These Iraq threads have been informative, well done to Mr.Gunther and the participants.
The question:
Did invaders plan all the chaos? As I mentioned in post 9 ‘Its convenient for the oilmen that Iraq is a mess of internal fighting. That this 'nation' could hardly be expected to opppose this is possibly what gave the whole damn invasion its feasability.’
In these and the related threads, it tells its own story. We had Dastardly Dick rubbing his hands and slavering at the Iraq oil fields as far back as 1999.
You have this clique of oil men with Dick being pretty much the boss. These Straussian band of brothers. This is the heart of Neo Con philosophy-
The was a thread some time ago in which I summarized Straussianism a bit more thouroughly. The thread was called
‘Do you think Bush/Blair would do it again?’
‘I think a lot of these power guys couldn't give a shit about public opinion or dead Iraqi's. THeir motivations and capacity for shadiness are far far beyond the comprehension of the general public.
When you consider the heart of Neo -Con philosophy are the teachings of LEO STRAUSS, you start to understand that they have no qualms at all about lying to us.
The Neo Cons spawned from, from Chicago University. Where Strauss was a Proffessor.
Wiki:
‘
Strauss noted that thinkers of the first rank, going back to Plato, had raised the problem of whether good and effective politicians could be completely truthful and still achieve the necessary ends of their society. By implication, Strauss asks his readers to consider whether "noble lies" have any role at all to play in uniting and guiding the polis.'
Two of the founders of Neo Conservatism, Paul Wolfowitz and William Kristol are students of Strauss. The documentary ‘ the Power of Nightmares’ (google video), discussess his influence.
David Dissident ( post 5 ) Byzantian is right, Machievelian also is a good term to describe these men.
The philosophy basically boils down to one of elitism, that the masses must be controlled. If they are they are to be lied to, or terrorised and manipulated, this is justifiable in their view.’
Now, given that they apparently do in fact lie and terrorise the populace without shame or conscience indicates to me that they are well capable of this armed robbery of Iraq. The motives and intents are there.
Then we have this unprecedented profit for the western oil giants.
To me, it speaks for itself.
It was sophisticatedly done. All the costs and benefits would have been analysed, a thorough feasibility study completed. At heart who can deny that this was a business venture.
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Here is an interesting excerpt from an article in the
Liverpool Times:
link
Regarding the execution of Saddam on Eid:
‘Make no mistake, this wicked barbaric execution is something that America sought.
For many Arabs this execution, with the howling mob on a Holy day is a terrible insult and a humiliating event... Saddams death also sees an end to the secular tradition of Arab leaders as the power bases shift to Islamic based alliances. We’ve swapped a secular Iraq for one in which the secular intellectuals are being slaughtered or culled.
It is a reversal of the aim during WW2 when we fought a nation which had invaded the land of another nation. Now, in a turn of events, we have become the invaders just like the Nazis once were. British soldiers are risking life and limb to help the Shia dominated Iraqi Interior Ministry who command death squads that outdo the horror that took place under Saddams presidency.
Saddam died aged 69 yrs old. He lived through three years of captivity and was given a few moments notice before being marched up to the gallows just as dozens of other poor unfortunates have been since the toppling of the Baathist regime. He faced a baying mob of thugs and never broke, telling them that they had ‘no manhood’ and ‘no bravery’.
This was no Nuremberg trial, it was a lynch mob... They hoped to see Saddam cry and broadcast that final indignity to the world, finishing the image he created for himself as a tough Arab leader who would not flinch. But the video will merely endorse the legend which will grow in the years to come. Saddam will be known as the man who faced the gallows with some semblance of honour. He showed courage in the face of certain death.
Many of the men hung since the invasion, were broadcast on Iraqi TV, making confessions after being tortured and given a script to read from. The Iraqi Interior Ministry was funded by the USA to broadcast these shows which also featured allegations against named Sunni clerics. (some of whom have since been killed) The shows were attempts to stir up sectarian hatred and humiliate people on live TV.
Some might say that Saddam suffered the fate that he had forced many others to go through, but such sentiments are merely an extension of saying that we ought to take an eye for an eye.
Under Christian laws or moral codes, there is no such instruction to commit murder when you consider that the Ten Commandments, one of which strictly states ‘Thou shall not kill’, are the final words on such matters. Killing an adversary who might be about to kill you or some innocent party, is a different matter. Killing them after the fact is murder plain and simple. For this reason, you can be assured that neither Blair or Bush are Christians.
We hope all Muslim nations and the USA abolish this barbaric practice of the death penalty. America in particular spoils the Christian record of having carefully rid most Christian nations of such grim practices.
The final word goes to an Iraqi academic, who sums up the Iraqi plummet into chaos as follows….
“In the moment of dramatic collapse of Baath regime at April 2003, a promising civil progressive movement begun to develop, aiming at restoring liberty, justice and civil rights, especially inside universities and other cultural institutions. But the Americans started immediately, continuously till now, to block that rational stream, by adopting the following policy:
• 1) Encouraging leaders of religious groups and parties (from different sects) to be influential politicians, regardless of their ignorance, selfishness and closed minds; in parallel with dismissing secular trends (liberals, socialists, technocrats …).
• 2) Fabricating terrorism inside Iraq (religious terrorism has no roots in our enlightened Iraqi society, even among religious groups). The Americans gave green light to the governments of Iran, Syria, Saudi Arabia to export thousands of brainwashed “terrorists” who do not have any idea about social and intellectual fabric of the Iraqi society.
• 3) Doing nothing to stop (if not involving in) the planned assassinations of brilliant doctors and academics.
• 4) Fabricating continuous crises of severe shortages in electricity power, water supply, and fuel.”