Raith Rovers and the rapist

[equationgirl]

The message this sends people is just outrageous:

Rape is just a mistake
Rape isn't a serious crime
You can be s footballer and rape someone, yet still be a footballer

 

[steeplejack]

One of the other minority "defences" of this signing: "He's been playing for Clyde for the last five years, where was the outrage then?"

Very obviously:

1. Clyde were bottom of the Scottish fourth tier when he signed
2. Clyde are watched by crowds of 6-700 every week
3. Clyde are rarely if ever in the national news
4. as a fan of another club at that level I can assure you categorically he got dog's abuse every week from oppsing fans. I have seen him play several times during this period. A minority of Clyde fans refused to watch the club for as long as he was there (unfortunately they were outnumbered by slavering fanboys currently crying into their third strip shorts over his departure)
5. Things have moved on just a wee bit since Clyde signed him in 2017, with #metoo, the Sarah Everard case, and other examples of instiutional indifference / incompetence in taking gender violece seriously and providing a framework whereby women can have confidence in reporting sexual crimes committed against them, that they will be taken seriously, and have some propsect of achieving conviction / punishment / retribution / closure.

 

[liquidindian]

I don't think people are reading Sasaferrato's post properly, though to be fair the first line does raise the red mist.

 

[steeplejack]

The story has now made CNN and is the third most-read story on the BBC UK website.

 

[Athos]

Wouldn't it be great if the fans boycotted the games, and went to see the breakaway women's team instead. A win/win/win - fans still get regular football etc., women's team get a massive boost in support, and, best of all, sends a clear message about how seriously rape must be taken. All whilst hitting the pockets of those responsible.

 

[killer b]

I don't think people are reading Sasaferrato's post properly, though to be fair the first line does raise the red mist.

can't speak for anyone else, but I did. The takeaway from his post is that the rapist should be allowed a career in football, were he to show remorse. A position of nuance and compassion (for the rapist at least), which is startling in contrast to a number of his recent posts.

 

[liquidindian]

The takeaway from his post is that the rapist should be allowed a career in football, were he to show remorse.

I don't think this is quite accurate either.

It's perhaps a tricky question whether someone should be a footballer or take a similar public role if they have committed a terrible crime but admitted guilt and were truly sorry and had suffered consequences. But the point is that this difficult question doesn't even need to be considered here, because Goodwillie has never admitted guilt and tried to evade the consequences. It's not that remorse fixes everything, but an absence of remorse means it doesn't even need to be considered at all.

 

[killer b]

But the point is that this difficult question doesn't even need to be considered here,

it doesn't, which is why it's really weird sas raised it.

 

[equationgirl]

I don't think people are reading Sasaferrato's post properly, though to be fair the first line does raise the red mist.

Oh I read it just fine.

 

[liquidindian]

it doesn't, which is why it's really weird sas raised it.

I've seen a vox pop of a supporter saying something along these lines, and Raith Rovers said this in their statement: While acknowledging the gravity of what happened ten years ago, as a club we fully support and encourage rehabilitation, and many factors influenced our signing.

 

[steeplejack]

I've seen a vox pop of a supporter saying something along these lines, and Raith Rovers said this in their statement: While acknowledging the gravity of what happened ten years ago, as a club we fully support and encourage rehabilitation, and many factors influenced our signing.

And?

 

[killer b]

I've seen a vox pop of a supporter saying something along these lines, and Raith Rovers said this in their statement: While acknowledging the gravity of what happened ten years ago, as a club we fully support and encourage rehabilitation, and many factors influenced our signing.

whatever, I don't really give a shit. just letting you know I read all the way to the end of sas' post.

 

[steeplejack]

Worth reading from an (ex?) Clyde fan, one of a minority, sadly.

 

[liquidindian]

And?

And it's bullshit! That's the point! You can't rehabilitate a guy who has never admitted he did something wrong. I believe that's the point that was being made and I think a few people stopped reading after "he wasn't convicted in a criminal court". I know I did a double take.

To be clear, I don't think that an admission of guilt solves anything. But no admission of guilt tells us that this idea of rehabilitation is totally off the table.

 

[editor]

Petition is up:

Sign the Petition

Remove David Goodwillie from Raith Rovers and re-establish the team as a family club

www.change.org

 

[RainbowTown]

To be clear, I don't think that an admission of guilt solves anything. But no admission of guilt tells us everything.

And to be clear: I think this tells us all we need to know about the vile Mr Goodwillie and what type of person he is. Seems to me a man with an awful lot of anger and aggression within himself. That of course he takes out on others. So it's no wonder he doesn't feel the need to be rehabilitated or even admit he's done anything wrong. That type of person never does.

Criminal convictions and rape judgment​

In June 2008, Goodwillie was convicted of assaulting a man in a Stirling nightclub,[63] and was fined £250.[64]

In September 2009 Goodwillie was arrested after a nightclub doorman was knocked unconscious.[65] Two months later, Goodwillie was convicted of assault and received a £200 fine.[66][67]

In 2012, Goodwillie was convicted of assault for repeatedly punching and kicking John Friel after Friel attacked Goodwillie's teammate Danny Swanson from behind at a takeaway in Glasgow in 2010.[68] He was sentenced to a 12-month probation order and to carry out 80 hours of unpaid work.[68] Friel was ordered to carry out 240 hours of unpaid work for his part in the incident.[68]

Rape​

Goodwillie and his teammate David Robertson were accused of raping a woman in January 2011.[69] Goodwillie was charged with rape, but the Crown Office did not pursue a criminal prosecution due to insufficient evidence in law.[69] The Criminal Injuries Compensation Authority determined that the woman had been raped and awarded her £11,000.

The woman took civil action in 2016 against Goodwillie and Robertson, in the first case of its kind in Scotland. The judge ruled that they had each raped her,[69][70] and ordered them to pay £100,000 in compensation.[69] The civil case was judged on the balance of probabilities and did not need corroboration of evidence, unlike in a Scottish criminal case.[69] Soon after the case concluded Goodwillie left his club, Plymouth Argyle,[39] while Robertson retired from football completely.[71] Goodwillie had asked to leave Plymouth as he was considering an appeal.[39] In November 2017 three appeal judges at the Court of Session upheld the ruling against Goodwillie and Robertson.[72]

Career statistics​

 

[editor]

The court testimony is grim reading. Fuck the rapist scumbag.

DC AGAINST (FIRST) DG AND (SECOND) DR

www.scotcourts.gov.uk

 

[editor]

Great to see the club getting absolutely roasted on their Twitter account (apart from a minority of the inevitable morons)

 

[steeplejack]

The court testimony is grim reading. Fuck the rapist scumbag.

DC AGAINST (FIRST) DG AND (SECOND) DR

www.scotcourts.gov.uk

I posted this already, and materuial like that should come with a trigger warning.

 

[steeplejack]

And it's bullshit! That's the point! You can't rehabilitate a guy who has never admitted he did something wrong. I believe that's the point that was being made and I think a few people stopped reading after "he wasn't convicted in a criminal court". I know I did a double take.

To be clear, I don't think that an admission of guilt solves anything. But no admission of guilt tells us that this idea of rehabilitation is totally off the table.

I read it fine, the point killer b and others were making is the purpose of the legal cheese-paring in the opening paragraph, especially given this poster's very odd recent posting history.

 

[liquidindian]

I read it fine, the point @killer b and others were making is the purpose of the legal cheese-paring in the opening paragraph, especially given this poster's very odd recent posting history.

Fair, I'm not really aware of that. It just read to me (on re-reading) that the point of raising the technicalities was to dismiss them, but perhaps I'm being too kind. I hope my own feelings are clear.

 

[weepiper]

Val McDermid talking on Women's Hour.

 

[Sasaferrato]

And Police Scotland saying there wasn't enough evidence to proceed doesn't mean he didn't do it, just that there was no chance of a conviction.

Sasaferrato do you know the stats for rape convictions, and the inherent systemic reasons and biases for said conviction rates?

Utterly grim.

The rape stats are utterly appalling. What victims are put through in court and by the police is also appalling.

There is a case that has stuck in my mind for a long long time. The victim was forced to hold up in court, the underwear that she was wearing at the time she was assaulted. She took her own life some weeks after the case.

I'm not a lawyer, I don't know why the conviction rates are so deplorably low, but things need to change and quickly. There are many vile crimes, but rape mu8st be close to the top of the list. Some people never recover, and I cannot imagine how it feels when the case is dismissed, and the victim is standing there, effectively having been named as a liar.

Mum of suicide girl whose thong was used in rape trial backs #ThisIsNotConsent

Lindsay Armstrong, 17, took her own life after being forced to hold up her underwear in court and read out the slogan 'Little Devil'.

www.dailyrecord.co.uk

 

[Sasaferrato]

And it's bullshit! That's the point! You can't rehabilitate a guy who has never admitted he did something wrong. I believe that's the point that was being made and I think a few people stopped reading after "he wasn't convicted in a criminal court". I know I did a double take.

To be clear, I don't think that an admission of guilt solves anything. But no admission of guilt tells us that this idea of rehabilitation is totally off the table.

Correct. He has never admitted guilt.

 

[MickiQ]

Surely he can't admit guilt now? If he does won't it count as a confession and enable him to be actually prosecuted? Or is there a statute of limitation on rape charges in Scotland.

 

[friedaweed]

Val McDermid talking on Women's Hour.

If they have any integrity they should respectfully remove Val's McDermid's name from their shirt for the remainder of the season.

I know the situation is different to Neil Young's Spotify withdrawal over anti-vax conspiraloony or Emin asking for her neon to be taken off the wall in Downing Street whilst Bojo's and his school chums are acting like entitled cunts but whatever they do they should, purely from a position of ethics, respect a person's right to be dissociated from their shite decision to do something so abhorrent to the community they ultimately represent.

Really glad to see this opposition growing a wider audience as well because unfortunately it needs to be debated in wider society in order for it to find any ground swell in the community.

I do get what Sasaferrato is saying and I don't read it as rape apologism personally, I think that's an unfair comment below his post. Val McDermid alludes to something very similar in her comments about rehabilitation and redemption and why it's not really part of the picture here because Cuntface doesn't accept his crime as a rapist let alone a rehabilitated one. He probably still thinks what he did was just a bit of edgy fun.

I read the original case reporting on the gruniad last night and I wouldn't cross the road to piss on him or his rapist pal if they were on fire. Made me feel sick too. Then you wake up to see another footballer on the front pages.

Hopefully what Rape Rovers have done in their shame is enabled more light to be brought on this subject and I hope the directors who agreed his signing really do end up reaping what they have sown.

 

[steeplejack]

Well, to everyone's (mine included) surprise, the U-turn has come.

"We Got it Wrong" Raith Rovers statement

David Goodwillie will not play for the club and his "contractural position" will be discussed.

Wow.

 

[danny la rouge]

Well, to everyone's (mine included) surprise, the U-turn has come.

"We Got it Wrong" Raith Rovers statement

David Goodwillie will not play for the club and his "contractural position" will be discussed.

Wow.

Great work by the fans and those involved in the club making the board see how wrong they’d got things.

 

[editor]

Well, to everyone's (mine included) surprise, the U-turn has come.

"We Got it Wrong" Raith Rovers statement

David Goodwillie will not play for the club and his "contractural position" will be discussed.

Wow.

I suspect that some of the damage to the club will be permanent. If I was a fan I don't think I'd go back after originally hearing them defend their position, unless every fucker who voted to sign the player resigned.

 

[steeplejack]

Yeah it will take the club years to recover from this appalling and insensitive misjudgement.

Credit to them for taking the first step in the right direction, though. It will be a long and ongoing process to rebuild from this absolute self-immolation, however.

Probably Goodwillie will be paid off a big sum and will end up back at Clyde (however such has been the media storm this week that even the way back into playing part time in front of 500 people may be closed). He has a financial charge hanging over him so likely any pay off will be swallowed up. He's 33 now and this was his last shot at full-time football.

Had he been anything approaching decent as a human being, Goodwillie would have had a top career at good clubs both side of the border, and likely had 40-50 caps for Scotland. But he's a thug and a rapist, and rightly, as this week has shown, a pariah.