people who voted tory

[frogwoman]

If we're going to have a revolution the future revolutionary organisation or whatever will also have a fair amount of twats i'd have thought. Its not or shouldn't be about whether people are nice or not. and there are plenty of utter scum considering themselves left wing who shouldn't be involved near anything.

 

[littlebabyjesus]

Electrician = spiv?

More the idea that declaring a certain political persuasion for business reasons is spivvy.

 

[xenon]

More the idea that declaring a certain political persuasion for business reasons is spivvy.

I think I might be talking cross purposes a bit actually. Joining as opposed to just going to one occasionly for convenience sake.

 

[littlebabyjesus]

I think I might be talking cross purposes a bit actually. Joining as opposed to just going to one occasionly for convenience sake.

Yeah, he joined. To network.

 

[frogwoman]

People do that quite openly in the labour party tho. A couple of commentariat figures spring to mind

 

[Hocus Eye.]

What about someone who joined the labour club during the iraq war? Not having a dig btw but if we can't learn about who tory voters/supporters actually are then we wone able to run a bath never mind a fucking revolution.

The tories lost two elections and almost lost a third because they were disunited and constantly banging on about immigration, benefits and europe. They've learned from their mistakes, we need to learn from ours asap.

Frogwoman your last few posts make a lot of sense. I was completely mystified by the Labour failure at this election. You are helping me to understand what happened. Thank you. I am old enough to be your grandad but you have made me understand. You have made be believe in human nature and the next generation. Bless you.

 

[frogwoman]

Cheers, i wouldn't go that far myself as im still trying to understand it myself and failing but thanks

 

[xenon]

Yeah, he joined. To network.

TBF you did say "join" in your post I quoted having looked again.

It's late...

 

[Dogsauce]

Any pub or club serves as a networking place, cynics have suggested that's why there's been little attempt to stop so many of them closing down. The decline of political clubs parallels the wider loss of pubs and social clubs as communities are fractured and dispersed by neoliberalism, with short-term jobs and housing eroding settled neighbourhoods.

 

[Doctor Carrot]

Faced with two parties, both of whom share the same set of neoliberal, pro-austerity assumptions, it is little surprise that some people picked the one that seemed to know what it was doing, rather than the one that didn't.

I think this is on the money. Labour would probably still have lost with the other milliband for the same reasons, albeit with less of margin though as David Millband has more charisma and leadership qualities than Ed and that does factor.

When all that's on offer is the real thing or pale, spluttering replicas then why not choose the real thing? I also think that's why the lib dems were so comprehensively smashed and not for reasons of punishment. I'm only surprised they weren't even more comprehensively smashed than they were. Why their membership increased straight afterwards really is a mystery though!

 

[8ball]

... David Millband has more charisma and leadership qualities than Ed and that does factor.

To me, Ed seemed likeable and decent whereas his brother gives me the heebs.

 

[butchersapron]

To me, Ed seemed likeable and decent whereas his brother gives me the heebs.

anti-semitism.

 

[Doctor Carrot]

To me, Ed seemed likeable and decent whereas his brother gives me the heebs.

Yeah to you but to a lot of people he really was awkward and not prime ministerial quality. People were saying it time and time again and I don't think it was all down to tabloid manipulation. I think it's a relatively minor side issue as to why labour lost but I do think it played a role.

 

[8ball]

Yeah to you but to a lot of people he really was awkward and not prime ministerial quality. People were saying it time and time again and I don't think it was all down to tabloid manipulation. I think it's a relatively minor side issue as to why labour lost but I do think it played a role.

Yeah, it played a part due to being endlessly repeated. A lack of obvious sociopathic traits plays against you when going for the top job.

 

[Doctor Carrot]

Indeed it does.

 

[frogwoman]

The thing is too that there are plenty of people with the same visceral dislike of labour as many people have of tories and thatcherism. If you have done slightly better under the tories and have no memory of thatcher, but were screwed over by a labour government, lots of people in that position are going to vote tory. People remember the last labour govt and it wasnt exactly sweetness and light.

 

[frogwoman]

He was hopeless.

'These strikes are wrong' - the tories didnt make him come out with that shite.

 

[frogwoman]

The strikes are wrong while negotiations are still going on

 

[Belushi]

David Millband has more charisma and leadership qualities than Ed and that does factor.

 

[brogdale]

Yeah, it played a part due to being endlessly repeated. A lack of obvious sociopathic traits plays against you when going for the top job.

IMO much of the time he just seemed too desperate, and a couple of people that I've spoken to mentioned that they were put off by that thing he did...closing his eyes when in the middle of speaking. One said they thought it made him 'look dodge'. Small things...but...

The trouble with much of the post-mortem discussion is it's binary nature; which did the damage...the leader or the shite, wishy policy programme. It almost certainly was both.

 

[frogwoman]

Come on, he looked at best bland at worst ridiculous. There's a massive thread on here taking the piss out of the 'strikes are wrong' shit.

 

[DotCommunist]

The strikes are wrong while negotiations are still going on

'this gavernment has provoked them' a ringing endorsment indeed
tbf he's not the first labour leader to bail on supporting a strike. Turning up at the Durham Miners Gala to speak after though, brass neck

 

[frogwoman]

The strikes are wrong while negotiations are going on. And while negotiations are still going on I do believe these strikes are wrong. Both sides have got to drop the rthetoric, put aside their differences and get around the negotiating table...

 

[butchersapron]

Come on, he looked at best bland at worst ridiculous. There's a massive thread on here taking the piss out of the 'strikes are wrong' shit.

Putting this at milibands door is a cop-out.

 

[Doctor Carrot]

Was gonna did that bacon sarnie picture out in reply but found this much better shopped version instead.

 

[butchersapron]

Great - celeb politics.

 

[frogwoman]

Putting this at milibands door is a cop-out.

I agree tbh. Its not just him (and not just labour)

 

[Doctor Carrot]

Great - celeb politics.

It played a factor. It's like I was saying on another thread. We live in an image obsessed and shallow culture. I don't see a point in pretending that doesn't have an influence, however minor, on people's voting.

 

[butchersapron]

It played a factor. It's like I was saying on another thread. We live in an image obsessed and shallow culture. I don't see a point in pretending that doesn't have an influence, however minor, on people's voting.

david cameron ate a hot dog with a knife and fork. What process allowed that to not become thing but miliband eating a sarnie ineptly to become a thing? Shallow imgae obsessed people or something more... structural?

 

[Doctor Carrot]

david cameron ate a hot dog with a knife and fork. What process allowed that to not become thing but miliband eating a sarnie ineptly to become a thing? Shallow imgae obsessed people or something more... structural?

Indeed, you'll get no disagreement from me about it being structural but I seem to remember people saying milliband was weird, awkward, not prime ministerial material etc before any of the bacon sandwich bollocks. I think that sort of coverage just allowed it to roll on more easily and gave the press easier ammunition.