have a discussion.

Would you be prepared to admit that there might be just a wee bit of six of one and half a dozen of the other? I do agree that some of the conspiracy stuff posted is ridiculous, and also why it annoys people, but I also feel that people are so flamed up about that that they leap on anyone who utters a peep about anything relating to 9/11. There's gotta be a middle way, hasn't there?

 

[editor]

Editor: I'm interested to know your opinion because you are frequently the first and often the most irritated of the anti CT crew, and wished to see whether I fell into that category by suggesting that things may not be as they seem regarding the whole 9/11 shebang

Do I believe the WTC was:
1. Attacked my missile firing, pod-carrying, remote control, pretend passenger aircraft? NO
2. Blown up by explosives sneakily installed before the attacks? NO
3. Attacked by small arms fire? NO

Do I believe that the calls from the 9/11 planes were:
1. Faked by a team of USG Mike Yarwoods? NO
2. Made by terrified passengers in a room somewhere as part of 'Operation Pretend You've been Hijacked' NO
3. A figment of the widows imagination? NO

Am I fed up with the same few individuals posting up the same evidence free conspiracy bollocks like the above? YES

Do I believe that the USG has collectively lied, distorted the truth and manipulated public opinion to justify their actions post 9/11? Oh yes.

HTH. HAND.