Why the Lib Dems are great

[butchersapron]

Public spending has caused the Sovereign debt crisis, a big chunk of that was on trying to prop up a failing banking system but also spending was high before the crisis hit. We started with a bigger deficit then places like Germany that have been better able to weather the storm.

Level of debt is only one aspect, previous period of high debt have been with low fixed interest in the form of US War Bonds. Our current debt is largely on the international bond markets and as such vulnerable to the sovereign debt crisis that has swept the Eurozone.

There is no sovereign debt crisis. Don't expect people to fall for that just because you have.

 

[Louis MacNeice]

Public spending has caused the Sovereign debt crisis, a big chunk of that was on trying to prop up a failing banking system but also spending was high before the crisis hit. We started with a bigger deficit then places like Germany that have been better able to weather the storm.

Level of debt is only one aspect, previous period of high debt have been with low fixed interest in the form of US War Bonds. Our current debt is largely on the international bond markets and as such vulnerable to the sovereign debt crisis that has swept the Eurozone.

Repeating a lie doesn't make it any less of a lie.

Let's hear what you've got to say about the attack on social/council housing.

Louis MacNeice

 

[Streathamite]

Public spending has caused the Sovereign debt crisis, a big chunk of that was on trying to prop up a failing banking system but also spending was high before the crisis hit. We started with a bigger deficit then places like Germany that have been better able to weather the storm.

Level of debt is only one aspect, previous period of high debt have been with low fixed interest in the form of US War Bonds. Our current debt is largely on the international bond markets and as such vulnerable to the sovereign debt crisis that has swept the Eurozone.

our spending was NOT excessively high before your banker mates dropped us in it, and we did NOT start with a bigger deficit than Germany, and it is not a major problem.
And the whole fucking point about covering debts with bonds is that sovereign bonds are stable, fluctuation immune, long term...and, for countries like the UK, low-interest.
people buy them to ballast the portfolio, not to make overnight killings.
Jesus, I know you tories are incurable liars, but I didn't expect you to be financially illiterate as well!

 

[cynet]

moon23 i have never been restricted to one party, this day and age you cant afford to have a one preference, but i didn't like the tories after having 18 years under them and struggling, under Labour i could buy my 2 homes and have work all the time.

I actually voted Lib Dems in last election as there manifesto was fresh and promising, before that i voted Labour, but with Gorden Brown i could only see a washed up, worn out man with no ideas or good policies.

What i now know i would never have voted lib dems as they have proven to be a arse kisser for the awful tory party and Clegg is not just having breakfast with Dave boy Cameron he's chewing on his nag nuts as well.

Most of the country including those voting for tory have just realised what they have done after today and boy they will live to regret it and me will be one of them as i was a lib dem voter.

moon23 wake up and smell the coffee m8, you have been stiched up by a party you support.

 

[Proper Tidy]

Moon, why do you cling to this sinking ship and declare land ahead? Is it because they pay your wages?

You all live in a yellow submarine, a yellow submarine...

 

[i_got_poison]

3 Hours, plenty of time to get to my bunker... Lets remember that new-Labour increased (real) spending by £232bn (53%) in 10 years. The interest , even with these cuts will increase from £44bn to £63bn in 2014. The large cuts in some departments today will be spread over four years, and are also due to the NHS,DFID and schools being protected.

education as a left wing idealogical talking point, shouldn't be so sacrosanct, considering all the silly university courses
\work related training that goes on and the scammers who makes millions off it. it's not as though we're talking
about access to higher education for the under privileged, but that's how the argument will be framed and made on this forum.
education should be cut and regulation for courses like CSCS, CPCS, SIA, PTS etc should be abolished.

 

[Louis MacNeice]

education as a left wing idealogical talking point, shouldn't be so sacrosanct, considering all the silly university courses
\work related training that goes on and the scammers who makes millions off it. it's not as though we're talking
about access to higher education for the under privileged, but that's how the argument will be framed and made on this forum.
education should be cut and regulation for courses like CSCS, CPCS, SIA, PTS etc should be abolished.

Just because you so obviously missed out on a decent education, why wish the same fate on everybody else?

Louis MacNeice

 

[ViolentPanda]

Just because you so obviously missed out on a decent education, why wish the same fate on everybody else?

Louis MacNeice

Harsh, but fair.

 

[ferrelhadley]

Just on BBC New 24 about 5 mintues ago....
Andrew Neil: "What are you doing for the Big Society?"
(paraphrasing from memory) Danny Alexander "I am involved in a lot of things in my constituency, I am chairman of the Strathspey rugby club I am involved in the local cricket club...."
Andrew Neil: "So if we play a lot of sport we are all in the Big Society"

 

[Streathamite]

education as a left wing idealogical talking point, shouldn't be so sacrosanct, considering all the silly university courses
\work related training that goes on and the scammers who makes millions off it. it's not as though we're talking
about access to higher education for the under privileged, but that's how the argument will be framed and made on this forum.
education should be cut and regulation for courses like CSCS, CPCS, SIA, PTS etc should be abolished.

what utter, total bollocks. you've out Moon23ed moon23! Access for the poor and w/c IS the whole point, simply because right now it's disapearing right down the plughole.
and education IS sacrosanct - it shapes a person. I'd love to see vocational training get reformed, ditto some of the saillier courses. But that's not your tory agenda - your right wing agenda is simply

education should be cut

and you are using the rest of it as a pretext.
And the fact your post was such a stream of incoherent, illogical - and badly spelt! - drivel shows a rather pressing need for more education!

 

[editor]

Do you think I should change the thread title to represent the content better?

 

[the button]

Do you think I should change the thread title to represent the content better?

Or just do a merge with the "Why the libdems are shit" thread.

 

[moon23]

education as a left wing idealogical talking point, shouldn't be so sacrosanct, considering all the silly university courses
\work related training that goes on and the scammers who makes millions off it. it's not as though we're talking
about access to higher education for the under privileged, but that's how the argument will be framed and made on this forum.
education should be cut and regulation for courses like CSCS, CPCS, SIA, PTS etc should be abolished.

I think the Browne review and reduction in University funding will wean out some of the sub-quality Universities with their wealth of worthless degrees that do little to improve opportunity and lot’s to saddle young people with debt. It’s no coincidence that 50,000 extra apprentice places are being created.

What you actually need is investment in good primary and secondary education and recognition that a non-academic employment choice does not make you less of a person or an under-achiever. University can then be accessible to those who choose it.

I speak as someone who when working in HE admissions saw many aspiring PhDs knocked back on the basis their degree was not from a top University. These people had essentially been miss-sold a dream that was never going to be achieved.

 

[moon23]

Or just do a merge with the "Why the libdems are shit" thread.

I'd be happy for the thread to be merged and renamed 'Lib Dem Discussion thread'. I started this thread to balance out the overtly politicised naming of the other thread.

 

[Proper Tidy]

How about 'Why the libdems are liberal fucking scum who should be considered enemies of humanity and shot, starting with posho moonface'?

 

[Random]

the overtly politicised naming of the other thread.

"You can't fight here, this is the war room!"

 

[butchersapron]

I'd be happy for the thread to be merged and renamed 'Lib Dem Discussion thread'. I started this thread to balance out the overtly politicised naming of the other thread.

And it still ended up as 'why the lib-dems are shit'. It's because you are shit.

 

[Santino]

How about 'Why the libdems are liberal fucking scum who should be considered enemies of humanity and shot, starting with posho moonface'?

Harsh but fair.


Sorry, that's not right. It's not harsh.

 

[i_got_poison]

I wish they'd increased it more. More housing benefit, more child benefit, more money for schools, more nurses, more social workers.

is there a better example of ultra left narcissism than this?

though the true problem with this statement is the dismissal of the global monetary crisis. which leads me to
wonder, if there wasn't a banking crisis, then there won't be any cuts to public expenditure.
this can be seen in public sector spending going up this year on last year and negligible job losses due to coalition policy.
if the primary cause of the global recession is fiction to some people's way of thinking,
doesn't it follow the consequences are too?

 

[Proper Tidy]

is there a better example of ultra left narcissism than this?

though the true problem with this statement is the dismissal of the global monetary crisis. which leads me to
wonder, if there wasn't a banking crisis, then there won't be any cuts to public expenditure.
this can be seen in public sector spending going up this year on last year and negligible job losses due to coalition policy.
if the primary cause of the global recession is fiction to some people's way of thinking,
doesn't it follow the consequences are too?

Oh, it's a 'global monetary crisis' & 'global recession' now, is it? Here was me thinking it was all because of Brown and the LP. Isn't that the party line?

Moon will be along with his whip for you shortly, poison.

 

[cynet]

I dont care if i never ever see a tory or lib dem again, i hope they all rot in hell.

 

[i_got_poison]

what utter, total bollocks. you've out Moon23ed moon23! Access for the poor and w/c IS the whole point, simply because right now it's disapearing right down the plughole.
and education IS sacrosanct - it shapes a person. I'd love to see vocational training get reformed, ditto some of the saillier courses. But that's not your tory agenda - your right wing agenda is simply and you are using the rest of it as a pretext.
And the fact your post was such a stream of incoherent, illogical - and badly spelt! - drivel shows a rather pressing need for more education!

what would you say to the new labour supporters who voted conservatives\liberal democrats this time around?
at the next elections (after the cuts have been made and there's mass unemployment), what will you say
to those former lib dem\ new labour supporters who elect a tory majority government?

it wouldn't surprise me if for all the rhetoric on here, one or two of the u75's 'red or dead' brigade
hadn't voted for the conservatives at some point in their lives.

 

[Santino]

it wouldn't surprise me if for all the rhetoric on here one or two of the u75 'red or dead' brigade haven't voted for the conservatives at some point in their lives.

It wouldn't surprise you if they hadn't voted Tory. So it WOULD surprise you if they HAD voted Tory. You would be surprised if left-wing people voted Tory. Quick, start a thread about this revelation!

 

[i_got_poison]

It wouldn't surprise you if they hadn't voted Tory. So it WOULD surprise you if they HAD voted Tory. You would be surprised if left-wing people voted Tory. Quick, start a thread about this revelation!

you must live a simple life, when a spelling error jerks you off

 

[Proper Tidy]

Lol, you nugget.

 

[Santino]

pardon me. but is this english?

Damn, it's worse than I thought.

 

[ViolentPanda]

what utter, total bollocks. you've out Moon23ed moon23! Access for the poor and w/c IS the whole point, simply because right now it's disapearing right down the plughole.
and education IS sacrosanct - it shapes a person. I'd love to see vocational training get reformed, ditto some of the saillier courses. But that's not your tory agenda - your right wing agenda is simply "education should be cut" and you are using the rest of it as a pretext.

Vocational training's "reform" doesn't appear to be very reforming, and while the re-classification of some vocational subjects away from the degree route makes sense (using a bachelor's degree as a marker of achievement in a vocational field having been a short-sighted manouvre on the part of the Tories, surprise surprise!), it'll need more than a bit of jiggery-pokery with higher ed and the creation of 50,000 more apprenticeships this parliament to make any reform worthwhile.
All this is doing is re-arranging the deck-chairs so that peter can be robbed to pay Paul. What this "reform" reduces to is a sop to employers, and little or no change to the current cleavages between the classes.

 

[ViolentPanda]

I think the Browne review and reduction in University funding will wean out some of the sub-quality Universities with their wealth of worthless degrees that do little to improve opportunity and lot’s to saddle young people with debt.

Please specify these "sub-quality universities" and quantify their "wealth of worthless degrees". Thanks.

It’s no coincidence that 50,000 extra apprentice places are being created.

What you actually need is investment in good primary and secondary education and recognition that a non-academic employment choice does not make you less of a person or an under-achiever. University can then be accessible to those who choose it.

No, under the Browne reforms, university then only becomes to those that can afford it and/or are not debt-averse.

I speak as someone who when working in HE admissions saw many aspiring PhDs knocked back on the basis their degree was not from a top University. These people had essentially been miss-sold a dream that was never going to be achieved.

Which uni did you work for? I've never known a PhD be turned down because of the university the applicant came from. Plenty because of quality (from "top" universities as well as more mundane ones) but none solely because they didn't go to "a top university".

 

[ViolentPanda]

is there a better example of ultra left narcissism than this?

If you believe that to be "ultra-left", your political compass is even more compromised than you've previously indicated.

though the true problem with this statement is the dismissal of the global monetary crisis...

How does it do that, exactly?

which leads me to wonder, if there wasn't a banking crisis, then there won't be any cuts to public expenditure.
this can be seen in public sector spending going up this year on last year and negligible job losses due to coalition policy. if the primary cause of the global recession is fiction to some people's way of thinking,
doesn't it follow the consequences are too?

You've extrapolated an awful lot of nonsense from your attempt to represent a comment about increasing state welfare as a "dismissal of the global monetary crisis" (itself a narrative construct rather than a physical reality).
Perhaps you should have a lie down, maybe put a cold flannel on your forehead.

 

[ViolentPanda]

Oh, it's a 'global monetary crisis' & 'global recession' now, is it? Here was me thinking it was all because of Brown and the LP. Isn't that the party line?

The narrative switches depending on the requirements of the argument. Today "global" issues, tomorrow "13 years of Labour spending", the day after, "Brown's deregulation".