teqniq
DisMembered
If this is true it would appear to give the lie to a threat to national security and make it about something else entirely:
British IS schoolgirl 'wants to return home'
- Thread starter hipipol
- Start date
Spymaster
Plastic Paddy
Why do people keep quoting this as if it's relevent to Begum's situation?
The fighters who've returned have done so under their own steam. The government hasn't helped them to return and is likely unaware that many of them fought for IS in any case. Most of them came back when they realised that IS were finished in Iraq in 2017 (as noted on that tweet). If Begum had done that, she'd be here now too.
Yes I agree that they haven’t been fair and consistent at all about it. Unfortunately for Begum she became a story in the media from when she left with two friends which hasn’t helped her predicament.
Spymaster
Plastic Paddy
They are not letting some back and not others. They just cannot prevent people with valid UK citizenship from returning.
littlebabyjesus
one of Maxwell's demons
It's not just that Begum isn't being helped to return, it is that she is being actively prevented from returning.
At least characterise the situation correctly before going off on your reactionary support for injustice.
And apparently not investigating them as threats to National security. Or are they?
Spymaster
Plastic Paddy
Pah! Useless observation, though I can see why you'd jump on it.
I'll rephrase that to "the government hasn't been able to prevent them from returning ..."
By the way; you will insist on constantly adding that last sarcastic sentence but it's probably not doing your blood pressure much good. Try doing without it.
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Spymaster
Plastic Paddy
They'll investigate those they know about but many will have just shown-up at the border with a valid passport and the authorities will have no idea where they've been or what they've been up to.
Just it’s weird that she appears to be the only one. Oh and Letts.
littlebabyjesus
one of Maxwell's demons
Pah! Useless observation, though I can see why you'd jump on it.
I'll rephrase that to "the government hasn't been able to prevent them from returning ..."
By the way; you will insist on constantly adding that last sarcastic sentence but it's probably not doing your blood pressure much good. Try doing without it.
It's not a useless observation. That's a Daily Mail-style distortion and misrepresentation of what is happening. She is being prevented from returning, not simply not being helped to return. There is a difference.
Also a bit naive to think that MI6 were completely unaware of any other UK jihadis other than Begum and Letts.
Spymaster
Plastic Paddy
There are loads. Those are just the ones you've heard about.
Between 2017 and 2020 the UK stripped about 300 citizenships. Many of those will have been fraudulently obtained in the first place, and some will have no relevance to this, but it's no coincidence that the massive spike coincides with the fall of IS.
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Spymaster
Plastic Paddy
Also a bit naive to think that MI6 were completely unaware of any other UK jihadis other than Begum and Letts.
It would be more than naive; it would be downright idiotic to think such a thing.
Spymaster
Plastic Paddy
Glad we've agreed on that then.
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His views are consistent though. It’s true that if this was a white male fascist this was happening to nobody would give a flying fuck. That she ticks all the boxes of sympathy the fascism is ignored by many. Not just any old fascism. Having women as rape toys fascism. National Action got nowhere near that before being proscribed.
tim
EXPLODED TIM! (Help me!!!)
She's a isolated young woman twenties whose watched three children die. What secret powers do you think she has that could bring down the British state?
bimble
floofy
I know that feels good to say Magnus McGinty but I really don’t think it’s true. She’s just the famous blockbuster example of this punishment of removing citizenship. I have no interest at all in her as an individual. The reason she’s this famous is not due to an excess of misplaced sympathy from lefties either, is it, it’s because she’s a useful and emotive hate figure.
Haven’t a few hundred returned home to Europe over the last few years?
Spymaster
Plastic Paddy
Probably a few thousand.
But would you cut eg Nick Griffin the same slack? He’s been in racist/misogynistic organisations that have done far less than IS.
bimble
floofy
Hes thoroughly British isn’t he (I assume) so not in danger of having his citizenship removed even if he blew up a mosque or started a genocidal cult or whatever.
If we were talking about some punishment that could apply to all citizens equally if they did the same crime I wouldn’t be on the thread.
tim
EXPLODED TIM! (Help me!!!)
The reality is that if she'd been an adult white male and from either community in Northern Ireland, she wouldn't be treated in this way.
But she was a female child from an Asian background, so an easy target.
Pickman's model
Starry Wisdom
Yes, but if he was in danger, you wouldn’t care less was my point.
Sad as that is she might some responsibility for their deaths by remaining there instead of coming back.
I don't know what risk she poses but it seems a bit dodgy that it is up to the likes of Javid to decide rather than a court. That gives a political motive rather than being based on risk.
bimble
floofy
I don’t give a shit about begum, as have said many times. Other people here do.
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