Malaysia Airlines Boeing 777 vanishes without trace

[Barking_Mad]

Interesting piece and somewhat alarming really...

That Malaysian MH370 can disappear over the ocean and nobody knows exactly where, or the Air France 447 flight over the Atlantic went down and it took months to find the black box, is just irresponsible on the part of aviation authorities. My own Citation, a private jet, has a GPS tracker so we always know where it is. It cost less than $1000. We also have a satellite phone that allows the pilots to call for help anywhere in the world on concrete problems they may face that the radio operator may not be able to solve. Those also cost around $1000.

And there is now Internet available to planes around in the world. But commercial planes, even when they have it for passengers, do not have it for pilots. And it is illegal to install equipment that is not approved by flying authorities around the world. Think of a product like the Dropcam and imagine it on all commercial aircraft showing ground personnel in real time everything that is happening in the cabin, cockpit and recording in real time, that combined with good communication with the pilots would make aviation much less of the black hole it is today.

http://english.martinvarsavsky.net/general/aviation-is-stuck-in-the-60s-a-reflection-on-mh-370.html

 

[Minnie_the_Minx]

Malaysian Military seem to think they've found something on the West Coast of the peninsular

 

[Barking_Mad]

The question on many minds is, how is it possible that with seemingly total coverage of the globe by satellite, a commercial jetliner could simply go missing?" While Malaysian aviation authorities at a news conference professed to be "puzzled" over what happened to the plane and the 239 people aboard, many experts were dismayed that long-awaited improvements to the industry's antiquated tracking system hadn't happened in time.

A system that would use satellites to beam an airliner's position and other vital information is not only possible—it's already being used on some planes. In fact, on long-haul routes that fly over the North Pole or the Pacific Ocean, where radar coverage can be iffy, the latest models from Boeing and Airbus are using data link communications to transmit GPS coordinates and status updates. Even if the bandwidth wouldn't allow large amounts of information, such as those contained in the black boxes, it could be vital to tracking down the aircraft itself.....

...The fact that airliners are already being equipped with systems to offer Wi-Fi access and cell phone connectivity suggests that it shouldn't be difficult to enhance the systems to replicate the recorders' functions. Goglia points out that modern airliners are equipped with complex avionics systems that monitor the plane's performance, the so-called 'health monitoring' systems that are designed to spot problems even before they become apparent to the crew or maintenance workers. In fact, these systems can beam ahead data to the plane's next destination, where a replacement part or other fix is waiting.

The technology is there; and now, with the ill-fated Malaysia flight as a cautionary tale, the urgency should be as well. In the meantime, the date to watch is the second week in April, by which time the recorders will either be found or not.

 

[Barking_Mad]

Interpol: suspect passengers 'probably not terrorists'
Noble played down speculation that the two Iranians were terrorists. “There has been great speculation about whether or not this was a terrorist attack,” he told reporters.

The Interpol chief added: “Already in the last 24 hours you see the story changing as the belief becomes more certain that these individuals were probably not terrorists.”

 

[Yu_Gi_Oh]

The poor families of the 'suspect' passengers. Not only to lose them like this, but to have the world speculating about their involvement.

 

[Minnie_the_Minx]

Anyone with knowledge of mobile phone networks explain why this is happening (as im sure there's a perfectly good explanation).



http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/missing-ma...r.it&utm_medium=social&utm_campaign=ibtimesuk

I did read something about it last night (or rather, early hours of this morning). Can't remember the details exactly, but something to do with being international calls and operators routing and trying to locate devices etc. Sorry, can't remember where I found the info

 

[Barking_Mad]

Malaysian Military seem to think they've found something on the West Coast of the peninsular

Malaysian military says found believed to wreckage of #MH370 near Pulau Perak a small island between M'sia and Sumatra in Strait of Malacca

location thought to be here: https://www.google.co.uk/maps/place/Pulau Perak/@5.6803566,98.9408874,7z/data=!4m2!3m1!1s0x304976135f4045a1:0xd79cd6ef07d5bb96

 

[Barking_Mad]

Although this might be confused with a report that this is simply where they were looking due to military radar picking it up here.

The search for Malaysian Airlines MH307 plane has been expanded to Sumatran waters, north of Straits of Malacca, as military radar may have detected the missing plane in the vicinity of Pulau Perak.

A Berita Harian report today quoted the Royal Malaysian Air Force (RMAF) as saying the plane may have reversed course further than expected while on its way from Kuala Lumpur to Beijing.

Air Force chief Rodzali Daud ( left ) is quoted as saying that based on military radar readings from its station in Butterworth, MH370 may have turned west after Kota Bahru and flew past the east coast and Kedah.

"The last time the plane was detected was near Pulau Perak, in the Straits of Malacca, at 2.40am," Berita Harian quotes Rodzali as saying.

This contradicts with earlier reports that the aircraft had disappeared from radar screens 120 nautical miles off Kota Bharu and over the South China Sea, at 1.30am on March 8.

 

[Minnie_the_Minx]

There were reported claims of a fisherman and another guy in Kelantan (the east coast) seeing a plane flying low, but I can't really make out what they were trying to explain. One said it was going towards Thailand (which would be possible if it was turning). The other explanation I couldn't quite make out as i couldn't find the guy's home location on the map but both seemed to be saying it was very low and not going in normal direction. The fisherman was less than 15 miles out to sea from what I could gather, but doesn't say the plane was directly overhead, so hard to tell where it was exactly

 

[Barking_Mad]

The location they are now looking and that the Malaysian Military claim they last say it on radar is way off its original flight path. However,

This is also supported with police reports made by some east coast residents, who claimed that they have seen huge lights and a plane flying at some 1000 metres above sea level off Kota Baru.

 

[Minnie_the_Minx]

Pulau Perak is a rocky outcrop, definitely not big enough for a plane to land on, so that will be a disappointment for all those people who seem to believe a plane could land on a remote island. A remote island with a landing strip big enough for a plane of that size

 

[Minnie_the_Minx]

The location they are now looking and that the Malaysian Military claim they last say it on radar is way off its original flight path. However,

I just said that about the east coast residents!

 

[Barking_Mad]

If you look on the map here it flew out from KL and then just off Kota Bharu where it was last picked up by standard aviation radar. From there, if reports are correct (people in the province of Kelatan reporting low flying plane at 1000m), it has done a large turn and gone back the other way, flying over the Malaca Straits before being last spotted by military radar.

Not much beyond there apart from masses of ocean.

 

[Minnie_the_Minx]

If you look on the map here it flew out from KL and then just off Kota Bharu where it was last picked up by standard aviation radar. From there, if reports are correct (people in the province of Kelatan reporting low flying plane at 1000m), it has done a large turn and gone back the other way, flying over the Malaca Straits before being last spotted by military radar.

Not much beyond there apart from masses of ocean.

Yeah, have seen the maps and looked at flight radar. I'm still trying to figure out where it may have turned. Of the two residents in Kelantan, one mentioned Bachok and the other I think was from Kuala Besar. I can't seem to figure out where Kuala Besar is though. Looks like it might be Kota Bharu though

 

[Barking_Mad]

Malaysian authorities have previously said flight MH370 disappeared about an hour after it took off from Kuala Lumpur for the Chinese capital Beijing.

At the time it was roughly midway between Malaysia’s east coast town of Kota Bharu and the southern tip of Vietnam, flying at 35,000 ft.

“It changed course after Kota Bharu and took a lower altitude. It made it into the Malacca Strait,” the military official, who has been briefed on investigations, told Reuters.

The Strait of Malacca, one of the world’s busiest shipping channels, runs along Malaysia’s west coast.

Earlier on Tuesday, Malaysia’s Berita Harian newspaper quoted air force chief Rodzali Daud as saying the Malaysia Airlines plane was last detected by military radar at 2:40 a.m. on Saturday, near the island of Pulau Perak at the northern end of the Strait of Malacca. It was flying at a height of about 9,000 metres (29,500 ft), he was quoted as saying.

A non-military source familiar with the investigations said the report was being checked.

“This report is being investigated by the DCA (Department of Civil Aviation) and the search and rescue team,” the source said. “There are a lot of such reports.”

The time given by Rodzali was an hour and 10 minutes after the plane vanished from air traffic control screens over Igari waypoint, midway between Malaysia and Vietnam.
There was no word on what happened to the plane thereafter.
If the reports from the military are verified, it would mean the plane was able to maintain a cruising altitude and flew for about 500 km (350 miles) with its transponder and other tracking systems apparently switched off.

Malaysia has extended the massive search operation for the plane to the Malacca Strait after initially focusing on the South China Sea.

 

[Minnie_the_Minx]

oh, I found it, further north of Bachok

 

[Barking_Mad]

Hopefully this will show where it made it to:

 

[Minnie_the_Minx]

Here's report from the KB residents

In his report, the owner of a fishing boat claimed that he saw an airplane flying low while he was at sea with a friend about 14.4km from Kuala Besar in Pantai Cahaya Bulan here at 1.30am on Saturday.

Azid Ibrahim, 66, said the aircraft was heading towards international waters.

According to him, the plane was flying so low that he could see the lights “as big as coconuts”.

He said he saw the aircraft with his friend Pak De while five other anglers were asleep in the boat.

In a report which appeared on a local English news portal, a man in Ketereh, 30km south of Kota Baru, claimed that he saw “bright white lights” which he believed to be that of an aircraft descending at high speed at 1.45am the same day the jetliner went missing.

Businessman Alif Fathi Abdul Hadi, 29, said he was in the compound of his home when he saw the aircraft flying low, heading for Bachok and descending fast.

He said he only found out about the missing jetplane the next day and decided to lodge a report at the Malaysian Maritime Enforcement Agency office in Tok Bali late Sunday evening.

 

[Minnie_the_Minx]

Hopefully this will show where it made it to:

It doesn't though. That's just how far Flight Radar managed to track it before it disappeared

 

[Barking_Mad]

Your linked report doesn't seem to tie in with the idea that it was spotted in the Malacca Straits by military radar. Nor that it blew up, but that it was descending quickly and seen flying at a low altitude. If it was heading for Bachok and flying low then i'd have thought it might have been seen by more people.

However the altitudes dont match. If it was flying at 30,000 ft when tracked by flight radar, then those two guys cant have seen it flying very low....

 

[Minnie_the_Minx]

This report doesn't seem to tie in with the idea that it was spotted in the Malacca Straits by military radar. Nor that it blew up, but that it was descending quickly and seen flying at a low altitude. If it was heading for Bachok and flying low then i'd have thought it might have been seen by more people.



http://www.thestar.com.my/News/Nati...o-report-seeing-lights-falling-at-high-speed/

Yeah, that's why I didn't put this up early this morning as I couldn't make sense of it. But then the guy in Kuala Besar says he saw it heading for Bachok, but heading from where, the sea?

He's located further south of Kota Bharu and Bachok. Can't really understand these accounts at all. Maybe fisherman saw it turn left (ie. northwards) and at some stage it did another left (ie. westwards), heading back towards the mainland?

 

[Barking_Mad]

From elsewhere:

"Another pilot flying a Boeing 777 heading for Japan was requested by Vietnam control tower to contact MH370 when the Vietnamese could not see the plane on their radar screen. The presumably Japanese pilot did manage to connect with MH370, and he said he there were static interferences but he was certain it was the co-pilot that was “mumbling” at the other end. Then he was disconnected. But why was the co-pilot mumbling?"

 

[Minnie_the_Minx]

Near to passing out?

 

[Minnie_the_Minx]

So, getting back to the fisherman

If he was above Bachok and he saw plane heading towards Thailand, maybe what the guy in Ketere saw, was the plane that had already turned around north of Kota Bharu, trying to head back towards Kuala Lumpur? Or maybe the fact that they're looking on the west coast suggests they decided to instead head for Langkawi or Penang airports, but totally overshot both, due to confusion from lack of oxygen or drugs or something (mumbling)?

 

[kebabking]

Near to passing out?

that would fit with what passes for the information we have - aircraft off track, no distress calls, gradual loss of altitude. all of that fits the crew being incapacitated, rather than a bomb, or a structural problem.

 

[2hats]

One should be a little cautious with eyewitness reports from untrained observers, particularly when events occur at night.

 

[Barking_Mad]

LOL Say what?

Azharuddin Abdul Rahman, Malaysian civil aviation chief, said earlier that the widened search includes northern parts of the Malacca Strait, on the opposite side of the Malay Peninsula and far west of the plane's last known location.

Mr Azharuddin would not explain why crews were searching there, saying rather cryptically, "There are some things that I can tell you and some things that I can't."

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worl...rash-live.html

 

[Minnie_the_Minx]

One should be a little cautious with eyewitness reports from untrained observers, particularly when events occur at night.

Yes I know, another reason why I didn't put story up in the early hours of this morning, although if it does appear the plane ended up on the west coast, then these reports could be correct.

Is worth pointing out though, that that area of Malaysia isn't exactly as busy as say somewhere like London, so differences in a flight may be noticed more. I realise as well just from looking out of my window at night that lower flying planes can look much brighter and faster.

As to Barking's question as to why more people didn't see the plane, it was early hours of the morning so probably asleep?

Not saying these reports are correct at all. Just looking into all possibilities

 

[Barking_Mad]

One should be a little cautious with eyewitness reports from untrained observers, particularly when events occur at night.

Quite true.

 

[Barking_Mad]

Yes I know, another reason why I didn't put story up in the early hours of this morning, although if it does appear the plane ended up on the west coast, then these reports could be correct.

Is worth pointing out though, that that area of Malaysia isn't exactly as busy as say somewhere like London, so differences in a flight may be noticed more. I realise as well just from looking out of my window at night that lower flying planes can look much brighter and faster.

As to Barking's question as to why more people didn't see the plane, it was early hours of the morning so probably asleep?

Not saying these reports are correct at all. Just looking into all possibilities

All good points.