Transgender is it just me that is totally perplexed?

[pengaleng]

And there was me thinking you'd be impressed, honest.

I was I am just majorly ill and trying to take me mind off it i liked yer post to make up the discrepancy

 

[Pickman's model]

I was I am just majorly ill and trying to take me mind off it

i hope you're feeling better soon you're unusually good-natured today and it's concerning me.

 

[Mation]

Hmmm.

Being able to articulate it and just knowing you are are different though. I know I'm a woman, but would have a hard time describing it. I only know I'm black politically; there's no sense of feeling it (or of denying it or of feeling like any other 'race').

To be clear, I wasn't asking MM to explain themselves to me, just suggesting that they are able to answer the question for themselves.

 

[elbows]

i hope you're feeling better soon you're unusually good-natured today and it's concerning me.

Yeah, get well soon. And dont worry Pickmans, being good-natured is probably only very slightly contagious

 

[MochaSoul]

I believe we can only move forward if we cut out those lying and creating the scare stories in the Tory press. We need balance. We need people to engage their skepticism.

Hardly going to happen while meetings such as the ones organised by A Woman's Place are being wholly misrepresented in Pink News as transphobic. This is nothing but pure and simple misogyny. If the ideology is sound and the risks for women are none what is there to be afraid of. Why are women having to meet in secret?

 

[Magnus McGinty]

You can answer that for yourself. Do you feel male? (I'm assuming from your name that you identify as male, though I know that isn't always the case, username-wise).

How do I know what it’s like to be anyone other than me?

 

[Red Cat]

Sharp.

 

[littlebabyjesus]

How do I know what it’s like to be anyone other than me?

Directly, you can't. Indirectly, you just ask them. So Mation has stated that she has a sense that she is a woman but doesn't have the same kind of sense of being black. Substitute man and white in there and I can tell you that the same thing applies to me. There's two other people about whom you can know something.

 

[Miranda Yardley]

I'm not aware of problems with birth control in Ireland these days. I did grow up when homosexuality was not just illegal but you were schooled that it was "a sin" and you were "going to hell" etc. And of course, there were pharmacies were condoms were sold from under the counter, putting them on display was a no-no.

But that's back in the early 90s.

I *believe* that there has been a pretty wide-reaching reform of the law and that contraceptives are available, but subject to age restrictions, I believe this is 17 in line with the age of consent. I believe there is likely still some cultural resistance to birth control, but as we all know cultures can change.

 

[Mation]

How do I know what it’s like to be anyone other than me?

Good question. I'm not asking you to tell me how you feel about yourself but I am volunteering that I do feel like a woman (as an internal feeling of whatever source and also as political idea) but I don't feel black internally, I just know I am politically. I was suggesting that you could answer the question for yourself of whether what I said about race applies to sex - but this did assume that you feel some gender identity, which of course you might not. My bad. For me it's clear there is a difference because I feel one. And I believe what other people tell me (generally!) about how they feel.

 

[krtek a houby]

I *believe* that there has been a pretty wide-reaching reform of the law and that contraceptives are available, but subject to age restrictions, I believe this is 17 in line with the age of consent. I believe there is likely still some cultural resistance to birth control, but as we all know cultures can change.

Yes, of course. Even in Ireland

The cultural resistance to birth control there is tiny. Gone are these days:

 

[Magnus McGinty]

Good question. I'm not asking you to tell me how you feel about yourself but I am volunteering that I do feel like a woman (as an internal feeling or whatever source and also as political idea) but I don't feel black internally, I just know I am politically. I was suggesting that you could answer the question for yourself of whether what I said about race applies to sex - but this did assume that you feel some gender identity, which of course you might not. My bad. For me it's clear there is a difference because I feel one. And I believe what other people tell me (generally!) about how they feel.

But my gender identity is taught, surely? I don’t have any particular feelings that I identify as being male and it’s difficult to avoid stereotypes when thinking about how to articulate any of it.

 

[MochaSoul]

No risks for women

 

[Pickman's model]

Oh it's the auld only white people can be racist argument (due to power...) in new clothes, a load of auld shite. Fucking unbelievable.

 

[krtek a houby]

No risks for women

That's an extreme and messed up example.

 

[Treacle Toes]

It's clearly a batshit argument. How representative is it though?

 

[MochaSoul]

Oh it's the auld only white people can be racist argument (due to power...) in new clothes, a load of auld shite. Fucking unbelievable.

Black men can never be rapists if they confine themselves to white victims.

 

[Treacle Toes]

Black men can never be rapists if they confine themselves to white victims.

Where have you ever heard this?

 

[Mation]

But my gender identity is taught, surely? I don’t have any particular feelings that I identify as being male and it’s difficult to avoid stereotypes when thinking about how to articulate any of it.

However my gender identity was acquired (through whatever combination of factors), I have one that makes me think and feel I am a woman. My gender expression varies. My racial identity only ever makes me think I am black. I've never heard of anyone who feels intrinsically black, but I have heard of people who aren't me who do feel strongly gendered, both cis and trans, however that feeling was acquired. I am not qualified to tell them they are wrong (in addition to believing them that they are right about themselves).

 

[Pickman's model]

Black men can never be rapists if they confine themselves to white victims.

If I force myself on someone, be I white or brown or blue, I am exerting actual power over them and neither my societal power quotient nor theirs comes into it. Only an utter shitferbrains wankstain would argue otherwise

 

[MochaSoul]

Where have you ever heard this?

That was irony.

 

[krtek a houby]

Black men can never be rapists if they confine themselves to white victims.

Ok, am officially perplexed to the max tonight.

TTFN & WTAF....

 

[littlebabyjesus]

That was irony.

Dangerous game on the internet, as I know to my cost.

 

[Mation]

Oh it's the auld only white people can be racist argument (due to power...) in new clothes, a load of auld shite. Fucking unbelievable.

It's not the same argument. The definition of rape is not predicated on power*, even though power relations are usually involved. Racism is defined as requiring prejudice plus power. I doubt many people would argue that only white people can be prejudiced.

* e2a: collective, rather than 'simply' one individual exerting power over another.

 

[Pickman's model]

It's not the same argument. The definition of rape is not predicated on power, even though power relations are usually involved. Racism is defined as requiring prejudice plus power. I doubt many people would argue that only white people can be prejudiced.

Surely racism is being prejudice, discrimination or antagonism against people of a different race on the basis of a belief in one's race's superiority

 

[Mation]

Surely racism is being prejudice, discrimination or antagonism against people of a different race on the basis of a belief in one's race's superiority

From the position of being a member of the race that holds systemic power over the discriminated against race. Without that, it's 'just' prejudice. Not trivial or unimportant or even necessarily less harmful for individuals, but not racism, if we're going to use words to mean something specific.

 

[smokedout]

Hardly going to happen while meetings such as the ones organised by A Woman's Place are being wholly misrepresented in Pink News as transphobic. This is nothing but pure and simple misogyny. If the ideology is sound and the risks for women are none what is there to be afraid of. Why are women having to meet in secret?

Because the organisation behind that meeting has previously hosted speakers who want to morally mandate transexuality out of existence and ban trans healthcare. As such they might be described as a transphobic organisation, or you at least happy to promote transphobia.

 

[littlebabyjesus]

IRacism is defined as requiring prejudice plus power.

Defined by whom? I think at the very least that this would be disputed as a definition - I reckon a lot of people would define racism simply as prejudice based on race. Otherwise you can quickly get to what Pickman's said - for instance, Nation of Islam is not racist despite believing that white people are devils because of the power relations involved.

 

[Nigel Irritable]

I *believe* that there has been a pretty wide-reaching reform of the law and that contraceptives are available, but subject to age restrictions, I believe this is 17 in line with the age of consent. I believe there is likely still some cultural resistance to birth control, but as we all know cultures can change.

There is no age limit on contraception and there is no cultural resistance to it. The same movement that eventually produced same sex marriage and self ID laws got rid of all Catholic inspired social laws except the abortion ban, which will likely go this year.

The persistence of certain people in this thread in pretending to confuse the question of whether Ireland is particularly progressive with the question of why none of the dreadful consequences TERFs claim will come from self ID have happened in Ireland would be entertainingly stupid if it wasn’t so obviously dishonest.

 

[smokedout]

Hardly going to happen while meetings such as the ones organised by A Woman's Place are being wholly misrepresented in Pink News as transphobic. This is nothing but pure and simple misogyny. If the ideology is sound and the risks for women are none what is there to be afraid of. Why are women having to meet in secret?

Not very secret either given Pink News knew and published the venue in advance.