SWP expulsions and squabbles

[Plumdaff]

ex swp/Counterfire member

She was also ULU President during the 2010 student protests.

 

[DaveCinzano]

She was also in charge during the 2010 student protests.

FTFY

 

[Nigel Irritable]

SOCIALIST WORKERS TAKE A NEW DIRECTION

Irish SWP dissolve as a party. They will maintain a formal existence as a “network” inside People Before Profit but for practical purposes this is the end.

 

[redcogs]

SOCIALIST WORKERS TAKE A NEW DIRECTION

Irish SWP dissolve as a party. They will maintain a formal existence as a “network” inside People Before Profit but for practical purposes this is the end.

It would be interesting to know where/whom the initiative for the dissolution came from Nigel?

 

[bolshiebhoy]

SOCIALIST WORKERS TAKE A NEW DIRECTION

Irish SWP dissolve as a party. They will maintain a formal existence as a “network” inside People Before Profit but for practical purposes this is the end.

Wishful thinking on your part, you're reading a lot into a name change.

 

[redcogs]

Wishful thinking on your part, you're reading a lot into a name change.

If this is simply a cosmetic change why bother? Presumably the Irish SWP is an established organisation with a certain reputation/identity. If the adjustment is simply a meaningless "name change" there must have been no grounds for any change, in which case it is/was, a non serious organisation?

i'm intrigued.

 

[butchersapron]

Maybe it was the "certain reputation/identity" that was the problem.

 

[redcogs]

In the 1970s when the IS formally became the SWP the rationale for so doing seemed appropriate and possibly necessary - the organisation had good grounds for believing it could develop into a 'Party' of some significance (politically and in membership quality quantity terms). There were some grounds for optimism based upon previous successes and growth.

i don't see that in this case, unless there are particular local circumstances in Ireland? i remain intrigued.

But i do not doubt the "certain reputation/identity" problem.

 

[Nigel Irritable]

Wishful thinking on your part, you're reading a lot into a name change.

Hardly wishful thinking. PBP has been the main event for years now, the slow winding up of the SWP remnant is just housekeeping.

The name change comes as the culmination of a process that has already seen: the fulltimers now work for PBP not the SWP, the student groups are now PBP, Marxism is no longer advertised as SWP, placards and flags are now PBP not SWP, Kieran Allen’s title is now a PBP post not an SWP one, leaflets on demonstrations are now PBP branded, the Facebook page reposts PBP material and argues no distinct political line. Now they are both abandoning the “party” title and winding up the paper.

You’ve been away a long time. You don’t get the degree to which the SWP has disappeared. It has no public profile - it’s dissolution statement got all of 21 comments, half of which were actually an argument with a Stalinist troll about Syria. 10 years ago there would have been two thousand comments in a furious Indymedia row. 20 years ago there would have been months of polemics in socialist newspapers. Now there’s tumbleweed. It has no apparatus - everything is PBP branded, PBP funded and pushes PBP politics.

There’s no triumphalism in me noting that the SWP has replaced itself with PBP. If anything I’m a bit sad at the disappearance of most of the revolutionary groups. Even the WSM is all but dead.

 

[Nigel]

Looks like the Socialist Workers Party & Soggies have re-kindled their unhealthy, co-dependent, homo erotic (amongst male counterparts) sado masochistic 'entente' at Marxism 2018 this weekend !
I wonder if Yunis got a hard on !
Apparently their was also a bit of a bun fight outside between the Sparts & International Bolshevik Tendency !
SWP "stewards" police debate | Workers' Liberty

 

[TremulousTetra]

Hardly wishful thinking. PBP has been the main event for years now, the slow winding up of the SWP remnant is just housekeeping.

The name change comes as the culmination of a process that has already seen: the fulltimers now work for PBP not the SWP, the student groups are now PBP, Marxism is no longer advertised as SWP, placards and flags are now PBP not SWP, Kieran Allen’s title is now a PBP post not an SWP one, leaflets on demonstrations are now PBP branded, the Facebook page reposts PBP material and argues no distinct political line. Now they are both abandoning the “party” title and winding up the paper.

You’ve been away a long time. You don’t get the degree to which the SWP has disappeared. It has no public profile - it’s dissolution statement got all of 21 comments, half of which were actually an argument with a Stalinist troll about Syria. 10 years ago there would have been two thousand comments in a furious Indymedia row. 20 years ago there would have been months of polemics in socialist newspapers. Now there’s tumbleweed. It has no apparatus - everything is PBP branded, PBP funded and pushes PBP politics.

There’s no triumphalism in me noting that the SWP has replaced itself with PBP. If anything I’m a bit sad at the disappearance of most of the revolutionary groups. Even the WSM is all but dead.

that last sentence is monumental mate :-(

 

[charlie mowbray]

"Even the WSM is all but dead." Is this true? They organised a picket of the Russian Embassy recently in solidarity with Russian anarchist prisoners and they took part in a militant bloc on the Pride march so why this opinion?

 

[The39thStep]

Hardly wishful thinking. PBP has been the main event for years now, the slow winding up of the SWP remnant is just housekeeping.

The name change comes as the culmination of a process that has already seen: the fulltimers now work for PBP not the SWP, the student groups are now PBP, Marxism is no longer advertised as SWP, placards and flags are now PBP not SWP, Kieran Allen’s title is now a PBP post not an SWP one, leaflets on demonstrations are now PBP branded, the Facebook page reposts PBP material and argues no distinct political line. Now they are both abandoning the “party” title and winding up the paper.

You’ve been away a long time. You don’t get the degree to which the SWP has disappeared. It has no public profile - it’s dissolution statement got all of 21 comments, half of which were actually an argument with a Stalinist troll about Syria. 10 years ago there would have been two thousand comments in a furious Indymedia row. 20 years ago there would have been months of polemics in socialist newspapers. Now there’s tumbleweed. It has no apparatus - everything is PBP branded, PBP funded and pushes PBP politics.

There’s no triumphalism in me noting that the SWP has replaced itself with PBP. If anything I’m a bit sad at the disappearance of most of the revolutionary groups. Even the WSM is all but dead.

The Darlington WSM group is still active

 

[charlie mowbray]

Ho hum.

 

[Dom Traynor]

I heard the guy with the dog has left the Anarchist Federation, and set up the Anarchist Communist Group so now the Afed is literally just two men.

 

[charlie mowbray]

What an accomplished comedian. Oh how we laughed.
OR in the words of Danny Dyer ;"Twat!"

 

[Dom Traynor]

Soz Charles. Pip pip.

 

[Nigel]

PDF's Of Old Copies Of Flame !
IS/SWP Black Section Before They Were Expelled In Late 1970's !

 

[Idris2002]

ISO (US) votes to dissolve itself:

The ISO’s vote to dissolve and what comes next

 

[belboid]

ISO (US) votes to dissolve itself:

The ISO’s vote to dissolve and what comes next

I wondered when someone would notice.

Horribly similar to the UK SWP's cover up, but at least this has been dealt with more openly and honestly. ISO still managed to produce some interesting and useful analyses during that time (retrospectively it is interesting that neither Shawki nor S Smith wrote any of those pieces), and at least Haymarket should carry on.

 

[imposs1904]

I wondered when someone would notice.

Horribly similar to the UK SWP's cover up, but at least this has been dealt with more openly and honestly. ISO still managed to produce some interesting and useful analyses during that time (retrospectively it is interesting that neither Shawki nor S Smith wrote any of those pieces), and at least Haymarket should carry on.

Who actually owns Haymarket?

 

[butchersapron]

Not the ISO - it's totally independent apparently.

 

[Lurdan]

Entertaining "analysis" from the Political Committee of the Socialist Equality Party (US) :

Factional provocation, middle-class hysteria, and the collapse of the International Socialist Organization - World Socialist Web Site

The International Socialist Organization is collapsing just over a month after its national convention, amidst factionally instigated denunciations of sexual assault and cover-up.

(...)

Amidst unrestrained hysteria, the SC suspended, expelled and forced the resignation of leading members.

(...)

Readers are expected to believe that the alleged mishandling of an accusation of sexual assault, which occurred six years ago, has caused the political collapse of the International Socialist Organization.

This is preposterous and will be believed only by those who are either hopelessly naïve or hopelessly stupid. The unleashing of a sex scandal in a political organization is aimed invariably at generating hysteria, stampeding the membership and preventing an open and rational discussion of program, perspective, strategy and the interests of conflicting internal factions and social forces. Only in the aftermath of the organizational massacre, as the smoke begins to clear, do the political interests and aims that precipitated the crisis begin to emerge.

(...)

The ISO was eminently susceptible to a #MeToo-style operation. The membership of the ISO was recruited on the basis of middle-class identity politics. Those who joined the organization received no education in Marxist theory, let alone the central historical experiences of the Fourth International. Perpetually operating in an environment of unprincipled factionalism, rampant opportunism, political cynicism and extreme subjectivism, the members are conditioned to reject concern for issues of program and political principle.

Their one abiding passion is hatred of the International Committee of the Fourth International and the World Socialist Web Site. Our fight for the political independence of the working class, on the basis of the Trotskyist program of Permanent Revolution, is condemned as “sectarianism.”

But amidst the entertainment there is also this :

The chronology of the crisis leaves no doubt that the collapse was instigated by a factional conspiracy organized by a section of the leadership, which was implemented in two stages.

The operation began barely one month ago. In late February, the ISO held its annual convention. (...)

The convention voted for a drastic change in the composition of the ISO’s National Committee and the Steering Committee (SC). The latter functions as the day-to-day leadership of the organization. Selected on the basis of a racial quota system, two-thirds of the SC were new to leadership. One half of these politically inexperienced and easily manipulated members were “comrades of color.”

Yes, they went there.

 

[imposs1904]

Not the ISO - it's totally independent apparently.

I was aware of that. I'm just curious who actually has the 'name on the deeds', so to speak. I mean, that was the prize in the ISO. And I guess I'm just curious when they decided to detach it from the ISO, who made the decision and who now gets to keep the prize.

eta: That's a nice wee earner for someone.

 

[butchersapron]

I was aware of that. I'm just curious who actually has the 'name on the deeds', so to speak. I mean, that was the prize in the ISO. And I guess I'm just curious when they decided to detach it from the ISO, who made the decision and who now gets to keep the prize.

eta: That's a nice wee earner for someone.

Seems to be The Center for Economic Research and Social Change. They also run the socialism event which is also independent of the ISO and a few other things people may not realise (mondoweiss for example). List of Haymarket funders here. I'm sure someone could find some ghastly things/people in there.

 

[imposs1904]

Seems to be The Center for Economic Research and Social Change. They also run the socialism event which is also independent of the ISO and a few other things people may not realise (mondoweiss for example). List of Haymarket funders here. I'm sure someone could find some ghastly things/people in there.

Somebody posted a link to the CERSC's 990-FF for 2016 (IRS thingy) on Leftist Trainspotters.

I won't pretend to know that I can make hide nor tail of it, but I could make out that three members of the old ISO leadership - Ahmed S., Sharon S. and Paul D. - who got voted out and then resigned from the ISO were salaried employees of CERSC according to the 990-FF.

I wonder if they're still in those paid positions in 2019?

 

[belboid]

Entertaining "analysis" from the Political Committee of the Socialist Equality Party (US) :

Factional provocation, middle-class hysteria, and the collapse of the International Socialist Organization - World Socialist Web Site


(...)

(...)



(...)




But amidst the entertainment there is also this :





Yes, they went there.

I really don't think you could call anything those scum in the SEP (who have a long history of helping cover up rape) write as 'entertainment' especially not given the subject matter.

 

[belboid]

Seems to be The Center for Economic Research and Social Change. They also run the socialism event which is also independent of the ISO and a few other things people may not realise (mondoweiss for example). List of Haymarket funders here. I'm sure someone could find some ghastly things/people in there.

I'm sure someone could. they have some great writers there, well worth reading.

 

[butchersapron]

I'm sure someone could. they have some great writers there, well worth reading.

The Lannan Foundation, Caipirinha Foundation, and the Wallace Global Fund do?

 

[belboid]

The Lannan Foundation, Caipirinha Foundation, and the Wallace Global Fund do?

Make grants. Lannan is a publisher, Caipirinha a Brazillian film producer, and Wallace a general funder for left liberal research (investing in “asset activism” !) - a bit like getting dosh off the Joseph Rowntree Foundation here