DrRingDing
'anti-human wanker'
I've spent quite enough time in those style of meetings. I've not said I'm a fan. It's just the most pratical way of dealing with a challenging meeting.
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I've spent quite enough time in those style of meetings. I've not said I'm a fan. It's just the most pratical way of dealing with a challenging meeting.
cesare
shady's dreams ♥
What sort of meetings are they?
Casually Red
tomorrow belongs to me
stop doing stuff that attracts wankers like moths to a flame .
DrRingDing
'anti-human wanker'
There's a group of say 10 - 20 of people, some are familiar with each other, some are not. You need to discuss and organise for something.
DrRingDing
'anti-human wanker'
I'm going to put on my plastic psychologists hat and say you've had an upseting experience at a meeting the first time you encountered this method.
....and probs haven't been back.
SpineyNorman
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Yep, VP needs to check his right hand dexterity privilege, to realise that left handed people have been oppressed for centuries and learn to include them in his admittedly admirable plans for dealing with middle class trendies
cesare
shady's dreams ♥
I'd have thought that the hands up approach would prob be ok, not a big group so whoever's running the meeting can make sure it's not dominated by just a couple of people.
DrRingDing
'anti-human wanker'
What if someone has something to say regarding a point that's just being talked about but the stack is already large and it would be more appropriate to say the point now?
DotCommunist
So many particulars. So many questions.
what about the conch?
Casually Red
tomorrow belongs to me
i can assure you ive never been to a meeting where this would ever be considered as appropriate behaviour for grown adults
ItWillNeverWork
Messy Crimbobs, fellow humans.
I'm sure they can be all sorts of things in all sorts of contexts, but it doesn't change the fact that what they are is cliquey and off-putting. I'm with Casually Red on this. I'd run a mile. In fact, I'd think twice before even going to an Occupy meeting if this is what they're like.
Anyway, it's more the whole package that I have in mind; cryptic hand gestures, all this 'progressive stacking' stuff, and that human gramaphone thing or whatever it's called. It's creepy.
cesare
shady's dreams ♥
If loads of people have all put their hands up at once, sort of thing? I suppose whoever's running the meeting would just make sure that everyone got to have their say before moving on to the next point. Some hands would go down as people start making their points as sometimes what they want to say gets covered by a person before them.
sihhi
Tyranny, like hell, is not easily conquered
Personal opinion only. If I was given an opportunity to bring along a friend to a meeting about some aspect of public service cuts and given three options of a meeting:
i. with progressive stack.
ii. with extensive hand signals beyond a raised hand.
iii. with neither.
I would choose iii. whatever the subject however distant, because the effect of i. or ii. would breach our bond of normal friendship/ damage our trust. I would have to give a long spiel about how such a system began, why it's not trying to be condescending or racist or annoying at all, how the people doing i. or ii. are committed to the cause of working class people in the area. I don't feel comfortable on that ground - giving that kind of speech that is persuasive. I am sorry if it offends supporters but that's my personal level, and yes it does a strong part of cowardice. I dunno - perhaps another time I'd feel stronger to choose i or ii - not right now though.
i. with progressive stack.
ii. with extensive hand signals beyond a raised hand.
iii. with neither.
I would choose iii. whatever the subject however distant, because the effect of i. or ii. would breach our bond of normal friendship/ damage our trust. I would have to give a long spiel about how such a system began, why it's not trying to be condescending or racist or annoying at all, how the people doing i. or ii. are committed to the cause of working class people in the area. I don't feel comfortable on that ground - giving that kind of speech that is persuasive. I am sorry if it offends supporters but that's my personal level, and yes it does a strong part of cowardice. I dunno - perhaps another time I'd feel stronger to choose i or ii - not right now though.
Random
Ethnic nalgocrat
If every new speaker wants to bring up a new topic your meeting probably has bigger problems than a meager repertoire of hand gestures.
Nigel Irritable
Five, Ten, Fifteen Years
Jesus, the clown who wrote that shit is in the AF?
sihhi said:
I'm not sure that the majority/minority nature of that disagreement has been quite settled, as it doesn't appear to have been voted on. Just discussed. And then used as the basis for AF workshops at a couple of bookfairs. I suspect that it's more likely that there are quite a few privilege/intersectional liberals at one extreme, and quite a few people who know its bullshit at the other, but as the whole argument hasn't been challenged head on, toleration may slowly be becoming acceptance amongst a wider group of AF people than the ones who were first pushing it. The AF's role so far has been as conduit rather than bulwark.
Either way, it's worth noting that many of the Brit-twitter people who loudly embrace this stuff and who are feuding with their fellow liberals in the commentariat seem to identify themselves as "anarchists", and more tellingly as "class struggle anarchists". Take for example, the blogger I linked to a page or two back.
SpineyNorman
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What you describe here isn't a 'progressive stack' - it's 'chairing a meeting' and 'common sense'.
DrRingDing
'anti-human wanker'
I know
Casually Red
tomorrow belongs to me
i was suspicious of them before but im resolved never to go to one now.
Ive no idea what the human gramaphone thing is..what is it
cesare
shady's dreams ♥
Apols for wiki link http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Progressive_stack
It's what Sihhi was talking about a couple of pages back
DrRingDing
'anti-human wanker'
Out of curiosity what meetings do you attend ?
sihhi
Tyranny, like hell, is not easily conquered
AF Scotland - AF has a very federal approach - one region can be saying or approaching things fairly differently compared to another region. It's been written in the wake of the sexual assault from/in Occupy Glasgow at night.
SpineyNorman
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Rather large potential for mis-interpreting leftists as oppositional, I'd say?
Don't you
?
I can see this causing confusion. If a bunch of fash came in and started sieg heiling people would just think they wanted to speak. Fortunately the progressive stack would prevent it. Unless they were Turkish fash or something, in which case the floor would immediately be theirs.
DrRingDing
'anti-human wanker'
These are all different things you've bunched together. I haven't got any interest in Occupy.
cesare
shady's dreams ♥
The Women's Caucus is all in AF Scotland?
SpineyNorman
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I dunno but if it's anything like the human centipede they can fucking count me out
sihhi
Tyranny, like hell, is not easily conquered
Poor agenda making - common mistake in meetings.
Casually Red
tomorrow belongs to me
its only a minority of people who even want to say things at meetings anyway, most just want to listen . If your attracting the right calibre of participant then a lot of problems dont even arise to begin with . And if your not then wanky hand gestures arent going to solve your internal problems, theyre a lot more deep rooted .
I too would scorn to attend any such meeting.
I imagine most people feel similarly.
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