SWP expulsions and squabbles

[Spanky Longhorn]

That's not her nickname that's Mr Lustbather's unpleasant nickname. She is paid chief of Unite's Community Branch for London - a massive task given how many unemployed and underemployed there are in the fringes of the city.

she's not the chief of it, she's pretty much a caseworker

 

[sihhi]

she's not the chief of it, she's pretty much a caseworker

Someone reliable told me she was London Community head, so who is?

 

[belboid]

Labour types like Alex Gordon and Toby Abse? And it's not specifically SWP either - I'm sure it was at least in part occasioned by issues in the RMT

various non-labour types have signed it, but it was set up by Labourites, the two women whose name appears at the end.

 

[Delroy Booth]

I think she's the one who does the PR stuff.

 

[sihhi]

I think she's the one who does the PR stuff.

I don't think that's right. Big Tom posted elsewhere

Ellie Mae O'Hagan is the unite community branch organiser for London. In Birmingham they are still in the talking phase and haven't advertised let alone appointed anyone to be branch organiser for Birmingham or west mids, but it is supposed to be happening.

In wider terms it doesn't look as good as I'd hoped, there won't apparently be access to solicitors for benefit appeals, just a phone line you can call for advice. I don't know what budgets there would be for training people in the union to give advice on benefits stuff or to be available to help members fill in forms etc.
Without the above I can't see how the community branch will be useful and therefore grow. With the above it could be very useful for people who can afford the membership fee, which I can't remember what it was maybe 50p/month?, it wasn't huge but there has to be a reason for people to pay it, and that'll only be if the union starts giving people advice and representation, like they do with workers & union reps.

 

[Spanky Longhorn]

Someone reliable told me she was London Community head, so who is?

Pilgrim Tucker - however due to being a relentless self publicist everyone assumes it's Ellie Bum-Finger

 

[butchersapron]

So so close.

 

[TremulousTetra]

I agree with it. It makes the question Nigel posted here:



an important one. Why not Delta?

just looking back, I thought I had asked the same question a long time ago

Has somebody already explained in this thread, why the leadership would be so desperate to keep hold of this guy in the leadership, desperate enough to "cover something up", when they have jettisoned so many IE John Rees, German, etc?

 

[TremulousTetra]

So so close.

ehem. Is this strictly on topic? Are we allowed to discuss this?

 

[Nigel Irritable]

Pilgrim Tucker - however due to being a relentless self publicist everyone assumes it's Ellie Bum-Finger

I also refuse to believe that there's a UNITE official called "Pilgrim" either.

 

[sihhi]

Pilgrim Tucker - however due to being a relentless self publicist everyone assumes it's Ellie Bum-Finger

OK, it's odd because Unite's website has him as chief of East Anglia/East Region.

http://www.unitetheunion.org/news/newcommunitycoordinatorforeastanglia/

 

[Spanky Longhorn]

OK, it's odd because Unite's website has him as chief of East Anglia/East Region.

http://www.unitetheunion.org/news/newcommunitycoordinatorforeastanglia/

East Anglia is part of their London and Eastern Region and Pilgrim is a woman.

 

[Spanky Longhorn]

Still this is off topic...

 

[The39thStep]

OK, it's odd because Unite's website has him as chief of East Anglia/East Region.

http://www.unitetheunion.org/news/newcommunitycoordinatorforeastanglia/

East Anglia is part of their London and Eastern Region and Pilgrim is a woman.

creeping feminism and Londonism

 

[TremulousTetra]

Still this is off topic...

at last, some sanity.

ETA I take it back. Just received a p.m. instructing me this allowed.

 

[sihhi]

Beyond the Fragments and then back to Labour

The SWP CC were heading back to Labour in a soft sense before any of the stuff about Delta or the Facebook 4 came into the open. See this poster for here last summer.

 

[TremulousTetra]

Facts I'm not sure about.
1. Isn't the disputes committee elected, not decided upon for each case? And isn't it likely, whoever was on the disputes committee in such a small organisation, they would be likely to know Delta?
2. The woman chose to go to disputes committee?
3. The woman chose not to go to the police, and is still choosing not to?
4. The central committee has jettisoned many members, so why not Delta?
5. Has anybody got any proof that he is guilty?
6. Delta was sacked in 2011, so no real reason they couldn't have done it earlier beyond;

Doesn't this all point to the possibility, the likelihood, instead of a convoluted and complicated cover-up, the DC didn't believe the accusations?

PS. These are not statements of fact, just five out of the thousands of suggestions as to what happened. If anybody can prove any of them points to be wrong, please do.

 

[DaveCinzano]

I do find his articles on Italian politics interesting sometimes

"I only read it for the articles on Italian politics"

 

[DaveCinzano]

She's not random she's a full time Unite organiser - currently running an office that the Islamist crook in Tower Hamlets has given Unite for free

The taxi-loving friend of 'retired' spycop Bob Lambert, or a different crook?

 

[bolshiebhoy]

''And it matters to me, because I can’t claim to be entirely innocent. I was in this party for 28 years. I must have accepted claims that didn’t make sense, and ignored accounts of appalling behaviour, or sighed and hoped the tricky issue I heard about would go away of its own accord. Somehow the critical faculties that led me to join a socialist group deserted me with regard to the group itself'


FROM MARK'S BLOG:

One for Bolshie and perhaps some other ex members...

He was one of my favorite comrades on a personal level when we were both members. And this piece is funny in parts. But the analysis stinks. First, why did he leave, be good to know as that would inform his argument surely. Secondly, he blames the 90's when it was hard to be a socialist apparently for the degeneration. But he and I were members during the much harsher 'downturn' 80's and none of these splits or crises happened. Why that?

 

[Sean Delaney]

new pope looks like a barrel of laughs

 

[Sean Delaney]

What's worse? Roman Catholic CC or SWP CC? There's a rizla paper in it I reckon

 

[kavenism]

new pope looks like a barrel of laughs

That's what Jon Snow said. He also made the comment that the new Pope was "straight out the Boondocks" which doesn't seem entirely in keeping with the mood of the event. Also noted that the poor guy had to move house! I wish my place had interior design like his new house.

 

[SLK]

He was one of my favorite comrades on a personal level when we were both members. And this piece is funny in parts. But the analysis stinks. First, why did he leave, be good to know as that would inform his argument surely. Secondly, he blames the 90's when it was hard to be a socialist apparently for the degeneration. But he and I were members during the much harsher 'downturn' 80's and none of these splits or crises happened. Why that?

Because in the 80s, there wasn't the pretence that it was all brilliant despite our experiences as members.

Actually, the early 90s isn't the period he's referring - it's the early 2000s I think (he says it might have started in the 1990s). I think the issue was that we should have carried on growing in the late 90s if the analysis of the period was correct, so rather than say "why aren't we growing" the paper was filled every week with how much we were. It was only after 3 years of growth (when I was at LSE) that I started to question why we were still claiming 10000 members - the same as at the start. Even when our branch wasn't getting significantly bigger, I remember being desperate to work out how Glasgow, West London, Sheffield, Liverpool or Newcastle were doing it.

I like Steel's article as it summarises how I feel about this whole ugly mess. I also think he has pointed at why he left (though I don't know what the straw that broke the back was I suspect RESPECT/ Galloway/ etc) in his pointing to the late 90s onwards. He was always the type to question the leadership or ignore stuff he didn't want to trumpet to be fair, and drifted away several times if I remember correctly - but didn't we all.

 

[october_lost]

Someone asked a question earlier, why didn't they just ditch him, like John Rees Lindsey German? Not seen a response.

Callinicos responded by saying it was essentially about party discipline and I'm inclined to agree. A retreat to a rebellion of this nature would have set a terrible precedent and it's not like the opposition where just making noises about the rape, was it? Loyalty to MS may have also played a small part.

 

[Sean Delaney]

the much harsher 'downturn' 80's

Yeah the 80s were hard for a lot of people, but they were great days too. The quality of the membership of the SWP was gold standard back then. So many comrades I remember were as hard as nails - they had this gut reaction to things. By the 1990s most of them had dropped out and the cult quality was creeping in - I remember someone telling me that 'if you get chosen to work fulltime for the party its an incredible honour' without the slightest whiff of irony. In previous times, comrades would have laughed like drains at such hack nonsense. A healthy disrespect for the fulltimers was par for the course - you really had to earn your stripes and there was none of this 'leading comrade' crap. Lenin didn't do or say much that was useful, but one quote of his worth repeating is that in the revolutionary party 'there is no rank and file.'

 

[SpackleFrog]

He was one of my favorite comrades on a personal level when we were both members. And this piece is funny in parts. But the analysis stinks. First, why did he leave, be good to know as that would inform his argument surely. Secondly, he blames the 90's when it was hard to be a socialist apparently for the degeneration. But he and I were members during the much harsher 'downturn' 80's and none of these splits or crises happened. Why that?

You know he wrote a book called "Why I left the SWP", don't you?

 

[Spanky Longhorn]

The taxi-loving friend of 'retired' spycop Bob Lambert, or a different crook?

Lutfur Rahman don't know who you mean??

 

[Sean Delaney]

Anyone remember Chris Wright? What that guy didn't know about the 17th Century wasn't worth knowing. He used to lecture on that stuff, fantastic. He brought it alive, and you could see it all being played out in front of your very eyes, as he explained it, like. Pete Green wrote brilliantly about economics in the 1980s - Socialist Review was a proper journal in those days. I wouldn't wipe my arse on it today.

Ian Birchall is still creaking along. He's one of the few old guard left who is human; knows his arse from his elbow.

We need a proper Marxist humanist party again, minus the Leninist crap. Such a party can't be conjured out of thin air, the times themselves create the people who make it happen.

 

[Oisin123]

Callinicos responded by saying it was essentially about party discipline.

This is my view too. The other examples of people being unceremoniously dumped off the CC are very different, because it was the CC majority in charge of the dumping. The size of IDOOP shows that there might even be a majority of the party with a mistrustful attitude towards the CC. Once you allow conference to instigate the picking off of CC members, the control of the apparatus can fragment quickly. So the Facebook 4 had to be expelled and the lynch mob formed. From this perspective, the CC will think they've done well and the party will remain a coherent tight knit force. But so were the WRP.