Atos Medicals - Questions, Answers and Support

[existentialist]

Any advice on accompanying someone to an ESA medical?


Is it too late to get recording permission in time for Friday? Can I take notes, etc?

What if they want to try and do limb movement testa etc but they're too painful for my friend to do?

They have severe arthritis, but their pain relief is virtually nonexistent as they're a long standing opiate addict and getting their drugs councillor, and gp on the same page.

They don't have a history of drug seeking, and in fact are only on a minimal methadone script that they got whilst undergoing get their second hip replacement. The gp won't even refer them for pain management for their knees , even though he can barely walk most days, can't use public transport, and pays for it even from a trip to the corner shop.

Are there any guides to what I need to take note of? Can I use my phone to record without permission, for my own notes?

The general advice seems to be that you can't record without permission. BUT, you can take notes, and who's to say you're not such a good note-taker that you were able to record the entire conversation verbatim, hem hem hem. And I believe tribunals have taken reasonable account of notes taken by someone during the assessment, so they have some evidentiary value if it comes to it.

 

[stuff_it]

The general advice seems to be that you can't record without permission. BUT, you can take notes, and who's to say you're not such a good note-taker that you were able to record the entire conversation verbatim, hem hem hem. And I believe tribunals have taken reasonable account of notes taken by someone during the assessment, so they have some evidentiary value if it comes to it.

Thanks, I'm a pretty decent note taker and have worked in healthcare and law before as an administrator.

Would I be able to use the timer on my phone? I might want to know how long various parts of the examination take.

 

[existentialist]

Thanks, I'm a pretty decent note taker and have worked in healthcare and law before as an administrator.

Would I be able to use the timer on my phone? I might want to know how long various parts of the examination take.

I think that if you were to be using your phone to covertly record, you'd be wisest not to even advertise its existence. They do seem to get very touchy about anything they feel threatens them in some way.

 

[Greebo]

stuff_it - in addition to what's been said - noting the demeanour & attitude of the assessor may be helpful.

If your person being assessed is asked to do anything, they have the right to stop at the point where pain starts, and to say so. That's not when the pain becomes unbearable, but when it starts!

BTW it's safe to assume that your arrival, checking in, waiting, walking to the room, leaving the building, and getting as far as your transport home will be observed and taken into consideration: Act accordingly.

 

[equationgirl]

stuff_it if possible try to ascertain what type of experience the assessor has - for example, are they a nurse, or a physio, or a chiropodist etc? Make sure you note this information as it may prove useful if you have to go to appeal.

Be polite throughout but bear in mind however nice the assessor seems, they are not there to be helpful to the claimant for the most part. Also as Greebo has says, be aware that you and the claimant will likely be observed before the interview starts. Any small talk such as 'was your journey to the centre ok today?' may appear innocuous but can be used to elicit additional information e.g. when asked about travelling, claimant stated they had no issues using public transport and travelling alone to interview.

Your friend could phone up and ask about recording but this may result in the interview being postponed until equipment can ve booked, and even then there are cases of claimants turning up for interview to be notified that the equipment is unavailable, or hasn't been booked, or is broken etc. Take notes and if you want to use your phone to record (may be essential if claimant has memory issues for example) then I recommend you have it recording in a pocket with it switched onto silent until after you are out of sight of the building.

 

[stuff_it]

stuff_it if possible try to ascertain what type of experience the assessor has - for example, are they a nurse, or a physio, or a chiropodist etc? Make sure you note this information as it may prove useful if you have to go to appeal.

Be polite throughout but bear in mind however nice the assessor seems, they are not there to be helpful to the claimant for the most part. Also as Greebo has says, be aware that you and the claimant will likely be observed before the interview starts. Any small talk such as 'was your journey to the centre ok today?' may appear innocuous but can be used to elicit additional information e.g. when asked about travelling, claimant stated they had no issues using public transport and travelling alone to interview.

Your friend could phone up and ask about recording but this may result in the interview being postponed until equipment can ve booked, and even then there are cases of claimants turning up for interview to be notified that the equipment is unavailable, or hasn't been booked, or is broken etc. Take notes and if you want to use your phone to record (may be essential if claimant has memory issues for example) then I recommend you have it recording in a pocket with it switched onto silent until after you are out of sight of the building.

I had a job for a while writing the cover letters and sending urgent asylum appeals, and following them up with a phone call to make sure they got read before people got deported.

I was good at my job (sadly there was no longer term funding in that field). I'm not sure ATOS will know what hit them.

 

[stuff_it]

I've been looking over my friend's claim, and it looks like both:

a) We may need to add and/or change things where their condition has worsened.

b) I'm not sure if they've got all the evidence, scans, etc from their gp that they could.


Should we be rebooking the appointment, or just wing it? This is a standard 6 monthly medical, and they filled in their esa form several years ago.

They're unlikely to end up getting the boot entirely, but really need to be on the support group, since several of the things wrong with them are degenerative.

I'm the first fully Internet savvy person they've had to help them with their claim, and I've never been involved with an esa claim before so I don't want to cock it up.

 

[Greebo]

stuff_it
Wing it - and add stuff if you have to ask for the decision to be reconsidered.

 

[equationgirl]

stuff_it
Wing it - and add stuff if you have to ask for the decision to be reconsidered.

stuff_it ^^^^ this

Make sure in future your friend keeps copies of all medical evidence (note - it's unclear sometimes how much weight such evidence carries, there have been anecdotal reports that it is ignored by decision makers in the process or conversely that the decision maker simply accepts the evidence and everything in between. my personal view is drown the fuckers in paperwork).

 

[stuff_it]

I'm trying to get them to go through the points list for each condition, rather than just "I should get 15 on the first question so I'm probably fine".

They didn't know that saying the pain varies is a 0-point answer either.

He's going for Pips soon after, and does really need it, so good to get everything in a line now.

Next up is taking the doctors to task on basically providing no pain relief (script doesn't count) when he can hardly walk.

 

[equationgirl]

I'm trying to get them to go through the points list for each condition, rather than just "I should get 15 on the first question so I'm probably fine".

They didn't know that saying the pain varies is a 0-point answer either.

He's going for Pips soon after, and does really need it, so good to get everything in a line now.

Next up is taking the doctors to task on basically providing no pain relief (script doesn't count) when he can hardly walk.

Ask the gp for an urgent referral to a pain management specialist, he'll have better luck there.

Encourage him to think about how he is on his worst days, not an average day then get him to describe his worst days to you.

Also worth making a list of any meds he does take, listing the side effects for each one. Make a note any side effect that is common as two or meds with a side effect of e.g. fatigue can mean he is badly affected.

 

[WouldBe]

Any advice on accompanying someone to an ESA medical?


Is it too late to get recording permission in time for Friday? Can I take notes, etc?

What if they want to try and do limb movement testa etc but they're too painful for my friend to do?

They have severe arthritis, but their pain relief is virtually nonexistent as they're a long standing opiate addict and getting their drugs councillor, and gp on the same page.

They don't have a history of drug seeking, and in fact are only on a minimal methadone script that they got whilst undergoing get their second hip replacement. The gp won't even refer them for pain management for their knees , even though he can barely walk most days, can't use public transport, and pays for it even from a trip to the corner shop.

Are there any guides to what I need to take note of? Can I use my phone to record without permission, for my own notes?

There are no problems accompanying some one to an ESA medical.

I got permission to record my PIP in 20 minutes because the tossers forgot about it. Phone the number for the appointments and tell the you want the medical recorded so they can get 'clearance' from the DWP and that you can record it yourself. Can You? or you may have to rearrange the appointment for a date when recording equipment is available.

If they want to do limb movements your friend can refuse to do them "as it will hurt too much". The 'medic' should then not do the tests.

Good luck.

 

[equationgirl]

And go through the report the assessor completes after the interview - there was a case recently where the assessor had basically falsified some of report by stating answers the claimant hadn't even been asked questions for.

They no longer carry out assessments.

 

[ViolentPanda]

I'm trying to get them to go through the points list for each condition, rather than just "I should get 15 on the first question so I'm probably fine".

They didn't know that saying the pain varies is a 0-point answer either.

He's going for Pips soon after, and does really need it, so good to get everything in a line now.

Next up is taking the doctors to task on basically providing no pain relief (script doesn't count) when he can hardly walk.

If they're worried about him abusing prescription meds in tablet form, they could prescribe him fentanyl patches.

 

[equationgirl]

If they're worried about him abusing prescription meds in tablet form, they could prescribe him fentanyl patches.

That would require thinking, mind

 

[ViolentPanda]

That would require thinking, mind

True. GPs aren't exactly noted for their thinking skills!

 

[equationgirl]

Not all are bad, granted, but there does seem to be a continued reluctance to prescribe anything opiate or opioid type meds.

 

[Calamity1971]

Had my assesment at Bannatynes today. Apparently I've been depressed and anxious since february this year? Been on meds for this since 1990 and awarded dla in 2002. Guessing i'm going to get the usual nil points. She announced herself as a paramedic and yet showed no signs of any compassion. The fact that I have to work 16 hours a week because esa assesment fucked me off will probably go against me as well. Still numb that I had to go to a health club and spa to have to open up about my problems.

 

[friendofdorothy]

I've been looking over my friend's claim, and it looks like both:

a) We may need to add and/or change things where their condition has worsened.

b) I'm not sure if they've got all the evidence, scans, etc from their gp that they could.


Should we be rebooking the appointment, or just wing it? This is a standard 6 monthly medical, and they filled in their esa form several years ago.

They're unlikely to end up getting the boot entirely, but really need to be on the support group, since several of the things wrong with them are degenerative.

I'm the first fully Internet savvy person they've had to help them with their claim, and I've never been involved with an esa claim before so I don't want to cock it up.

When the examiner ask 'can you do x?' and the claimant says 'yes' because they can do that thing a bit, its worth reminding them but not always, not for long and they suffer afterwards. I can't find the reference now but recall Govt guidance says something like you must be able to do something repeatedly and reliably.

 

[Sapphireblue]

When the examiner ask 'can you do x?' and the claimant says 'yes' because they can do that thing a bit, its worth reminding them but not always, not for long and they suffer afterwards. I can't find the reference now but recall Govt guidance says something like you must be able to do something repeatedly and reliably.

and it might even be better to phrase it 'not usually' or 'not unless' rather than 'yes, but' to make it harder for them to only take in the yes part.

 

[xsunnysuex]

After my WCA on 7th Sept. I've received a letter inviting me to a meeting with a work coach. I still haven't received my decision letter from the DWP, so I phoned to find out. They said letter is in the post. I've been put in the WRAG group.
I'm happy with that. I was in WRAG last time. But only after appeal as I initially failed.

 

[equationgirl]

stuff_it has the assessment happened yet?

 

[Treacle Toes]

Sickness benefits claimants will no longer have to go through reassessments to keep their payments if they suffer from chronic illnesses, the Department of Work and Pensions secretary is to announce.


DWP scraps retesting for chronically ill sickness benefits claimants

So they will no longer check if limbs have grown back or that people who are terminal have suddenly been cured (amongst other fucking ridiculous and humiliating wastes and abuses of people's lives/time.)

 

[Greebo]

So they will no longer check if limbs have grown back or that people who are terminal have suddenly been cured (amongst other fucking ridiculous and humiliating wastes and abuses of people's lives/time.)

A few disabilities, illnesses, and conditions will not be retested - many more (ME for example) will be, in case of that increasingly small chance of permanent & full remission.

 

[equationgirl]

A few disabilities, illnesses, and conditions will not be retested - many more (ME for example) will be, in case of that increasingly small chance of permanent & full remission.

The list of conditions has not yet been drawn up so hopefully it will more than a few. At least someone has finally come out and said 'what is the point of retesting people whose conditions aren't going to improve?'

I'm cautiously optimistic about this but obviously it will depend on the conditions exempted.

 

[existentialist]

The list of conditions has not yet been drawn up so hopefully it will more than a few. At least someone has finally come out and said 'what is the point of retesting people whose conditions aren't going to improve?'

I'm cautiously optimistic about this but obviously it will depend on the conditions exempted.

I'm slightly more pessimistic: I picked up an undertone in the announcement which seemed to me to be saying "...but we'll carry on testing the fuck out of anyone where doing so isn't going to make us look like idiotic callous, uncaring bastards".

 

[BCBlues]

Another DWP decision overturned at Appeal

Migrated from Incapacity Benefit to ESA this year and scored a massive 0 points at a WCA which was backed up by their delaying tactic of Mandatory Reconsideration.

Attended Appeal Thursday and have been awarded 9 points for problems mobilising and 6 for problems standing and sitting and a recommendation not to review for at least 2 years from current date.

Appeal Panel was a very sympathetic judge who was astounded that the assessor was working from a form completed 2 years earlier and 6 months before a disastrous hip operation. The other member was a very thorough Doctor, unlike the Nurse who assessed me at WCA and who barely looked me in the eye.

I noticed they had gone through all my hospital reports, there was a lot of highlighted areas. Included in these were reports that i had sent copies in to the Tribunal received after Appeal Submission up to Appeal Date.This was important in my case as the idiot at WCA had stated "had hip operation,referred to GP no further interventions" .
Don't forget to do this folks if you reach this stage and you think the reports will be favourable in your appeal. You have up to seven days before Appeal Date to supply such information. I also took along some more info that I had received from Pain Management only four days before my Appeal Date.

This thread was monumental in keeping me motivated, informed and instilling belief, this and the Benefits and Work Site. I want to thank you all and wish you all the best in your own battles against this ridiculous system.
You certainly are not fighting the battle alone when there are wonderful people around like the ones who contribute in here , I hope to be of some use in here after gaining a few more insights into the DWP and their nasty tactics.

Once again, thank you all.

 

[Greebo]

Another DWP decision overturned at Appeal

Migrated from Incapacity Benefit to ESA this year and scored a massive 0 points at a WCA which was backed up by their delaying tactic of Mandatory Reconsideration.

Attended Appeal Thursday and have been awarded 9 points for problems mobilising and 6 for problems standing and sitting and a recommendation not to review for at least 2 years from current date. <snip>

 

[equationgirl]

Really well done BCBlues great news

 

[friendofdorothy]

So they will no longer check if limbs have grown back or that people who are terminal have suddenly been cured (amongst other fucking ridiculous and humiliating wastes and abuses of people's lives/time.)

was listening to that on the news this morning - sounds like a victory for common sense.

And lovely to hear your good news BCBlues.