Um no, the socialist party really do have a similar view about that, and the CPGB too, probably others. Tendentiousness in feminism just means you're doing it right. And especially if it comes to rape and assault, sorry to be so tendentious as to disapprove. Most feminists would and do disapprove of the rape apologism demonstrated by the SWP- scorn for that is mainstream in feminism now.
SWP expulsions and squabbles
- Thread starter Nigel Irritable
- Start date
Um no, the socialist party really do have a similar view about that, and the CPGB too, probably others. Tendentiousness in feminism just means you're doing it right. And especially if it comes to rape and assault, sorry to be so tendentious as to disapprove. Most feminists would and do disapprove of the rape apologism demonstrated by the SWP- scorn for that is mainstream in feminism now.
Some things have been removed from people's submissions with no warning. I'm trying to find out from other members of the faction how many others have been censored.
Nigel Irritable
Five, Ten, Fifteen Years
This is false. The SWPs obsession with showing that working class men receive no benefit whatsoever from the oppression of women is a relic of a particular set of internal rows in the 70s and 80s. This is quite distinct from the more usual Marxist view that sexism is not ultimately in the interests of working class men because it divides the class and so makes the overthrow of capitalism much more difficult. That latter view does not preclude recognising the patently obvious benefits which accrue to many men in many circumstances.
Although, if your agenda is not actually to argue against a silly SWP dogma but instead to establish that "men" as an undifferentiated, trans global and ahistorical bloc possessed of collective agency are the cause of the oppression of "women" as a similar bloc, then of course these distinctions will seem minor. By the same standards, you will end up with all white people, including white women, as the cause and motor of racial oppression, all straight people as the cause of lgbt oppression, etc. And eventually everyone in the world is an oppressor except perhaps for one solitary third world migrant, mentally ill, physically disabled, black, working class transgendered lesbian. I will look forward to reading her tumblr blog about it.
Aargh said:
And this is straightforwardly dishonest of you.
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belboid
Exasperated, not angry.
and even that is a rather grossly simplistic misreading of their actual position (although there are some dumber members who, like rmp3, do actually say just that).
Nigel Irritable
Five, Ten, Fifteen Years
Finally got to the Moran piece. It's every bit as crazed as promised, and will, I suspect be regarded as a classic in years to come. The argument that she who sees the world from the proletarian standpoint can be trusted to judge the merits of a rape accusation against a friend without fear of bias will end up as an emblematic Corin Redgrave moment when the death of the SWP is discussed by future generations of socialists.
butchersapron
Bring back hanging
God, imagine reading her Phd.
Some of it reminds me of Orwell's Wigan Pier - "One sometimes gets the
impression that the mere words 'Socialism' and 'Communism' draw towards
them with magnetic force every fruit-juice drinker, nudist, sandal-wearer,
sex-maniac, Quaker, 'Nature Cure' quack, pacifist.."
Bless.
i need to re read it, but Stack sets a good tone.
impression that the mere words 'Socialism' and 'Communism' draw towards
them with magnetic force every fruit-juice drinker, nudist, sandal-wearer,
sex-maniac, Quaker, 'Nature Cure' quack, pacifist.."
Bless.
i need to re read it, but Stack sets a good tone.
J Ed
Follow Back Pro Expropriation
How does someone who writes like that even get into a position where they are doing a PhD?
Nigel Irritable
Five, Ten, Fifteen Years
There speaks someone who hasn't read too many PhD theses!
Nigel Irritable
Five, Ten, Fifteen Years
Yes, I saw people on twitter saying that two opposition pieces were simply not carried.
barney_pig
Po-cha-na-quar-hip
Can Rhetta have a column in a national newspaper, she would become the third proletarian leg in our stool of intersectionality with Owen and Laurie
bolshiebhoy
socialism leinster drink
yawn
Nigel Irritable
Five, Ten, Fifteen Years
You are bored by your own organisation's discussion of the greatest crisis in its history?
What do you make of the pieces by Anonymous, Stack, Davidson?
And the Moran one?
butchersapron
Bring back hanging
I liked this piece of dialectical thinking (excuse the dots, but it's easy enough to read)- the reason the rebellion happened was precisely because of the good leninist training that party had given the members, the training that his piece is actually a substantial critique of. Heads i win, tails you lose.
SpineyNorman
Inappropriate content removed
She should be offered a column in workers' girder.
discokermit
Well-Known Member
she's too over the top.
SpineyNorman
Inappropriate content removed
Nigel Irritable
Five, Ten, Fifteen Years
I dunno. I'd reckon there's a lot of comic mileage in the proletarian standpoint.
discokermit
Well-Known Member
no. she's less believable than the workers bomb and barry mainwaring.
Nigel Irritable
Five, Ten, Fifteen Years
Did any of you ex SWP people actually know her, and was she always a total fruitcake?
discokermit
Well-Known Member
i don't think i know her.
emanymton
A cat politely sat on the flaming gardener.
Odly I only came across her after I left, but yes I head it said she has always been a bit out there. The fact she now seems to be a leading member is mind boggling. I repeat my earlier statement that this women should not have been allowed near any kind of disputes Committee.
Oh, while I cannot be certain I suspect the person referred to in anonymous's contribution as going on about the black panthers was her partner
emanymton
A cat politely sat on the flaming gardener.
Count yourself lucky.
butchersapron
Bring back hanging
She is an actual (or was) real life academic. With a proper published book and everything.
I remember she declared the anti-EDL efforts in Bolton way back when a resounding victory in a meeting shortly afterwards. I had thought of her as one of the loyalist of the loyal at the time.
I knew her. She was a good friend to me and someone I admired - she was doing a phd raising a young child while being as politically active as she could manage. Doing a phd was not thought of (by others I recognise as loyalists) as being in the best interests of the swp at the time because it meant she wasn't so active. I have never thought of her as out there but it is nearly 20 yrs ago when I lived in Manchester. Her phd, for instance, is not written in the style of the proletarian standpoint.
Nigel Irritable
Five, Ten, Fifteen Years
It actually makes it more sad if she wasn't always a nut sandwich.
I see on Facebook by the way that SWP members have just been told that they sold 1,401 papers last week. Or less than 1 per 5 "members". The oppositionists seem genuinely surprised that they were given a precise number and even more surprised that they were apparently expected to be pleased about it.
I see on Facebook by the way that SWP members have just been told that they sold 1,401 papers last week. Or less than 1 per 5 "members". The oppositionists seem genuinely surprised that they were given a precise number and even more surprised that they were apparently expected to be pleased about it.
love detective
there's no love too small
It's good that she can switch standpoints so fluidly
I mean one minute finding it possible to command and communicate about a standpoint that is as consciously proletarian as it is possible to achieve on this side of the end of capitalism and then the next, erm..not, must take some doing
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