Tory minister for civil society Brooks Newmark resigns after sex scandal

[Spymaster]

- you can't say they would not have.

You can on a case by case basis.

We can't say that Newmark wouldn't have sent a cock pic to anyone ever, he clearly did. What we can say is that this situation would not have occurred had it not been induced by the journalist.

 

[Spymaster]

ridiculous definition of entrapment

Sorry you don't like it but it's pretty much the generally accepted one.

your suggestion would mean that asking a politician if he is a money-laundering, people-trafficing nonce should not be allowed because in answering the question he might make an admission that he would otherwise not have made.

Er, no.

There's a difference between asking someone if he's done something and causing him to do something isn't there?

 

[butchersapron]

You can on a case by case basis.

We can't say that Newmark wouldn't have sent a cock pic to anyone ever, he clearly did. What we can say is that this situation would not have occurred had it not been induced by the journalist.

No you can't - not on any basis at all. That's why it's not part of the def of entrapment. It's about the offence not the situation. You're seeking to remove what you previously relied on - the definition of entrapment - to another compartment - to one about situation. And that's one to be argued in a court. But if you rely on definition - as you did - well, you're wrong.

 

[Spymaster]

No you can't - not on any basis at all. That's why it's not part of the def of entrapment. It's about the offence not the situation. You're seeking to remove what you previously relied on - the definition of entrapment - to another compartment - to one about situation. And that's one to be argued in a court. But if you rely on definition - as you did - well, you're wrong.

Would you agree that causing someone to commit an act that they wouldn't have committed otherwise, is entrapment?

 

[butchersapron]

Would you agree that causing someone to commit an act that they wouldn't have committed otherwise, is entrapment?

Are you trying to entrap me into some clumsy get-out?

 

[kebabking]

Would you agree that causing someone to commit an act that they wouldn't have committed otherwise, is entrapment?

the hack didn't cause Nomaark to act as he did, he merely asked him to do so. no promise of a shag with a supermodel, no promise or payment of cash, no joint enterprise - just, 'hello, you've never met me before and have no idea who i am - can i see your cock?'

thats not cause.

 

[xenon]

Scum journalist traps fuckwit Tory, who resigns.
Meh.

Still, one less Tory minister.

 

[Spymaster]

the hack didn't cause Nomaark to act as he did he merely asked him to do so.

So "she" didn't set up a false identity, engage him and half a dozen others in conversations as someone else, tell him "she" was lying on a bed, send him a picture of "herself" .... ?

You don't think that there's been any deception in obtaining the cock shot and that he'd have done it anyway?

She just asked him to send one and he did, is that what you're saying?

Seriously?

 

[Spymaster]

Are you trying to entrap me into some clumsy get-out?

No get-out is necessary. You're trying to complicate something that's really quite straightforward.

There's no question about whether or not Newmark has been "entrapped" here, just whether or not it was justifiable.

 

[marty21]

Scum journalist traps fuckwit Tory, who resigns.
Meh.

Still, one less Tory minister.

they just replace him with another one - they still have plenty who haven't sent cockpics to anyone

 

[DotCommunist]

that we know of, yet

 

[maomao]

they just replace him with another one - they still have plenty who haven't sent cockpics to anyone

or haven't been caught sending cockpics to anyone at least.

 

[hot air baboon]

...well, there's always UKIP....Nigel could offer him the media-relations brief..he seems to demonstrate great skill and imagination in handling his briefs and appears keen to develop relations with those in the industry....

 

[tony heath]

Has anyone actually seen the pictures?

 

[5t3IIa]

Has anyone actually seen the pictures?

 

[butchersapron]

“Making love with Nick [soames] was like have a double wardrobe fall on top of you"

 

[Wilf]

“Making love with Nick [soames] was like have a double wardrobe fall on top of you"

'Wardrobe with the key sticking out' came into it as well, iirc.

 

[Sue]

Has anyone actually seen the pictures?

I think we need a barfing emoticon.

 

[butchersapron]

'Wardrobe with the key sticking out' came into it as well, iirc.

Yep, i missed the most important bit.

 

[Jollity Farm]

What's wrong with paisley pyjamas?? Is a man wearing them too non-gender conforming for your liking (and all the others before you that took the piss)?

Thinking about it some more, it's not really that they're paisley so much as that he thought they'd be a sexy thing to be wearing in a sexy picture. Plain coloured pyjamas would have been equally unsexy. Although I dare say some people like that kind of thing.

It has made me wonder about the kinds of night wear other MPs have. Those Donald Duck ones posted upthread look like something one of the younger Tories might wear. Young Tory boys (under 50, which is young for a Tory) often look like the type to wear cartoon pyjamas.

 

[Celyn]

... the type to wear cartoon pyjamas.

Perhaps not Disney cartoons, maybe Rupert Bear or something like that. Winnie the Pooh.

 

[Lurdan]

And the comedy goldmine keeps on giving :

Sunday Mirror chief apologises for use of women’s photos in sex sting - Guardian

Editor-in-chief says paper was unaware real pictures were used to obtain sexting scoop that forced Brooks Newmark to quit. (...)

"We thought that pictures used by the investigation were posed by models (...)"

Last night the media commentator Steve Hewlett said on BBC’s Newsnight that the reporter responsible for the sting was Alex Wickham, who writes for the Guido Fawkes blog. (...)

The Sunday Mirror’s leading rival, the Sun newspaper, confirmed it had turned down the story.

 

[Spymaster]

I wonder who the other woman's pictures were sent to and on what basis. I'd assume that there'd be a fair bit of groundwork and banter before the picture exchange. It's unlikely to have been Skidmark but the fella involved either didn't bite or has sussed it and told Alex Wickham to fuck off.

This has obviously been a massive fishing expedition and a clearer case of creating an event expressly to sell as a "news" story is hard to imagine.

Same with Tulisa and that London's Burning lad "Celebrities might score you a bit of coke if you badger them enough" shockers.

The people who make money out of doing this are the ones who should be exposed "in the public interest".

 

[Dogsauce]

The Mirror took the story on for partisan reasons, to derail the tory conference, only to find themselves upstaged by UKIP. They'll be fuming about this.

It's going to be funny watching a tory get in a bit of a huff about how toothless the new press 'regulator' is too. I hope it turns into open warfare, everyone wins.

 

[Dan U]

Wickham was reporting from conference yesterday for Guido, now it's official I wonder if his welcome is more frosty today

 

[Spymaster]

The story has backfired on itself too.

Just two days later and papers aren't reporting what a naughty boy Skidmark has been, that seems almost forgotten already.

It's become all about dodgy journalistic practices.

 

[butchersapron]

If the Miror editor is right - and this will be checkable - the story was sold to them completed. Of course they should have checked further at that point, but the sting itself and its ethical failures surely lay at the feet of the paul staines media crew?

 

[Spymaster]

If the Miror editor is right - and this will be checkable - the story was sold to them completed. Of course they should have checked further at that point, but the sting itself and its ethical failures surely lay at the feet of the paul staines media crew?

I dunno. 50/50 really, isn't it?

Assuming Wickham wasn't flying solo on this and did actually have the support of the group, I reckon at least half the responsibility still must rest with those who actually present the story to the public.

 

[butchersapron]

Either way, interesting week for the mirror - kicks off with paying hush money to people whose phones they'd hacked, goes onto back slapping for bringing a minister down then moves onto being held up to journalists public ridicule for their ethics.

 

[brogdale]

Either way, interesting week for the mirror - kicks off with paying hush money to people whose phones they'd hacked, goes onto back slapping for bringing a minister down then moves onto being held up to journalists public ridicule for their ethics.

Forward with the people.