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What stupid shit has Trump done today?

oh and Trump Jr has released the email thread himself Donald Trump Jr. (@DonaldJTrumpJr) on Twitter. It clearly shows that he was soliciting information from the Russian government, who they knew wanted Trump to win, and shows that other members of the Trump team knew about it. It also clearly shows that Team Trump has been lying through their teeth about Russian involvement in their campaign.

I'm slightly flabbergasted by the dumbness of posting up the email thread, but I guess the apple doesn't fall far from the tree.
 
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The NYT has a story on the email thread, but Trump Jr confirmed it within about 30 mins of it being published. It's been interesting to see how the NYC dripped the full story out over the last 3 or so days, adding more incriminating information each day. It's also been interesting to see Team Trump being caught out with their lies to counter it, like when the first part of the story dropped, it was a meeting to 'discuss adoption rights for Russian nationals'.

I'm wondering how involved is the wider GOP party/election machine, and is this why they've been pushing back on this/doing fuck all about it so much.

*eta* possibly there's more to come from various news outlets and the releasing of the incriminating emails is the least bad move now. Or possibly they've omitted emails from the thread. It seems interesting to release 'print outs' of an email thread. Which obviously obscure the metadata of the emails.
 
The NYT has a story on the email thread, but Trump Jr confirmed it within about 30 mins of it being published. It's been interesting to see how the NYC dripped the full story out over the last 3 or so days, adding more incriminating information each day. It's also been interesting to see Team Trump being caught out with their lies to counter it, like when the first part of the story dropped, it was a meeting to 'discuss adoption rights for Russian nationals'.

I'm wondering how involved is the wider GOP party/election machine, and is this why they've been pushing back on this/doing fuck all about it so much.

*eta* possibly there's more to come from various news outlets and the releasing of the incriminating emails is the least bad move now. Or possibly they've omitted emails from the thread. It seems interesting to release 'print outs' of an email thread. Which obviously obscure the metadata of the emails.
On Trumpcast The Story That Sticks?

A podcast, Anne Applebaum reckons the meeting was probably about the sanctions directed at personally at a handful of Russian oligarchs that the adoption sanctions were retaliations for. These for once were quite effective as they hurt wealthy people not the sometimes malnourished folk the robber boyars only worry about in palatial residence security terms. So this sleekit little move might not be Russian state related just the routine corrupt behaviour you'd expect from a Queens real estate dynasty. Which would explain Don Jr's relative brazenness about it.

I also don't think Trump supporters would really have much of a problem with him seeking dirt on Clinton via Russian security sources. After all Trump very openly appealed for this sort of assistance on the campaign trail. Actually shortly after this meeting. He still got elected so you could say his mandate is unaffected.
 
So the Donald didn't bother popping in to the UK, clearly not worth his time as the special relationship means the UK jumps when it is told to anyway and has little influence anymore nowadays.

image.jpg

"this high Theresa" he tells her :)
 
oh and Trump Jr has released the email thread himself Donald Trump Jr. (@DonaldJTrumpJr) on Twitter. It clearly shows that he was soliciting information from the Russian government, who they knew wanted Trump to win, and shows that other members of the Trump team knew about it. It also clearly shows that Team Trump has been lying through their teeth about Russian involvement in their campaign.

I'm slightly flabbergasted by the dumbness of posting up the email thread, but I guess the apple doesn't fall far from the tree.


 
On Trumpcast The Story That Sticks?

A podcast, Anne Applebaum reckons the meeting was probably about the sanctions directed at personally at a handful of Russian oligarchs that the adoption sanctions were retaliations for. These for once were quite effective as they hurt wealthy people not the sometimes malnourished folk the robber boyars only worry about in palatial residence security terms. So this sleekit little move might not be Russian state related just the routine corrupt behaviour you'd expect from a Queens real estate dynasty. Which would explain Don Jr's relative brazenness about it.

I also don't think Trump supporters would really have much of a problem with him seeking dirt on Clinton via Russian security sources. After all Trump very openly appealed for this sort of assistance on the campaign trail. Actually shortly after this meeting. He still got elected so you could say his mandate is unaffected.

Trump Junior didn't solicit dirt on Clinton. It was he who was approached, and asked it he would be interested in such a disclosure. 'And why not?' as Barry Norman didn't say. But as it turns out there was no 'disclosure'.

And where is the evidence of the involvement of 'Russian security forces'? Is every single Russian a spook now, in the same way that in North Korea is every American is CIA?

Finally if there ever was a covert op by Trump Snr why then would he draw attention to it - publicly ask for Russian assistance- on the campaign trail?

Because I hear his opponents shrill - 'IT WAS A DOUBLE BLUFF!' Such hysteria has the hallmarks of the Ken Starr investigation into the Clintons but this time with CNN/WP playing the role of National Enquirer and Fox News.

The most bizarre thing about it is that liberals think it is they who are winning. At last after nine months of beating the bushes the 'smoking gun'! Hurrah!The level of self-delusion is incredible. Yet self-styled progressives still insist all this is an unwelcome distraction for the Trump administration.

Irritating it may well be, but it is proving a bigger distraction for the Democrats.

Why did they lose the election? Who cares? Lets impeach Trump and our troubles are over. Snobbery, laziness and entitlement are just as explicit are they were in the actual campaign. It cost them the Presidency - and every election since. And yet they are more convinced than ever it is Trump and his supporters who are the slow learners.
 
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Trump Jr. Was Told in Email of Russian Effort to Aid Campaign

Another incremental step. NYT are reporting ' Before arranging a meeting with a Kremlin-connected Russian lawyer he believed would offer him compromising information about Hillary Clinton, Donald Trump Jr. was informed in an email that the material was part of a Russian government effort to aid his father’s candidacy, according to three people with knowledge of the email.'

'Three people' eh? So glad its not the 'single source' that did for CNN recently. Now, if only they'd step forward to be identified everyone could relax.
 
What will it take to get Trump out, if this isn't it? It's unbelievable, really. What do the Republicans make of this?
 
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What will it take to get Trump out, if this isn't it? It's unbelievable, really. What do the Republicans make of this?

To get rid of a President against his will requires a simple majority vote of the House to impeach, and then a two-thirds majority in the Senate to convict. Or there's the 25th Amendment. That's about it really, save something outlandish. In any case it needs serious Republican involvement to legally remove him the way things are.

Most likely, the Mueller investigation goes into prosecution mode in a year or so, hoovering up various connected individuals, there's a Presidential resignation, and President Pence then issues some pardons. The Nixon scenario, basically.
 
View attachment 111186[/QUOTE]

My point is that there as yet not a single item of evidence of collusion. CNN etc keep running with the story on unverifiable sources while demanding full and total disclosure from everyone associated with Trump. There is a drip feed of information from the liberal press. And when Trump team answers in similar piecemeal fashion they are accused of "cover-up" "obstruction of justice" and "treason"!
 
What will it take to get Trump out, if this isn't it? It's unbelievable, really. What do the Republicans make of this?
Well quite.

Once upon a time, if someone senior in a presidential candidate's campaign team, or a close relative, were approached out of the blue by someone saying they were an agent of another country and wanted to provide detrimental information about a rival candidate, I'm pretty sure things would have gone differently. As tempted as the person might be, they'd have to consider that the "foreign agent" was perhaps trying to set them up or planning to blackmail them or the candidate. If word got out about the connection, it would be curtains for their career and potentially jail time, and the candidate would probably be toast by association. To cover their ass, they'd probably go to the authorities and come clean about the approach - perhaps getting brownie points for their honesty.

But it doesn't look like Trump Junior is worried about the risks. By his own account, he wanted dirt on his father's rival and was gutted when the promised info wasn't forthcoming. When he finally was caught out yes, he released a doctored transcript of the correspondence, but didn't apologise or show any regret for poor judgement. His excuse seems to be because he didn't get the compromising information he hoped for, he didn't do anything wrong. :facepalm: Like, "yeah, I broke into the bank and stole a safe I hoped was full of gold, but it was empty when I cracked it, so I'm innocent, me."

Again, in "other times" a revelation like this would have probably led to the immediate arrest of the "senior person" involved and the president would eating massive portions of humble pie, begging forgiveness, pledging to help the investigation and basically anything possible to save their ass. If they know the breadcrumb trail will lead to them, they'd probably resign and hope for a pardon from their VP.

But here and now, I don't get the sense either Trump Junior or Senior are that worried about the consequences. They've broken a swathe of rules and laws since the election, so why worry about comeback now?

This is also assuming Trump Junior's account is accurate, which I doubt given the family track record. Was the approach out of the blue? Was no "compromising" information handed over? There's certainly no way Trump Senior wouldn't have known about the meeting because of his well documented control freakery, and the timing of the meeting and one of his tweets during the campaign last year is "interesting."


upload_2017-7-12_0-39-58.png

Oh, and there are long connections between the Trumps and "go between" Emin Agalarov, mentioned in the emails.

upload_2017-7-12_0-59-32.pngupload_2017-7-12_1-0-22.png

So, what happens next? Is this the final straw in a parade of final straws? Caught red handed, so surely the game is up?

Trump's rich supporters probably would have preferred there'd been no scandal, but so long as they all walk out smelling of roses, it's no biggie. No amount of evidence - even when provided by Don Junior himself, will convince Trump's wider support base that he's done anything wrong. They'll just passively accept whatever explanation they're given by the Trump team and dismiss everything else as "fake news" or "moaning libtards," and mutter something about Clinton's emails (not even realising the irony of that!)

I suspect, sadly, very little will happen. GOP leaders may be embarrassed, but they're not making statements condemning Don Junior. They're staying quiet in hopes it will blow over and be forgotten soon, so they can continue pursuit of their agenda.
 
oh and Trump Jr has released the email thread himself Donald Trump Jr. (@DonaldJTrumpJr) on Twitter. It clearly shows that he was soliciting information from the Russian government, who they knew wanted Trump to win, and shows that other members of the Trump team knew about it. It also clearly shows that Team Trump has been lying through their teeth about Russian involvement in their campaign.

I'm slightly flabbergasted by the dumbness of posting up the email thread, but I guess the apple doesn't fall far from the tree.

Orange.....

If hes tweeted that ...just what has he shredded .....?
 
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So the Donald didn't bother popping in to the UK, clearly not worth his time as the special relationship means the UK jumps when it is told to anyway and has little influence anymore nowadays.

image.jpg

"this high Theresa" he tells her :)
What does your name (1%er) refer to?
 
Well quite.

Once upon a time, if someone senior in a presidential candidate's campaign team, or a close relative, were approached out of the blue by someone saying they were an agent of another country and wanted to provide detrimental information about a rival candidate, I'm pretty sure things would have gone differently. As tempted as the person might be, they'd have to consider that the "foreign agent" was perhaps trying to set them up or planning to blackmail them or the candidate. If word got out about the connection, it would be curtains for their career and potentially jail time, and the candidate would probably be toast by association. To cover their ass, they'd probably go to the authorities and come clean about the approach - perhaps getting brownie points for their honesty.

But it doesn't look like Trump Junior is worried about the risks. By his own account, he wanted dirt on his father's rival and was gutted when the promised info wasn't forthcoming. When he finally was caught out yes, he released a doctored transcript of the correspondence, but didn't apologise or show any regret for poor judgement. His excuse seems to be because he didn't get the compromising information he hoped for, he didn't do anything wrong. :facepalm: Like, "yeah, I broke into the bank and stole a safe I hoped was full of gold, but it was empty when I cracked it, so I'm innocent, me."

Again, in "other times" a revelation like this would have probably led to the immediate arrest of the "senior person" involved and the president would eating massive portions of humble pie, begging forgiveness, pledging to help the investigation and basically anything possible to save their ass. If they know the breadcrumb trail will lead to them, they'd probably resign and hope for a pardon from their VP.

But here and now, I don't get the sense either Trump Junior or Senior are that worried about the consequences. They've broken a swathe of rules and laws since the election, so why worry about comeback now?

This is also assuming Trump Junior's account is accurate, which I doubt given the family track record. Was the approach out of the blue? Was no "compromising" information handed over? There's certainly no way Trump Senior wouldn't have known about the meeting because of his well documented control freakery, and the timing of the meeting and one of his tweets during the campaign last year is "interesting."


View attachment 111189

Oh, and there are long connections between the Trumps and "go between" Emin Agalarov, mentioned in the emails.

View attachment 111190View attachment 111191

So, what happens next? Is this the final straw in a parade of final straws? Caught red handed, so surely the game is up?

Trump's rich supporters probably would have preferred there'd been no scandal, but so long as they all walk out smelling of roses, it's no biggie. No amount of evidence - even when provided by Don Junior himself, will convince Trump's wider support base that he's done anything wrong. They'll just passively accept whatever explanation they're given by the Trump team and dismiss everything else as "fake news" or "moaning libtards," and mutter something about Clinton's emails (not even realising the irony of that!)

I suspect, sadly, very little will happen. GOP leaders may be embarrassed, but they're not making statements condemning Don Junior. They're staying quiet in hopes it will blow over and be forgotten soon, so they can continue pursuit of their agenda.

Here's Emin and right at the very end Trump. Warning contains Miss Universe models...

 
There's a drip feed of information, because I suspect this is going to be one of the biggest scandals in US history, and they've got to ease the general public into the enormity of the situation.

No evidence of collusion is now a risible defence. Not even Hannity and other such Trumpaloons are going with that (they switched to from 'no evidence' to 'is colusion really so bad?' or 'Hillary colluded with the DNC!!!!1111!!!' less than a couple of weeks ago)
 
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Well quite.

Once upon a time, if someone senior in a presidential candidate's campaign team, or a close relative, were approached out of the blue by someone saying they were an agent of another country and wanted to provide detrimental information about a rival candidate, I'm pretty sure things would have gone differently. As tempted as the person might be, they'd have to consider that the "foreign agent" was perhaps trying to set them up or planning to blackmail them or the candidate. If word got out about the connection, it would be curtains for their career and potentially jail time, and the candidate would probably be toast by association. To cover their ass, they'd probably go to the authorities and come clean about the approach - perhaps getting brownie points for their honesty.

And, it seems something not dissimilar DID happen in 2000 involving the Gore campaign. Totally different response.

A confidant of Al Gore received an unsolicited package Wednesday containing documents and a videotape that appeared to involve rival George W. Bush's debate preparations, an aide to Gore said.

Tom Downey, a former congressman who has been helping the vice president prepare for debates against Bush, turned the material over to his lawyer. The lawyer planned to give the package to the FBI to determine whether the documents and tape were "illegally obtained from the Bush campaign," said Gore spokesman Mark Fabiani.

"We got something we shouldn't have and turned it over to the authorities," said Marc Miller, Downey's lawyer.

Fabiani said Gore's staff didn't know whether the package was a hoax or actual Bush campaign material.

Gore campaign chairman William Daley called Bush chairman Don Evans to notify him about the package.

Bush spokesman Ari Fleischer said: "We do not know what the Gore campaign claims to have in their possession, and we would like to review the material. Our attorneys have asked to review it."

However, Downey lawyer Miller said he rejected a request by Bush lawyer Ben Ginsberg to review the materials. "We decided we don't know what it was. The FBI is in a better position to determine what should be done about this," Miller said.

Fabiani said Downey has decided to stop participating in debate preparations.

But interestingly, in 1980, when the Reagan campaign "came upon" top secret briefing papers for President Carter's preparation for the October debate, they chose to use them. Republicans have been scheming bastards for a long time. :mad:
 
given that there's a record of him being warned about Flynn last year, and him doing nothing, and it's hard to believe that he didn't know about the closeness of Team Trump with Russian state/organised crime people seeing as he was on the team from July.
Top Democrat sent letter to Mike Pence in November warning of Michael Flynn's Turkey lobbying
I think he might well be taken down by this. One can only hope. The Dominionist fuck.
We live in hope, but the more time passes, the less confident I am that any of them will get taken down.
 
Trump Junior didn't solicit dirt on Clinton. It was he who was approached, and asked it he would be interested in such a disclosure. 'And why not?' as Barry Norman didn't say. But as it turns out there was no 'disclosure'.

And where is the evidence of the involvement of 'Russian security forces'? Is every single Russian a spook now, in the same way that in North Korea is every American is CIA?

Finally if there ever was a covert op by Trump Snr why then would he draw attention to it - publicly ask for Russian assistance- on the campaign trail?
...
Because Trump really sees nothing wrong with smears from Russian actors he's heard tales of badly damaging an opponent he expected to lose to. And as I said above a lot voters probably agree with him. In this case it may be private sector actors but if you take a look at their background the very wealthy in Russia often do have a security background. Putin's favour and that is what enabled them to get stinking rich. If eagerly attending meetings with a lawyer connected to the very political Katsyv's dynasty and known for opposing the Magnitsky Act promising dirt on Clinton isn't soliciting I don't know what is. You can get done in national security cases for apparent intent alone. It's certainly sleazy and not a little stupid. They make it worse keeping on failing to disclose stuff. It's just Poppy Trump's MO to never to admit to anything. He's an Old Skool NYC "ratfuck" and will just dig an ever deeper hole.

At best the Trump team appears to have behaved in naive ways. The Russians are particularly toxic as there's a long list of recent offences (Crimea, East Aleppo, that airliner, backing the Iranians etc) and many senior GOP people still instinctively hate them. It would have been very stupid to collude with them or even let Russian actors create the appearance of that. I would not put it past some of the Z-list critters involved Trump has hired here. Trump clearly admires Putin. He fondly parrots RT talking points. Vastly wealthy alpha males like Putin appear to create suck up tendencies in him. I actually doubt Trump did collude but he's a chaotic manager and probably wouldn't even know what his people were at. What had to be foreseen was from day one after Trump winning Dem attack machinery was always going to be probing for weaknesses and smearing a GOP incumbent. This is what the GOP did with the Clintons and Obama. US politics isn't the the sort of milquetoast game where the "will of the people" is blandly accepted. For God's sake far more ludicrous attempts to smear the unusually proper Obama's legitimacy were what got Trump started in GOP politics.

Speaking of naive. The other logical lines of operation in the disinformation campaign do have Russian spook finger prints all over them. Again legal standards of proof are not needed in national security matters. Trump is the only senior US official now implausibly denying that the Russians meddled or rather still lamely insisting it might have been somebody else and that nobody know while US security folk say different. Tillerson in that meeting with Putin wasn't even prepared to wave through Russian denials just move on as his boss desperately wants to. The Russians have a lot of form for doing this in this in the past. The techniques used in the US election are exactly what they did elsewhere. The Americans have also meddled in foreign elections but that doesn't mean a US President should ignore the country he is meant to lead (and actually probably himself) being fucked with by an adversarial foreign power. Putin certainly would not bend over for that let alone reward such behaviour. Indeed this well constructed mess may be pay back for prior US behaviour.

Trump provided fairly good grounds for impeachment when he fired Comey and then was daft enough to admit it was over the Russian investigation. When he failed to distance himself from his business interests he opened up lots more avenues. A stench of corrupt use of office wafts off this administration. Trump comes from a particularly easily compromised area of the business world. More and more sleaze is going to emerge in public and he won't be able to aggressively counter sue or settle out of court as he did as a private citizen. Impeachment isn't a legal process it's a political one. It's not like a court trial with a unbiased jury. If the Dems get a majority in Congress in 2018 (big if) Trump faces being judged by peers seeking his downfall. In US history impeachment has really been about blackening a President's name and degrading his ability to act not dispatching him from office. It needs a super majority in the Senate to convict. That seems unlikely as the GOP seem happy just use the entirely unqualified, increasingly wounded Trump to sign bills and promote judges that will mostly further the establishment Republican agenda. That is unless he goes too far in coddling the Russians and GOP Senators start to see that as treachery as some already do. Then it'll be President Pence. Which would perhaps set back beloved liberal culture wars but Pence would not likely be an unpredictable global loose cannon like Trump. A huge geopolitical fuck up waiting to happen. Almost anyone would be better at protecting US interests than the current critter in the Oval Office.
 
Trump Junior didn't solicit dirt on Clinton. It was he who was approached, and asked it he would be interested in such a disclosure. 'And why not?' as Barry Norman didn't say. But as it turns out there was no 'disclosure'.

This is after months and months and denials that there was no meetings or discussions in any way. Now after being shown to be liars about these meetings, we're just supposed to take their word on it.

And where is the evidence of the involvement of 'Russian security forces'? Is every single Russian a spook now, in the same way that in North Korea is every American is CIA?

The fact that she was in the country after visa issues is a bloody big red flag, and she was literally introduced as a Russian Government Lawyer by Trump's "acquaintance"

Finally if there ever was a covert op by Trump Snr why then would he draw attention to it - publicly ask for Russian assistance- on the campaign trail?

Because it's been fairly conclusively proven the man is a complete moron.
 
Why Blue States Should Exit Red America


Dear Red-State Trump Voter,

Let’s face it, guys: We’re done.

For more than 80 years now, we—the residents of what some people like to call Blue America, but which I prefer to think of as the United States of We Pay Our Own Damn Way—have shelled out far more in federal tax monies than we took in. We have funded massive infrastructure projects in your rural counties, subsidized your schools and your power plants and your nursing homes, sent you entire industries, and simultaneously absorbed the most destitute, unskilled, and oppressed portions of your populations, white and black alike.

All of which, it turns out, only left you more bitter, white, and alt-right than ever.
 
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