Young woman murdered in Argoed, attacker killed by police taser

[Spymaster]

It says a lone female officer was sent to the scene but not that she had discharged the taser.

UPDATE: 5.17pm
Police confirmed that the officer who first came to the scene and tasered Matthew Williams was a woman officer.

http://www.southwalesargus.co.uk/ne...d_murder_probe_continues_as_two_die_in_hotel/

 

[8ball]

Very sad if it's true that they let him out without his meds.

 

[Citizen66]

Ah, the old "police confirmed" chestnut.

It doesn't mention whether she was alone or not when the taser was discharged like your earlier posts suggest.

I can find many reports stating "officers attended the scene", for example.

 

[Citizen66]

When police reached the Sirhowy Arms Hotel in the village of Argoed they fired a Taser to subdue the suspect. He became unresponsive and, despite efforts by police officers and paramedics to revive him, died. Police have not named the man but he has been identified locally as Matthew Williams.

http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/nov/06/woman-murdered-taser-welsh-valleys-argoed-village

So for some reason the narrative has changed.

 

[Spymaster]

So for some reason the narrative has changed.

It hasn't changed much, tbf, and the reports are likely to become more accurate as the information rolls out. They've repeated the lone female officer thing since.

Gwent Police said a lone female officer initially responded to the attack.

Ch Insp Paul Staniforth told reporters on Friday Ms Yemm's family is being supported by officers.

He also said the female officer and others who later attended were being supported by the force's occupational health department.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-south-east-wales-29957977

I suppose it's possible that the first officer on the scene didn't fire the taser but in other reports they seem to say she did. Seems like a pointless thing to lie about.

 

[Citizen66]

It's possible that the first officer on the scene was alone and female and awaited back-up to arrive (unless she either carries a taser to a routine call out or it wasn't a routine call out and they just sent her alone anyway) before being handed the taser and firing it.

Which rather smacks in the face of her being 'traumatised' by the scene that greeted her.

 

[Citizen66]

And what's the officer's gender got to do with it anyway?

 

[Spymaster]

It's possible that the first officer on the scene was alone and female and awaited back-up to arrive (unless she either carries a taser to a routine call out or it wasn't a routine call out and they just sent her alone anyway) before being handed the taser and firing it.

It's possible that she tasered him whilst singing Danny Boy with her thumb up her arse.

But that's not what's being reported.

There's nothing unusual about coppers carrying tasers. I saw one last week buying his lunch in Tesco.

 

[Citizen66]

It's possible that she tasered him whilst singing Danny Boy with her thumb up her arse.

But that's not what's being reported.

That might as well be what's being reported. You'd readily buy it for starters.

 

[Spymaster]

That might as well be what's being reported. You'd readily buy it for starters.

Yep. I keep forgetting; any reporting that does not immediately and automatically assume evil intention on the part of plod must be considered lies and misinformation.

Must. Try. To. Remember.

 

[8ball]

That might as well be what's being reported. You'd readily buy it for starters.

Ok, so what can we infer from what isn't being reported?

 

[Spymaster]

Ok, so what can we infer from what isn't being reported?

I reckon the only account that C66 would accept is the one he'd write himself, with multiple coppers overpowering the poor cannibal before tying him up and killing him with massive taser badness for a laugh, then swearing a blood oath never to tell.

 

[8ball]

I reckon the only account that C66 would accept is the one he'd write himself, with multiple coppers overpowering the poor cannibal before tying him up and killing him with massive taser badness for a laugh, then swearing a blood oath never to tell.

Only he's not a cannibal, he's trying to save a burning orphanage.

 

[Spymaster]

Only he's not a cannibal, he's trying to save a burning orphanage.

From which the police use the kids as a food source.

 

[Ax^]

Ah, ok, re-reading your post I see what you mean.

That is not my position.

Of course there should be an investigation. There should be (and is) an investigation whenever someone is killed by the police, but no trial unless some wrongdoing or incompetence is found.

Aye he was eating an eyeball not getting shot twice and throwing the gun 40 foot away

 

[xenon]

That might as well be what's being reported. You'd readily buy it for starters.

It's okay, you can write your own version if you like. That's the beauty of debating without the full facts.

 

[xenon]

I reckon the only account that C66 would accept is the one he'd write himself, with multiple coppers overpowering the poor cannibal before tying him up and killing him with massive taser badness for a laugh, then swearing a blood oath never to tell.

Shit I'm agreeing with you again. Somebody tazr me

 

[Citizen66]

So some reports state multiple officers arriving at the scene and others state a lone female officer arriving at the scene. Which is it?

Do you concede that one report must be lying whilst the other is telling the truth or can it all be considered facts? Because the central plank to your argument has been to trust the word of the police via media reports which so far seems as clear as mud.

 

[Spymaster]

One's certainly incorrect but I don't think they're necessarily lying. The reports that mention "officers" seem to be the earliest ones, so more likely is that the journalists have made the understandable assumption that two or more coppers pitched up initially and have gone with "officers" rather than "lone police woman" which would have required specific information which they didn't have at the time.

I don't know why you're clinging to this though. Even if you were right it wouldn't bolster your position.

 

[Citizen66]

It relates back to the earlier discussion of the police having these powers and also lying when it comes to fatalities at their hands. You appear to accept the media reports wholesale but from where I'm sitting there's conflicting accounts of what happened, the propensity of the media to put their own spin on things and then your theory that it's all some genuine mistake despite Hillsborough and Tomlinson proving the police lie through their teeth and the elements within the media collaborate with them. I'm sure you were quick to theorise on those occasions too.

 

[Citizen66]

If the media can't even get the facts straight its untenable to construct your position on what's being reported.

 

[Spymaster]

If the media can't even get the facts straight its untenable to construct your position on what's being reported.

Well the sensible way to look at it would be to examine what's presented, by whom, how, and when. So far it seems eminently plausible that the policewoman turned up alone, found Williams eating Cerys, tasered him, and he died soon after, possibly because of years of drug abuse. Despite being asked several times you haven't even suggested a possible ACAB alternative.

I'll help you out: It's possible that several police arrived at the scene and nicked Williams. He's taken into custody alive and well. He is then mistreated in the nick by taser torture which causes his death. The police then get together and fabricate the "lone woman" story, despite it being dangerously refutable by possible eye witnesses, presumably because as a lone female officer she could reasonably use more lethal force than a gang of hairy-arsed, 6ft coppers. They then sprinkle the crime scene with taser tags and say he was tasered there rather than the nick.

How's that, like it better?

 

[Citizen66]

So your argument against me suggesting the facts aren't clear is that I should make some facts up myself (with your help if need be)?

Brilliant.

 

[Spymaster]

So your argument against me suggesting the facts aren't clear is that I should make some facts up myself (with your help if need be)?

Brilliant.

Well it's what you did last night at post #156!

I thought my effort was pretty good.

 

[Citizen66]

Well it further illustrates that we need more facts. Sending a lone officer to a routine call out armed with a taser seems bizarre to me but maybe that's standard police practice.

 

[Citizen66]

This report states that it was security who were first on the scene who then alerted the police. No mention of a lone female officer making the discovery:

Security staff at the hotel burst into the room when Williams refused to let them in and they found him "eating her to death".

Horrified staff called police who hit Williams with the high voltage taser knocking him to the floor.



Read more: http://www.southwales-eveningpost.c...tory-24329901-detail/story.html#ixzz3IkfvHUDi

 

[Spymaster]

This report states that it was security who were first on the scene who then alerted the police. No mention of a lone female officer making the discovery:

Well of course she didn't "make the discovery". Someone would have had to call the old bill unless they had an officer on patrol in Williams' bedroom.

Mandy Miles said Matthew Williams, who killed 22-year-old Cerys Yemm, was covered in blood and had “black eyes” while his victim had terrible facial injuries. She said: “I can still see the amount of blood and the stillness of her, there were no signs of life at that point. I said to Matthew: “Do you know what you’re doing to that girl?”. He said: ‘That’s no girl.’”

Miles claimed Williams did not recognise her – or what he was doing.

After realising that Yemm was dead, Miles said she closed the door and held the knob so Williams could not flee while she waited for police.

A lone female officer was the first on the scene. Miles died after being shot at with a Taser.

http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/...rder-wales-hostel-matthew-williams-cerys-yemm

Unless there's far more to this than we're being told that last sentence should probably read "Williams died after being shot at with a taser". Good old Guardian.

 

[Citizen66]

So when the female officer arrived on the scene she probably knew what to expect. And knowing what to expect I seriously doubt she was sent there alone.

 

[Spymaster]

Ok, whatever. Chances are she didn't know exactly what to expect and was told to "investigate a disturbance" or "a man attacking a woman", or several coppers were alerted but she arrived first.

There are now multiple reports saying that she arrived first and alone.

 

[8ball]

There are now multiple reports saying that she arrived first and alone.

Yeah, seems there are a few of those. That doesn't mean she was sent alone, just that she arrived first. Maybe she was on doughnut duty and hence closer to the scene.