Remainers: When are you taking to the streets?

[discokermit]

Really? My working class neighbours had In posters in there window. (Lambeth, London)

Down from where I come from (Devon - but I grew up in Plymouth) if you go outside Plymouth, which is full of backwoods middle class Tories, they all vote UKIP. My friend who went back there to look after her aged mother told me they were all UKIP around there. Its not that the middle class are worried about there entitlements. A lot of them outside London are real reactionaries. The kind of people who regard Cameron as a metropolitan liberal.

The country always was split. The referendum has brought this to the surface.

if that's what you think the split is, you're living in a dream land.
do you think the majority of the country outside of london are backwoods middle class tories?

 

[treelover]

Well we seem to be in post party politics, apparently the crowd listened to Anna Soubry and cheered her, though part of iot may be because she was making anti-racist statements.

 

[editor]

He/she is not trolling, afaic, he sees lots of middle class people worried about their entitlement, etc, the country, but wonders where they have been the last ten years, austerity, suicides from benefit sanctions, food banks, etc, its a valid position.

He/she said all that in the one word post, 'Yuck'? No, there's ways to have an intelligent argument. That is not one of them.

 

[phildwyer]

The referendum was sold to people as a decisive choice, to backtrack now and basically say 'unless the political class doesn't like it' makes a joke of the whole democratic process. Especially if it comes as a result, or is seen to come as the result, of one block protesting. People have the right to do whatever they feel necessary but if the results are ultimately ignored they have to face the backlash they'll see from disillusioned, dismissed and disdained Leave voters.

If this result is overturned or ignored, we'll have every right to defy and resist anything the EU tries to do for ever more.

 

[phildwyer]

He/she said all that in the one word post, 'Yuck'? No, there's ways to have an intelligent argument. That is not one of them.

I thought he was expressing disgust at the arrogance of those who feel entitled to overturn the people's democratically-expressed will.

 

[editor]

I thought he was expressing disgust at the arrogance of those who feel entitled to overturn the people's democratically-expressed will.

Ah. You felt the arrogance, eh?

 

[discokermit]

Ah. You felt the arrogance, eh?

no, he thought. read the post.

 

[discokermit]

you lack even the most rudimentary comprehension skills. lol.

 

[seventh bullet]

lol.

Careful now. That'll get you banned.

 

[wheelie_bin]

Careful now. That'll get you banned.

Don't stand for it discokermit, protest about your right to remain.

 

[Sifta]

A lot of establishment types are talking about this thing in London, same size as the Corbyn demo they slagged off last night, like it's Maidan 2 or something

Looks like we're to be having a "colour revolution". Ain't we the lucky ones. Wonder what shade we'll be allocated? The official colour of the EU flag is "reflex blue", amusingly.

 

[emanymton]

I didnt see the publicity for it and only came across it by accident.

Speeches by those present were supporting migrants in general and a country that welcomes them. One British Asian who spoke linked the out vote to opposition to migrants in general. As her parents has to put up with when they first came here. The EU is hardly perfect but for me out is a step back for this country.

I getting really fucked of with this idea that the EU is the pro-imigration choice. It clearly isn't. It's freedom of movement is limited to EU counties, so unless her parents came here from the EU what's her point? The EU is just as big a barrier to immigration as the UK state. To support the EU is to support explicitly racist immigration policies. This shit is either extremely ignorant or extremely disingenuous.

 

[emanymton]

I getting really fucked of with this idea that the EU is the pro-imigration choice. It clearly isn't. It's freedom if movement is limited to EU counties, so unless her parents came here from the EU what's her point? The EU is just as big a barrier to immigration as the UK state. To support the EU is to support explicitly racist immigration policies. This shit is either extremely ignorant or extremely disingenuous.

Forgot to say, many areas of the EU are for more hostile to immigrants from outside the EU than the UK is. We probably have one if the weakest far rights on the continent.

 

[chilango]

Of course. The first protests by Remainers are gonna be a bit like this. Let's see if they continue what they might develop into.

Let's also see if Leave take to the streets in defence of the democratic voice.

Then let's see what common sentiment and common demands start emerging.

Or not.

Either way it's better than shit memes on Facebook whilst letting the politicians get on with it.

Isn't it?

 

[emanymton]

Of course. The first protests by Remainers are gonna be a bit like this. Let's see if they continue what they might develop into.

Let's also see if Leave take to the streets in defence of the democratic voice.

Then let's see what common sentiment and common demands start emerging.

Or not.

Either way it's better than shit memes on Facebook whilst letting the politicians get on with it.

Isn't it?

I wish there was a vaguely credible left wing org with a united leave position to call a left based demo calling on the government to honour the vote. It would maybe allow the left to start to have some impact on shaping things post referendum. But there is no one to call it, the peoples assembly would be the obvious choice, but their split and mostly remain anyway, I think. I just can't see how I could support a leave demo called by the right.

 

[Sweet Meiga]

Forgot to say, many areas of the EU are for more hostile to immigrants from outside the EU than the UK is. We probably have one if the weakest far rights on the continent.

Quite right. Was about time to give the UK far right a chance to up their game.

 

[Anudder Oik]

He/she said all that in the one word post, 'Yuck'? No, there's ways to have an intelligent argument. That is not one of them.

Yuck means I see yesterday’s display of sanctimonious liberal snobbery as a shameless disregard for a democratic vote.

Big business and big politics don't want to accept this and are gearing up to basically piss all over democracy which will then create an even wider and bitter rift in society.

Obviously, these privileged protestors, a product of gentrification in London, don’t see that, all they see is that the referendum result was 'incorrect' because they feel that the poor people’s vote weighs less than their higher educated middle class liberal perspective, yet they are incapable of stating any clear reason to stay in the EU, while simultaneously showing a total and utter ignorance of how the other half of the country live.

The financial times has hit the nail on the head. The leave vote was symptomatic of racism but has at its root been a protest against inequality.

 

[krtek a houby]

We, the more priviliged and highly educated, demand that the referendum be declared null and void due to its undemocratic nature, namely, too many chavs, who have no adequate understanding of the issues, voted in it. The Low paid shouldn't have the vote.

Lot of this victimhood from those on the left who voted to leave. And instant lashing out at those of us on the left who voted to remain. Because those of us in the latter camp disagree with the result, we have to be middle class, anti-working class, sneering at the "thickos" types.

The hilarious thing is that you sneer at the remainers for being concerned and basically, your language indicates that actually, the pro-exit camp have more that an adequate understanding of the issue and the remain camp doesn't, in the slightest.

 

[krtek a houby]

If this result is overturned or ignored, we'll have every right to defy and resist anything the EU tries to do for ever more.

Yes, you will. And we shall have every right to defy and resist you and your army.

 

[YouSir]

Yes, you will. And we shall have every right to defy and resist you and your army.

Army?

 

[Lord Camomile]

Fuck's sake, can we not just agree that, in this of all votes, both camps had a very wide, varied and disparate set of backgrounds, ideologies and motivations, and that to try and paint them as any one thing is futile?

There isn't an average Remain voter, there isn't an average Leave voter. There are a lot of people voting for a lot of different reasons on a very complex and murky issue.

 

[butchersapron]

Wasn't the OP actually asking when remain voters would take to the streets demanding reform of the undemocratic EU: demanding the end of the authoritarian ruling of greece as an EU colony, the end of the imposition of austerity/privatisations and redundancies across portugal, spain,Italy etc, the end of the murderous fortress europe policy, the end of the pressure on states to write austerity into their constitutions and the requirement for all new members to do the same, the overturning of the ban on the right to strike across eu-wide industries, the demand for political accountability. and so on Not when are you demonstrating in support of the body doing all these things.

 

[chilango]

Wasn't the OP actualy asking when remain voters qould take to the streets demanding reform of the undemocratic EU: demanding the end of the authoritarian ruling of greece as an EU colony, the end of the imposition of austerity/privatisations and redundancies across portugal, spain,Italy etc, the end of the murderous fortress europe policy, the end of the pressure on states to write austerity into their constitutions and the requirement for all new members to do the same, the overturning of the ban on the right to strike across eu-wide industries, the demand for political accountability. and so on Not when are you demonstrating in support of the body doing all these things.

That's one way of reading it.

I was actually being far less sophisticated.

I was just wondering when the "anger" and "passion" on display online were going to translate into something more concrete.

...and then whether this could then become something more useful or remain at the level of the brooms.

 

[phildwyer]

Army?

It's not much of an army, but at least its mine.

 

[editor]

Yuck means I see yesterday’s display of sanctimonious liberal snobbery as a shameless disregard for a democratic vote.

Ah, so that's what it was. Sanctimonious liberal snobs. All of them. And not just people pissed off.

 

[Kesher]

Fuck's sake, can we not just agree that, in this of all votes, both camps had a very wide, varied and disparate set of backgrounds, ideologies and motivations, and that to try and paint them as any one thing is futile?

There isn't an average Remain voter, there isn't an average Leave voter. There are a lot of people voting for a lot of different reasons on a very complex and murky issue.

I can't agree: I believe a large part of the leave vote was based on "Taking our country back" meaning reduced immigration

 

[phildwyer]

To support the EU is to support explicitly racist immigration policies.

That's an excellent point, and it ought to be made more often.

I'm in favor of Leaving, in part, because I want more immigration. It's just that I'd rather see immigrants come from the commonwealth than from the EU. One of my main problems with the EU was that it replaced commonwealth immigration with European immigration. I suspect that an awful lot of people feel as I do.

 

[Louis MacNeice]

Yes, you will. And we shall have every right to defy and resist you and your army.

Did I miss the uniforms being given out or are you being just a little melodramatic?

Anyway krtek a houby v Phil Dwyer...it's



Cheers - Louis MacNeice

 

[Louis MacNeice]

I can't agree: I believe a large part of the leave vote was based on "Taking our country back" meaning reduced immigration

Any other meanings that 'taking our country back' might have...any...any at all?

Cheers - Louis MacNeice

 

[Lord Camomile]

I can't agree: I believe a large part of the leave vote was based on "Taking our country back" meaning reduced immigration

Perhaps, but they won't all share a common background or social status.

<edit>

Any other meanings that 'taking our country back' might have...any...any at all?

Cheers - Louis MacNeice

And that.