Alex Callinicos/SWP vs Laurie Penny/New Statesman Facebook handbags

[Cornetto]

If I had the stamina, I would do a whole post about experiences of UCU in further education how they even managed to fuck up strike leaflets by sending them to the wrong college site. Then union-internally disciplining me for arguing with a heap of security guards who are being bullying idiots and infringing a strikebreaker UCU member with a leaflet tossed on his pocketed arms.
UCU is an elaborate joke in FE (and I've been told in prison education too) - it can't expel its strikebreakers and still has to have them as members. It has zero interest or support in accepting agency workers on the same building as college branch members. Theoretically they have to set up their own branch and join that branch because they've got a different employer and unit.
It functions using a quasi-full timer model - convenors with extensive facility time - to do acres and acres of casework or listening to management meetings, but because they see themselves as teaching for X hours (subtracting the facility time), they pretend like they are agency hours, who also work X hours (on no holiday pay, no benefits, no Teachers Pension Scheme etc etc) and talk about how terrible cuts are. They try to dampen action against teachers being suspended or investigated for bullshit. They always oppose strike action during 'critical' exams time - the only time that matters - etc. I don't know too much about the behind the scenes university world.

UCU that I am discussing is the local organisation, not the centralized turds we pay to beat us.FE is different to my experience; some good local FE examples include Barnsley college going out to get a union sec reinstated and winning some concessions in the redundancy period, Leeds College Of Art is rebuilding from nothing and close to getting recognition. All the good stuff comes from local activity and patient hard work over time. In the HE world the pre 1992 universities are more conservative and the Post 1992 more militant in organising, we come together through UCU left and have had some significant national and local victories, my favourite this year was taking the scalp of the Blairite national chair at congress, calling for a no confidence vote on his partisan behaviour, they ignored a floor vote, lied, we demanded a recount they lost, all before a strike vote – which we subsequently won across pre and post 1992 uni’s. The larger group of delegates were exposed to the lies and bad behaviour of Labour party ghouls. Regarding strike action over exam times, most of my colleagues are against this, so I do not think full timers are out of sync with HE academics. We are building a trade union culture from the ashes of white collar professional associations. The post 1992 are better IME as lots of the staff come from industry and have experience of unionism outside the academic bubble. I don’t think I would ever recommend on counting on the central org to support militant action they have to punished and forced into a corner. Timid creatures one and all.

 

[sihhi]

UCU that I am discussing is the local organisation, not the centralized turds we pay to beat us.FE is different to my experience; some good local FE examples include Barnsley college going out to get a union sec reinstated and winning some concessions in the redundancy period, Leeds College Of Art is rebuilding from nothing and close to getting recognition. All the good stuff comes from local activity and patient hard work over time. In the HE world the pre 1992 universities are more conservative and the Post 1992 more militant in organising, we come together through UCU left and have had some significant national and local victories, my favourite this year was taking the scalp of the Blairite national chair at congress, calling for a no confidence vote on his partisan behaviour, they ignored a floor vote, lied, we demanded a recount they lost, all before a strike vote – which we subsequently won across pre and post 1992 uni’s. The larger group of delegates were exposed to the lies and bad behaviour of Labour party ghouls. Regarding strike action over exam times, most of my colleagues are against this, so I do not think full timers are out of sync with HE academics. We are building a trade union culture from the ashes of white collar professional associations. The post 1992 are better IME as lots of the staff come from industry and have experience of unionism outside the academic bubble. I don’t think I would ever recommend on counting on the central org to support militant action they have to punished and forced into a corner. Timid creatures one and all.

I agree with the local activity and patient work. No one new in FE in most subjects unionises as a matter of course.
It takes time to unionise even one member - about 4-6 proper conversations on average, but then pop older members saying stuff like 'you work so few hours anyway, it's up to you whether you bother, no one will hold it against you of you don't'

Do you actually respect UCU Left? I was a silent UCU Left member - it seemed entirely fixated upon capturing UCU leadership positions rather than creating an alert and active base to impose a no pay cuts, no job cuts philosophy onto whoever is on the union executive. It's all too easy for people to get gobbled up. Now I've seen it happen, it's like I have grudging respect to the cult-like ICC for being right.
2 convenor and chairs from UCU Left have supported the taking of voluntary redundancies. 'It's their choice, they can if they want to, we shouldn't tell people not to'.

 

[Cornetto]

I think they have done both in my experience, UCU left have got people on NEC and built as much rank n file support as possible this was seen in the HE congress in Manchester in 2012. I don't think it's either or in my experience. We are a majority UCU left Branch committee at my work, we have a union density of 600+ out of 750-800 FTE (give or take severance etc.), with a good density we are building rank n file we have reps in each academic area and have got all local faculty consultative committees covered; we also have senior reps at the joint consultative committee with the corporate management team. We have 10 active case workers that make up the central organising body, we have won a few local disputes; One key local dispute was defence of precarious staff members, we managed to recruit disability support worker as academic related staff and had a key UCU left comrade working as one, over two years he unionised part time low paid staff, defended conditions and successfully stopped with his members the outsourcing of the disability support service to the private sector, this was done constructively by responding to management concerns with the expert knowledge of rank n file staff. Without UCU left this would not have happened as Unison who has the collective agreement for support staff would have rolled over IMO. the next stage is rolling out union advice drop ins and having weekly visible campaign stall on both sites, which we are doing this week, all of this is been driven by UCU left members. I like UCU Left and will continue to work with them in the future. The UCU Left support network across my city is good within HE and limited in FE. Regarding voluntary severance we had a round with the average lecturer with 10 years in leaving with 30k and a lot of that been tax free, a lot of people took it, they had other jobs or went back into practice. I publicly did not offer any support for it or offer advice on the process to members, personally I could see why they took it and why it was right for them. Politically I am in the role of defending jobs not losing them, as is UCU Left.

 

[Random]

Use paragraphs when you switch from snappy one liners to fullspeeddazpower

 

[sihhi]

Regarding voluntary severance we had a round with the average lecturer with 10 years in leaving with 30k and a lot of that been tax free, a lot of people took it, they had other jobs or went back into practice. I publicly did not offer any support for it or offer advice on the process to members, personally I could see why they took it and why it was right for them. Politically I am in the role of defending jobs not losing them, as is UCU Left.

I guess we disagree then. I argued along with about 4 other lay members that the Branch Cttee - all UCU Left or UCU Left supportive (I think most colleges in London are) should oppose voluntary redundancies, publicly call on all members to reject voluntary redunancies and force them to push out non-union kept staff or engage a larger battle ... 'defending 80 jobs' motivates beyond 'defending 12 jobs (68 have taken voluntary redundancy)'.​

 

[Cornetto]

​

​

I guess we disagree then. I argued along with about 4 other lay members that the Branch Cttee - all UCU Left or UCU Left supportive (I think most colleges in London are) should oppose voluntary redundancies, publicly call on all members to reject voluntary redunancies and force them to push out non-union kept staff or engage a larger battle ... 'defending 80 jobs' motivates beyond 'defending 12 jobs (68 have taken voluntary redundancy)'. ​

I don't think we disagree entirely, the political message was that 'we oppose voluntary severance at work and as a local UCU branch we do not recommend that members take it'. Would i want to run a campaign that would see members not get between 10-30k and an exit if they want it, you have to be pragmatic; would a local dispute on this win, i don't think so, and you would lose credibility by making 'custeristic' demands that lead members into a blatant defeat with HR. The voluntaries were the tip of the iceberg and i am expecting a big cull in the next 18 months, this is where the line in the sand will be drawn. This is when people will have to stick together when the forced HR axe man swings.

edit - we won a local forced redundancy challenge around 2008-09 at our sister pre 1992 university.

 

[sihhi]

I don't think we disagree entirely, the political message was that 'we oppose voluntary severance at work and as a local UCU branch we do not recommend that members take it'. Would i want to run a campaign that would see members not get between 10-30k and an exit if they want it, you have to be pragmatic; would a local dispute on this win, i don't think so, and you would lose credibility by making 'custeristic' demands that lead members into a blatant defeat with HR. The voluntaries were the tip of the iceberg and i am expecting a big cull in the next 18 months, this is here the line in the sand will be drawn. This is when people will have to stick together when the forced HR axe man swings.

We do disagree a bit though. I would oppose any voluntary redundancy package. I wouldn't argue for more redundancy pay, and I wouldn't present higher voluntary redundancy as a good thing, they're a dangerous and divisive thing.

No offence to you, but to those locked out of paid employment in the FE sector, 'the future battles are coming' makes the union as a whole out of touch with those pushed into doing voluntary teaching... qualified volunteer ESOL, qualified volunteer IT teachers at charities at semi-funded projects, qualified volunteer-taught courses in childminding. How come people like us cannot find paid work it's in part because the union has colluded in accepting the closure of posts. The whole thing is a precarious sector - it's unnecessary and unneeded. Supported learning (education for the severely disabled, non-mobile severe epileptics...) cut hard due to voluntary redundancies because it's not a funding-productive sector.
Plus the UCU just supports the government increasing the measures and goalposts for imposing more necessary bull qualifications. It is skewed towards the middle-aged, made-it and likely to make it teacher that professional ethos thing you mentioned. I think professionalism as an idea is a weakness - you're brain worker that's it - perhaps it's an advantage in HE.

UCU, like lots of unions, is fixated on credibility, but credibility diminishes as the rapid U-turns increase (deal 1 is terrible, deal 2 three months later hardly any different is excellent). I'm crap at lying to managers I just try to avoid them as much as possible, hence I was no good for a Committee post, because Committee is expected to meet with managers - and it's give and take over productivity if you can ensure grade 1s on the next ofsted inspection trial run, then the dept will be in better shape. At least you are more upfront in general, admiting 'the workplace is no place for radical action' so I respect you for that. Were you from Dewsbury/Batley? I can't remember.

 

[Cornetto]

No union officer in my area argued for more redundancy pay or voluntary redundancy, Your argument with voluntary redundancy is pissing in the wind, no one would go out on strike to defend people who want to leave with a package.

I do not work in FE so do not understand your issues in their entirity, I am talking from a post 1992 HE perspective. You are either creating a 'straw man' argument with me at worst or are tring to confuse my role as a lay elected official with the beareaucratic decisions made by full time officers/union organisers.. I dont know where you got professionalism argument from? i was referring to post 1992 lecturers having a vocational background and union experience outside HE, nothing to do with professionalisation, most of my colleagues are well aware of the prole status as all responsibilty has been centralised and lot of work deskilled.

My future battles (this is my perspective not a UCU one) at work in my sector are not yours, unions are built in sections, while we work in the same sector Education we are at different points. I predict the end game will be the same casualisation of HE as happened in FE but on a more US model (tenure track).

It seems you want a level of pure revoloutionary unionism that is quite simply not happening at the moment, i will take what i can get and deliver what members are prepared to do and live in hope we will collectively grow a spine and start kicking back.

edit.I'm from Batley, I live in Bradford. I think we are arguing over and around each other, classic internet monologues/near misses, lol.

 

[Spanky Longhorn]

It seems you want a level of pure revoloutionary unionism that is quite simply not happening at the moment, i will take what i can get and deliver what members are prepared to do and live in hope we will collectively grow a spine and start kicking back.

The nub of it, when we don't live in revolutionary times what do we do?

We do what we can to

get the best deals possible for workers where we can

do the best to build self confidence where we can - through patient work and the odd small victory

 

[Cornetto]

as the great LLETSA sighed 'that's the way it is suckers'.

 

[smokedout]

I don't click on this thread to read a load of boring union internal politics

 

[Cornetto]

avert your eyes

 

[cesare]

I don't click on this thread to read a load of boring union internal politics

I do How else would I get to hear of them apart from examples of how members feel about their unions?

 

[cesare]

Especially since we* allowed the TUC thread to get halted because a full timer threw a hissy fit.





* yes, me too.

 

[Spanky Longhorn]

Especially since we* allowed the TUC thread to get halted because a full timer threw a hissy fit.





* yes, me too.

smokedout isn't interested in working class organisation though

 

[cesare]

smokedout isn't interested in woring class organisation though

Isn't he? He turns up for Workfare protests etc. or have I missed summat?

 

[Spanky Longhorn]

Isn't he? He turns up for Workfare protests etc. or have I missed summat?

fair enough I've just always assumed he is some anti organisation liberal type from his posts and shitty blog

 

[cesare]

fair enough I've just always assumed he is some anti organisation liberal type from his posts and shitty blog

I haven't met him personally. His posts have changed quite a bit over the past couple of years, def different from before I took a break for a while and now. Maybe that says more about me

 

[smokedout]

smokedout isn't interested in working class organisation though

oh really

 

[smokedout]

smokedout isn't interested in working class organisation though

if you think bludgeoning internal political discussions about an academic union into the light relief thread has anything to do with forwarding working class organisation than no wonder we're so fucked

 

[cesare]

It wasn't deliberate though, smoked out. Daz got asked some questions on his return, which set the scene for a while. Not bludgeoning

 

[smokedout]

give the fuckers an inch and it'll be lectures at half-time and alfie moon ranting on about post structural marxism from the bar of the queen vic

 

[cesare]

give the fuckers an inch and it'll be lectures at half-time and alfie moon ranting on about post structural marxism from the bar of the queen vic

Heheheh

 

[Random]

The nub of it, when we don't live in revolutionary times what do we do?

We do what we can to

get the best deals possible for workers where we can

do the best to build self confidence where we can - through patient work and the odd small victory

Also worth remembering that there's no clear-cut divide between "revolutionary times" and "times of social peace". There's a constant conflict that often breaks beyond the control of current institutions. So union reps who believe in radical change have to be ready to tear up the rule book and support action that goes beyond standard practice and even breaks the law. Even if that means sacrificng a chance to do more "patient work".

 

[Cornetto]

I'm would throw a wildcat at any opportunity, however me sitting outside like Brian Haw would just be entertainment 'Broomsticks, arses and higher education'.

 

[cesare]

I'm would throw a wildcat at any opportunity, however me sitting outside like Brian Haw would just be entertainment 'Broomsticks, arses and higher education'.

I love your interpretation of breaking the law

Sitting outside.

 

[Cornetto]

on the utter edge of mediocrity

 

[Random]

on the utter edge of mediocrity

It's called approaching middle age. It doesn't mean the historical chances of major social change have altered.

 

[cesare]

on the utter edge of mediocrity

Utterly, utterly rad.

 

[cesare]

Mind you, I wonder how long Ms Penny could hack sitting outside.